We Catholics have to be witnesses that having LOTS of children is a blessing, not a burden.

I am going to talk with my four darlings about this and THEY will be part of the next generation of Catholics that witness to the Truth of love in large families.

Thanks for alerting me to this topic. I’m going to write this lady.

MY children will help to pay her social security one day!

In their advanced years these crones will serve as examples to others as their narcissism consumes them. Their end will find them alone in a house full of possessions that offer them no love, and if the collection wagon doesn’t come around soon enough, then they will unwittingly preform the only selfless act of their lives and become food for the roughly dozen cats and teacup poodles that live with them.

The phrase from the old poem ‘unwept, unhonored and unsung’ comes to mind.

I’m sorry, but I have little except scorn for such pompous garbage as this.

Wow!  That just totally turned my stomach.  Especially disturbing that they think women have children because they can’t think of something else to do!  How offensive!  Many of the things they talk about wouldn’t be an issue if HUMANS weren’t playing God. I also dispute the littering term—our large family is pretty green by comparison to the neighbors as witnessed by the number of cans on garbage pickup day!

As a repeat offender with 11 children, I am amazed by their callousness.  What stuns me is they say this with a straight face and do not seem able to admit someone else HAD THEM!  They, themselves, are ‘litter’ upon the this planet.  They can only defend their choice in having no children by criticizing and offending those of us who have.  As a bit of a litmus test on the morality of any choice - If your choice can only be justified by tearing down those who have chosen differently then your choice was probably wrong to begin with!  There is nothing wrong in not having children but how you got to that point is where you risk your very soul.

As an infertile woman who wants to have children more than anything and can’t, this infuriates me.  I honestly don’t know what to say other than they’re just sad, sad women and I’ll be praying for them.

Around the 3:10 mark, Professor Fisher, of the Center for *Human* Evolution Studies, says that for *billions* of years we’ve been having one or two children.  Brilliant.

The only relief, on a somewhat positive note, is that their genes won’t replicate into the future, and they will fade rapidly from memory. In Charity however we might hope that they repent of their choices and their statements.

Wonder what she’d say had her mother decided to “take out the trash” the day she was born.

As a Rutgers alum who was an Evolutionary Anthropology Major, I am not surprised by Prof. Fisher’s statements. They seem to mirror many of the Professors’ liberal sentiments at the University, as well as those of many other state colleges.

But parents, have some hope, even at RU there is a beautiful, budding, orthodox Catholic community, thanks to the priests from the Oratory and the Brothers of Hope. The Catholic Center provides the perfect place for students who “know better” than their professors to come together and support each other while resisting the liberal indoctrination seen at so many colleges now-a-days.

RU - rah - rah!

They shall reap what they sow. I am saddened by women like these who have bought the lie fed to them in the 1060’s taht Motherhood was worthless and fullfilling. Motherhood is the hardest, most noble, and most necessary job any woman could have. I envy all the married women who can have children. I have always wanted 12 children but God has not sent me a husband yet and at my age I realize that being married and having any children may never be for me. Larger families are generally greener than smaller for they can’t through money away. Big Business wants people to have less children so they have more disposable income to waste on things they don’t really need.

Woops. I ment to type 1960’s.

Yes, Maggie, I was wondering about that!  That was back in the day of William the Conqueror!

These women represent the worst in American society.  They are so caught up in self-adoration it is almost impossible to watch them without gagging.  Their secular humanist views are what fuels all manner of hedonistic and immoral behavior in society today.  After all these three people present themnselves as somekind of authority on societal behavior when in reality they are just…..noise…...

I hope the three of them have followed their own advice not to have children.

God Bless,

Iowa Mike

It’s shocking how they congratulate people for living a “childless” life of freedom.  Noting the choice to have children should be well before they achieve things or “grow up”.  Then, they note that if people later decide to have children, they have to make sacrifices.  In our culture, sacrifice is a four-letter word.  While I’ll admit that sacrifice for one’s children can be hard, it is also certainly worth it!  I wouldn’t trade my place as Mom to 4—with one on the way—for any career or position of power!!

I am not sure people listening to Joy Behar should reproduce. I hate to say it but do you really want more people on earth like her?. Sorry just walked away from my Catholic beliefs into dream land for a moment.

