You bible-clinging gun-clutchers need to shut up and go back to sleep.

Your Emperor demands it.

@John Proffitt - Extremely well said, my friend!  Universal Healthcare is socialism, the HHS mandate is marxism.  What the administration did today, I believe, may have striped the Church and religious institutions grounds to sue by shifting the onus to insurance providers. 

It’s time to petition Congress to initiate impeachment proceedings indeed.

hilariously inaccurate

It’s a measure of the naivete and ignorance of the American public and the duplicitous nature of Mr. Obama that his statements could be entertained by any sentient person.

1.  Nothing is free
2.  All of these “services” are provided by human beings or drug      
providers who require payment from some source.
3.  An insurance company will not “eat” the cost the human beings or drug providers charge.
4.  The cost must be covered by the premium the participant (employee) and sponsor (employer) pay.
5.  Most of the entities in question - Catholic Dioceses, charities, universitites, hospitals, etc. are self funded or self insured for health benefits.
6.  That means there is no “insurer” in effect.  So nothing has been accomplished by this sleight of hand.  The CHurch is still forced to pay the bill and provide the “service”.

Mr. Obama has Pearl Harbored the Catholic Church while the Bishops played the role of a guiless Neville Chamberlain.

We need to declare war and start actively working to spread the word and oust this evil from power.

Abolish the Catholic Health Association (CHA) and its leader Sister Carol Keehan. They are willing accomplices in this evil.
http://www.chausa.org/Pages/Newsroom/Releases/2012/Catholic_Health_Association_is_Very_Pleased_with_Todays_White_House_Resolution_that_Protects_Religious_Liberty_and_Conscience_Rights/

Jimmy’s post isn’t very clear to me.  The “American people” ALREADY are “forced” to “pay for abortion drugs, sterilizations, and contraception”, whether we recognize it or not, and always have.  We are all participants in “the shell game”.  We have been for a long time.  Everyone subsidizes everyone and everything else, at some level or another, even if we don’t fully recognize it.  We all subsidize insurance companies and contraception in some way.  So too does God, according to Catholic Church teaching.  Even if I personally don’t buy any insurance policy whatsoever, I’m still subsidizing insurance companies and contraception by my participation in an economy that supports insurance companies and contraception.  Even the money I’ve put into the church collection basket has also perhaps been used for evil purposes, and I can feel like a “sucker” for contributing to it.  