I know multiple families of 8, 10, 14…who live in houses smaller than Oprah and probably Joy Behar. Heck, Oprah has huge houses all over the place. It’s just so laughable to me that they honestly believe that families that live modestly, with few material possessions and quite often *gasp* HAND-ME-DOWNS, are having a more detrimental effect on the environment than a family of 3 with a house 10 times bigger than they need full of the latest and greatest in all things material.

But then again, I’m Catholic so I’m clearly incapable of understanding these obvious principles and the world will probably end because I plan to have more than 1.2 children.

Don’t get me wrong - I’m an environmentalist all the way. I’m not saying we don’t have a responsibility as stewards of the earth God gave us. But it’s most definitely NOT the fact that the population is growing that’s having such a detrimental impact on the earth.

What this professor said is despicable, to say the least.  And as a wife to an alumni, sister to three graduates and friend of DOZENS of former Rutgers students, well let me assure you this professor is not isoolated in her anti-family, anti-Catholic beliefs.  However, it is wrong to suggest that for this reason alone a parent should not consider Rutgers University as an option for their Catholic child.  the campus ministry there is vibrant and growing,  The Brotherhood of Hope is in the heart of the church and challenging the students to seek their faith and go deeper.  My husband had a conversion and I can name at least ten people who converted to the Catholic church as a DIRECT result of the campus ministry at RU.

I know dozens of good solid married couples who love out the faith of the church and practice NFP, and yes, are littering the earth with big families, because of the formation they received from the Catholic campus ministry at RU.  My youngest brother is still actively involved and I take my kids to the campus mass sometimes because I am so inspired by the way these young people are living out their faith.

I’d call it natural selection.  ;)

“How can you say there are too many children? That is like saying there are too many flowers. (Mother Teresa)”

If we follow linguistic logic, this woman referred to children as garbage. Any time anyone refers to other humans beings as garbage, we are in exceptionally dangerous territory. I cannot believe that this was allowed to air, when I think of it that way.

If someone went on air and called people from another culture or religion or rage “garbage,” there would be a backlash so immense it would be front-page news. It’s so sad, and so scary, that saying it about children is acceptable. In my studies, I do a lot of work researching societal views of what a child is and means to us, because it’s a fluid definition, and it’s scary to think of the way it’s going lately.

To Mike, the second poster: Please don’t start bashing old childless women in general and saying that they will have miserable lonely lives in their twilight years. God grants life. We don’t make it or choose it. He doesn’t grant children to everyone, even those who love children, so please remember that.

My Ecology and Evolution professor at the University of Iowa said that the best thing we could do for the planet is to have no more than one child.  I got the top grade in the class, graduated, and will soon deliver my ninth.

It’s time to let them know that we are the proud, unapologetic, pro-life producers of the next generation of tax payers.

A fellow church member who works with the Social Security Administration, constantly “thanks” me for having more than 1.2 children.  He praises me as helping to make the whole system work…and I only have 4 kids.

Why does he not just terminate his own ‘junk’ gas passing body—for the common good.

Fortunately , Behar’s hate screed is seen by even less than watch MSNBC

I am praying for them.  Joy has been on my prayer list for a bit.  Our country, as a whole, needs our prayers. The youth, especially, since it is on them to bring things around, and good parents, good schools, including colleges, are much needed.  Thank God there are some very good really Catholic colleges to choose from!

It is very sad to hear these worldly intelligent women speak about and influence others over something they have little knowledge. They seem to feed on one another! Once again it comes down to what you see as success in life.  I looked up success and it is defined as: the achievement of something desired, planned, or attempted.  Some see living in love as being successful and do all that is proper and necessary to live in that love.  What a real gift it is to know of this love ...........some have not yet come to know this and don’t know where to go to find it.  Let us show this by our words and actions so that others can see and believe that this is true success.

How very sad that our society has stooped this low. And to Lynn, God will bless you and give you much love in your life ~with or with out the children you hope for one day. I have more children in heaven than I have here on earth and I will ask all my children to remember you in their prayers. And Gods will be done, perhaps one day, you will ask a child of yours to pray for us. I wish you much happiness!(I have a friend who is adopting her third child).

Lots of brainwashed Catholic children grow up to be brainwashed Catholic adults = more money in the collection plate.  Get it?

Sandra, you’re incorrect. Catholic laymen are notorious for being poor collection plate givers.  The Baptists and the Mormons give way more than we do.

We want more children because we value life made in the image and likeness of God.

BTW, Dr. Fisher has a website if any wish to visit it

www.helenfisher.com

Her thought is interesting.

The Zeitgeist will change 180 degrees within a decade or so. The Total Fertility Rate of the World in general and the US in particular is falling. And without an adequate number of children, there is no way standards of living can be maintained, tax revenues generated, and the elderly cared for. This “litter”, as it is referred to, will be worth more than Gold in the near future.

My 19 year old daughter is a sophomore at a (genuinely) Catholic University.  She has discerned her vocation as a wife and mother.  According to her, she wants to have “at least six” children.

Her generation will bury these narcissistic, self indulgent, 60’s generation burn outs and all who were stupid enough to listen to them.

Babies are good.

But these folk don’t get that. Why don’t they?

Well, first, they don’t believe in eternal life. If (assuming salvation) you’re going to spend more than four hundred trillion years in perfect bliss, what difference does it make if you suffer a bit during an eighty-year stint on earth? Especially if some of that suffering can be turned to the benefit of yourself or of others by sacrificing it to Our Lord, with the intention offsetting the temporal penalties of sin? In such a worldview, suffering is both meaningful and a “light and passing affliction” (to use St. Paul’s phrasing).

But if this life is all you get, and if suffering is meaningless and a thing to be avoided at all costs? Why, then, you gotta maximize your pleasure principle, by Mammon! You gotta get rich enough to maximize leisure and avoid physical pain as much as possible. If you get too sick to recover, you gotta get that morphine overdose so you can go out with a smile. You gotta have stuff—lots of it, and high-quality, and very beautiful—and keep it from being broken by little fingers. You gotta have all the adult channels and Skinemax on your cable provider, without worrying about teenagers in the house. You gotta take trips to exotic destinations on a moment’s notice. You gotta have romantic evenings out without worrying about a babysitter. You gotta keep your perfect figure.

This world’s idea of “the good life” simply has no room for babies.

This is why, when paganism degenerates into demon worship, pagans start exposing their babies and passing their children through the fire. Moloch of the Carthaginians is just the logical extension and final destination of Joy Behar and Company’s worldview. The Carthaginians were a wealthy, businesslike, leisure-focused, work-hard-play-hard society, too.

to Cricket:

I was not bashing everyone that doesn’t have children. I was only bashing those who are like the subjects of this article.

To Sandra Currie:

You sound like you’re now up to three cats.

My mother had a simple wisdom on the pro-life issues.
Sooner or later pro-life wins because the other side doesn’t have enough children to make up the difference.

I often think that people like this aren’t so worried about overpopulation as they are worried about the lower class having “too many” children. I think we’ve come a long way toward equality, but the lower class is still looked upon as skungy and dirty and criminal. And the lower class often have multiple children into really unhealthy environments - yet seeing the children as the litter, rather than the lives these people are leading as unwise - they are so wrongly focused. I also believe they look down on people who do things that are seen as threatening (read: thinking for themselves) while having many children. For example: people of faith.

They listen to what is fed to them for information about population and yet completely ignore the statistics about European countries paying for women to have babies so they can maintain a population.

And they admit in front of everyone, that the choice not to have children has a lot to do with having lived their own life and then not wanting to make a lifestyle change. If it requires change from us ... change that is difficult, why would we want to do it unless it is a popular change (like bringing your own grocery bags to the store)? The only change a lot of people are willing to make is that which makes them look better in the eyes of those they approve of.

In addition, they don’t seem to speak against in vitro itself. I think they would prefer that any woman with more than one fertilized embryo in her should get rid of the rest ... murder their own children.

It “looks” as if they want good for the world, but the comments from these women make it seem as if they really would rather not have a kid with the flu making them miss their manicure appointment.

from,
the largest family on our road with the smallest trash can and not even bothering to use the local school services which we pay for thus leaving 5 fewer children in our local classrooms

I think the childless couples should pay higher taxes. In liberal Germany the courts ruled this because childless couples are not providing future taxpayers and thus are not being good citizens and the court specifically said they were being selfish. Now if one were naturally infertile, this would encourage adoption.

In Reply to LBJ:

I think we can achieve the right impact (like they’re trying to do in Germany) through child credits combined with slightly higher income taxes to offset the lost revenue.

And we can encourage families to stay together and encourage the one-mommy, one-daddy household if we’re careful about how we do it.

I’d suggest Annual Tax Credits along the following lines:

Family w/1 dependent child, single-parent home: $3,000
Family w/1 dependent child, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $5000

Family w/2 dependent children, single-parent home: $5,500
Family w/2 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $9,500

Family w/3 dependent children, single-parent home: $7,500
Family w/3 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $13,500

Family w/4 dependent children, single-parent home: $9,000
Family w/4 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $17,000

Family w/5 dependent children, single-parent home: $10,000
Family w/5 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $20,000

Family w/6 dependent children, single-parent home: $11,000
Family w/6 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $22,500

Family w/7 dependent children, single-parent home: $12,000
Family w/7 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $24,500

Family w/8 dependent children, single-parent home: $13,000
Family w/8 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $26,000

Family w/9 dependent children, single-parent home: $14,000
Family w/9 dependent children, two-parent (1 mom, 1 dad) home: $27,000

TO SUM UP: Couples who choose to raise children ought not be financially penalized for it as they are today, but should rather thrive while their children are in the house. As children leave home, the tax credits would drop. As families have more and more children, the tax credit should decrease on a per-child basis, but never drop below $1000 per child.

And the credit values should be indexed to inflation.

Now that, by itself, would not produce a child-friendly culture, a “culture of life.” But it would be a good start.

(I’d also add that the Motion Picture ratings system should be governed by a body consisting not of filmmakers, but of parents with children under 10 in their houses. But that’s getting into a different topic….)

These women are so out of whack!  They will never fully understand that the most important legacy and contribution to this world it being a mother, a giver of life.  Raising loving, caring, intelligent, and responsible children is the noblest of all professions, not to mention the most challenging.  They are so concerned with promoting their own selfish agendas, climbing the ladder to success, making money, being famous, etc. all the while passing up on the greatest treasure of all - children.  I feel sorry for them, because when they get old and have to look back on their lives, what will they really have contributed to the world? A mom on the other hand, will have a legacy that continues in her children.

@R.C. You have my vote! Where do I sign?
For the rest of you with a sympathetic ear- when you hear this kind of stuff, I beg you to pray for us- pray for those of us with the extreme sport style of mothering- I have 13 living children ( THANK YOU, JESUS!). This is a type of trial by ordeal in ways one can never conceptualize until you go through it. And in our current society the hostility and persecution are intense. Sadly, even parish life is something of a cross for the large family because be default they have a system structured to meet the needs of most of our society which does not often include the double digit family. Catholic women with alot of children really need prayer and support- and my heartfelt gratitude to everyone who responded here with understanding!

I don’t want children, that’s my choice.  I don’t judge people with children so don’t judge women who choose not to have them.  get over yourselves with your holier than thou attitudes. my husband and I feel the same way. It’s not selfish of us. Its not to give us extra disposable income. its a choice we made because we feel its for the best . I don’t want my child to grow up in a society like ours today. People are too judgmental hateful and violent.

The Catholic Church can be criticized for many reasons, many of which are valid.
However, and I am saying this as a non-believer, it NEVER supported eugenics, euthanasia or population control.  As far as I know, it is the only such
institution in the Western world.

We belong to God, not ourselves. Selflessness, not selfishness. Something not easily grasped in the world today. People who live in the dark choose to live in the dark, and as God has pointed out many times in scripture, that’s where they’ll remain.

@hilary ... really and truly, if you choose not to have children ... that’s not actually what we’re talking about here. It has everything to do with comments like the fact that my choice to have them is littering the world. It’s so derogatory to treat children (tomorrow’s future) in that way. If you have chosen not to have them, that’s really a completely differen conversation.

She was referring to women who take fertility drugs and have an abnormal amount of children at once.  This is akin to littering.  She was not talking about women who have many children in a natural manner, seperate pregnancies.

Please Garrett Hardin’s essay “The Tragedy of the Commons” (online. Science, 1968). 1. Value is determined by supply and demand. This is not a principle of capitalist economics or even human economics; it is a fact of life. 2. Therefore, a world in which human life is precious is a world in which human life is scarce. 3. The Earth’s human population cannot grow without limit. 4. The Earth’s human population will stop growing when either: a) the birth rate falls to meet the death rate, or b) the death rate rises to meet the birth rate. 5. The Earth’s maximum possible instantaneous human population is greater than its maximum possible sustainable human population. 6. The Earth’s maximum possible sustainable human population leaves little room for wilderness or large non-human terrestrial vertebrates. Where do you disagree?

Liberals like the professor are exemplars of the current crop of self-described leaders of the culture…elitist, Eurocentric, and Malthusian. Academia is full of them. The tragedy is that anyone who has, or is currently getting, a college education (with the exception of a few institutions of higher learning) has been told over and over that this is the correct world view.

Disgusting. In future articles please include all the contact information for Rutgers so we can tell the President to ask her to apologize or better yet show her the door.

You can contact the professor at www.helenfisher.com

Find the link for “contact.”

@Malcolm Kirkpatrick: As Catholics, we would disagree with “Value is determined by supply and demand.”

Price of goods is (mostly) determined by supply and demand.

Inherent human worth is a right given by God and cannot be taken away by any human being, only disrespected and spit upon.

Jenica Purisima,
  Human evolution evolves according to the Intelligent Design of our CREATOR. Without out CREATOR, the first Mover, nothing moves, lives, grows or evolves. Write a book about it. And remember Supreme Court Justice? Ruth Bader Ginsberg is a former Rutgers professor of law. Ginsberg tried to legalize prostitution for every fourteen year old girl in America. Rutgers University started as a seminary. Henry Rutger is turning over in his grave at the Dutch Reformed Chuch in Millstone.

WOW!  I have kids because I cannot think of anything else to do?!?  I am sick….
These women are just so pitiably sad…. They have NO IDEA, and unfortunately, they likely never will….
Let us all pray for them.  They obviously need our prayers and for God to open their hearts….  They will, at some point, realize just how wrong they are, and I hope and pray that it is before they have died and are facing the Final Four….

I often feel vaguely guilty for having a large family.  Between child tax credits, working family income supplements, and child benefits, the Canadian government not only reimburses my family for all of the taxes collected, but pays me money to raise my five children in a two parent, single-income family.

America allows Free Speech. And God Bless America for doing so.

However, God HAVE MERCY on us for allowing these women to be “respected” for the crap they spewed on this show.

There’s a very, very large population in the United States that will be dying off very soon. And at our current rate, our population is set to become smaller and smaller as they begin dying off. Why? Because in their parent’s day, having children was a good thing. And in their day, being married was a good thing. And in their day, WOMEN RAISING CHILDREN was a good thing!!

Today, women have destroyed the so called “male dominated society” and by doing so have destroyed womanhood. Today it’s all about having your own career, leaving your children alone with strangers (daycare) and becoming successful. It’s about having “rights” and power over your own life. In reality, ‘women’ in our society have given themselves over the the devil. They’ve enslaved themselves to money, wealth, esteem, careers, sexuality, and other such things.

Proverbs 31 tells us what God believes a Noble and Virtuous woman looks like. Quite frankly, there aren’t very many of those left in our society. At least none that we ever see or hear about! It’s become a “shame” to be a truly noble woman in our age.

“Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting;
  but a woman who fears the LORD is to be praised.”

@Richard Bell:

God Bless You!!! In 30 years you’ll be the reason anyone in Canada still pays taxes. With so many people NOT having children, God fearing people MUST continue to have children if we intend for people to still exist.

Look at it this way. God told us to subdue the earth, He told us to multiply. He gave us marriage as a means to procreate and create more children for Him! You sir, tax credits or not, are doing what the Lord Commanded you to do.

Government exists to serve and protect its people. And no government on this earth exists outside of God allowing it to do so. Allow God to bless and feed you through tax credits and childcare. For those children are His as much as yours, and every hair upon their heads is accounted for in Heaven.

May God continue to bless you, your wife, and your children.

Nothing but dried up old Hags!  These narcissistic old bags should never be able to be able to appear in PUBLIC!

Joy Behar - yuk!  Why would anyone listen to, watch, or have anything to do with her version of life.  She hates the Catholic Religion and professes to know enough to disparage anything related to it.  Everything that comes out of her mouth is filled with hatred.  She is one nasty lady and I can’t believe she has any following at all…but she does. What is this world coming to? God help us!

Hilary’s post reminded me of a poem I wrote after my daughter was born:

Courage and Cowardice

When cowardice wants to cover its shame
it borrows the raiment of sacrifice

puffs its bony chest in the breastplate
full of imaginary muscles

It watches eagle-eyed mothers standing sentry at swings
distributing snacks with egalitarian solemnity
re-zipping jackets mysteriously unzipped

says “I don’t want to bring children into this world”
places a seal on its belly,
turns the earth into an old age home

Courage is a girl, six weeks pregnant
two minutes aware of it
trembling on uncertain knees
“Be it done unto me according to thy word”

Believing in God and having children is the best way to learn that you are not the center of the universe.

My wife and I have one, and probably won’t have any more, but not for lack of trying. We suffer with chronic secondary infertility, and while I’m fielding very personal and tacky questions from the one side (“Are you going to have any more?”),  we get glares from faithful Catholics who have come to their own conclusions about our reproductive health decisions. My wife wrote about our triple-cross here:

http://lydiapurpuraria.wordpress.com/2010/10/20/when-youre-not-quite-right/

Mr. Wac, I read your wife’s blog about secondary infertility and the crosses you both bear.  Your wife is a great writer, and she conveys wonderfully her faithful Catholic point of view.

I have four children- had my last at 42, and thought my fertility would last forever. Well, it hasn’t. We’d love to have more children, but they aren’t coming- yet.  I never lose hope!

Also, I would adopt if I could convince my husband.

I think that you, your wife, and child are greatly blessed. Thanks for your witness.

My question is, especially to those who say that they don’t want to “bring children into the world”.  How is not having children going to make the world a better place? How is robbing the world of potential doctors to cure diseases, scientists to figure out viable solutions to pressing problems, nurses, counselors and priests to help those in need, musicians and artists to create beauty, teachers to educate, journalists to inform…how is that going to make the world a better place?  How is contributing to the burden of a caring for a large aging population on the back of a smaller young population going to make the world better?  How is depriving stagnating societies of the creative, spiritual renewal that youth brings going to make the world better?  How is exchanging new life for aging and death, love for loneliness, self-sacrifice for self interest, innocence for jaded cynicism, going to make the world a better place? There is no logic in it. 

Another point:  These tend to be the same people who regularly insist that individual personal choices affect everyone, which is why in their view everyone HAS to reduce carbon emissions, recycle, eat organic, not smoke etc. etc. etc.  So why suddenly do they get all up in arms when someone suggests that choosing to not have children is going to have a detrimental affect on society at large.  Suddenly, then and only then they become indignant and scream “It’s my personal choice! You Must Respect It!”

An interesting question methinks

You have misquoted me.  What i said was “people regard that as littering.” I was reporting.  And indeed many Americas do regard having a great many children at the same time as upsetting to our society.  I hope you remember the recent case of a woman who delivered 8 babies at once, with almost no financial stability.  Americans want responsible parenting.  We want families that can provide more than just food and shelter—parents who can give their children the love, time, attention, education and the resources our young need to make their way in society.  YOU are spreading a rumor about me that is not true. And to bring Rutgers into your smearing is utterly tasteless. Please be part of the solution, rather than the problem.  If you are a gentleman, you might even apologize.  Helen Fisher

Helen, there isn’t misquoting going on ... the link to the report itself was right there. We heard you for ourselves. And while it was said in the context of multiple births resulting from multiple embryo implantation, it directly relates to the value of human life, no matter the timing - especially since the conversation had turned overtly to what ya’ll bill as overpopulation ... so it was obviously not about multiple embryo implantation ... it was about your opinion of people having more children than you are personally comfortable with based on the information you have received and your personal valuing of human life. 

I wouldn’t consider this “reporting” ... this was billed 100% as personal opinion and a personal interview and personal discussion. Anyone watching it would know that. I’m not so sure which statistics and whose researched opinions you were “reporting” other than your own and your perceptions.

Perhaps parents will do a great more of what is necessary when what is spread around is valuing of life.

Ms. Fisher,
I provided the full context of your quote by providing the video.  Your claim of being misquoted is without merit.

Despite your use of the obfuscatory “people regard,” the opinion being expressed is clearly your own.  If there was any question about that, your comment clears that right up.  Thank you.

Ok, so the littering comment was a little harsh, but is that really all you guys got out of that segment? Seriously? Where is your open mind? Do you have to assume everything that doesn’t necessarily align wil your personal or religious opinion is evil?

All they were trying to say is that it’s OK for women to not want to have children as much as men typically don’t, or at least as much as people tend to assume men don’t. Not all men want to be childless, and not all women want to be mothers. The point was to state that it’s OK for women to feel that way.

These women never said all women should believe that they shouldn’t have kids, nor did they say that all women should have 2 or less. They said people like the Octomom and “John and Kate” (or now just Kate) shouldn’t be littering their children’s lives all over the tv and internet for profit. The point was that Octomom can’t really take care of that many by herself very easily and she ends up leaving them on society. That’s not right either, is it?!?! Sheesh, people… Get a grip and listen for once!!

First of all, definitely ... there were some very rude people posting in an attacking fashion. I don’t condone that and did not agree with them. I don’t like attitude. I see where it comes from on every side, but I think it’s awful and rude. I try to post in such a way that the person I am speaking about could be having coffee across from me. Which, btw, I would love to do ... if you’re ever in my part of the country! And I also don’t read here. I linked from somewhere else, so I don’t know what the normal tone of the writer and the commenters is.

I think when the conversation was sticking with the option of going childless ... it still bounded into a lot of territory of which most people are highly unaware (the eugenic history of birth control, actually). So it’s not simply a choice, it’s a choice which has an entire history behind it, an entire social viewpoint, and an effect on future generations. Our ability to make a particular choice really isn’t a reason why we ought to or not. Our technology shouldn’t be a determining factor of “right”. (I am not saying it’s wrong to not have children ... just speaking only about technology making things “right”)

But, as you said, if the conversation had stayed within those bounds, it might have been a bit more acceptable. But the conversation was “littered” :) with comments that showed a host of issues behind them ... someone commenting in derogatory tone about men and their need to pass on their name “It’s always about the name”, deciding that women had children because they had nothing better to do, overpopulation (which is highly suspect, btw), large families ruining the environment (have the women who commented about that in the video seen how large families actually live?), and the comment that for billions of years we had one or two children per family (and I am honestly not at all , sure from where in the world that statistic originated!).

Although I am not a Catholic, I was strongly impressed by reading through this thread.  Excellent commonsense!

Helen Fisher and her despicable type are *human-haters* pure and simple.  That is what worship of “the planet” is all about.  And you are all quite correct to fear these people: they are monsters.  They are sinister. 

I say this as a born atheist.  And yet everyday I see more wisdom in the old religions, and I’m particularly impressed by Catholics.  They seem to have a sense of proportion about life, and a sense of what is truly good. 

Thanks for allowing my comment here.  Please fight these monsters of “the progressive movement.”  For they are truly evil.  Surprises me to use that world.—

Pat Archbold, the video shows that the professor was reporting on how some people view the issue.  Specifically, she reported: “now people regard that as littering”.  She did not say it was her view or that it was the school’s view or that it was the correct view.  You say “everyone on the panel seems to agree”, but what they’re seemingly agreeing with is the notion that some people have such a view, not that they themselves agree with it.  To the extent that some people have such a view, she was reporting truthfully.  Perhaps you find the truth “offensive”, but the truth will set you free.

@JP
You can criticize the Catholic Church all your little heart desires, but I dare you to rationally invalidate one thing it teaches. It is not a product of man, it is a product of God’s grace, of love and faithfulness. Is that what you’d like to criticize?

@n/a:

Glad to hear that you’re enjoying the reasoned discussion!

But you gotta watch out: An atheist, if he wants to keep his atheism, can successfully make it through a whole lifetime without hearing certain parts of his assumptions challenged, so long as he’s just careful to not read the wrong books or essays.

But if you keep hanging ‘round here, thinking we’re making sense, you run the danger of reading something dangerous to your atheism! So watch out.

In particular you want to avoid any of C.S. Lewis’s adult-level works (“Mere Christianity,” “Miracles,” “Problem of Pain,” or any of his books of essays), Ed Fesser’s “Aquinas for Beginners” and “The Last Superstition,” Stanley Jaki’s stuff, some of William Lane Craig’s stuff (especially the “Creatio Ex Nihilo” book with Paul Copan), Chesterton’s “Everlasting Man,” and any of Peter Kreeft’s stuff.

You also want to steer clear of the Catholic Catechism, or anything that makes the weirder, darker bits of the Bible intelligible by viewing it through the “lens of Sacred Tradition.” You must give those a wide berth.

I’m giving you this advice for your own good, friend. Popular culture and academia are usually pretty reliable at keeping people away from dangerous trains of thought. One could watch television for whole days and never see anything that questioned our century’s assumed dogmas.

But around these forums, and in the wrong parts of the bookstore, there are irrefutable syllogisms and frustratingly reasonable philosophical arguments lying in wait. An atheist cannot be too careful.

;)

When people criticise the panelists independent of the hosting network CNN, it concerns me that implicit in the condemnation is indifference to the offending network. If we boycotted every news outlet that promulgated anit-God narratives, you would see less and less of this over time.

Why have we allowed companies to get away with assasinating the family, the unborn and the consitution? Why don’t we create a severe penalty for those who host such people?

@Christy:
My genetics professor encouraged us to have a lot of kids so we could see how genes are expressed in the family. Another biology professor went to Mass every Sunday and his boy was an altar server. One time he gave us a reading assignment about embryo development in which the mother made a choice to keep her unplanned baby. I did not think much at these things then, but now I see that maybe there was some kind of pro-life conspiracy, since I went to a pretty liberal liberal arts college…:-)

True, Ms. Fisher chose words that did not accuse her of believing children (under whichever specific circumstances) are litter, but the average adult has experienced conversation enough (with everything that is told in tone, delivery, and body language) to know that the littering statement was, at the very least, not offensive to the panel and the aire in their laughter was that of agreement with the sentiment of the statement, even if they wouldn’t use the word “litter” themselves.  Agreed to previous poster that if the subject hadn’t been children, but had instead been a particular race of people these same women would have likely never laughed the same way… instead you would have seen heads nodding “no” and statements about how terrible it is someone would use the word “litter” in reference to a particular people.  Joy Behar would have walked off the stage fuming, as we’ve seen her do before in defense of Muslims.  Ms. Fisher, if the subject of the litter in your quote had been of a race of people your tone wouldn’t have been lighthearted, it would have been cautious and uncomfortable.  The comfort in your tone in the video shows us your comfort with the statement, that is why we hold you accountable for the point of view.

I think having the prediliction to be childless is ultimately a self-limiting activity. Those who don’t have as many children or have no children will ultimately be outbred by those who do.  Evolution posits that the winners in the evolutionary race are those who have the most kids.

A lot of women these days are choosing not to have kids so they can pursue careers and money and fame or some particular lifestyle etc.  They use these extra resources to push the population limiting agenda popular right now in the neoliberal circles.

But she is right. Having more children only increases to the amount of litter and littering activity of today.

se my article about the matter

at www.environmentinfocus.com

http://environmentinfocus.com/archives/44

Daniel Esteban
“writer and edtitor with focus towards environmental problems and issues”

Thiss article was written to anger both parties. These parties are the mother’s and fathers and those who can’t bear kids. Everyone needs to relax,in the end we all have our own opinions whether you like to share that or not is your choice. I’m the latter , I don’t care if I have kids or not. Now, if i do , good! Let’s not be smug about it people!! I’m referring to both sides. Suck it up and have a good cup ” shut the f@#k up”
Age17
Hoorah
Seller fin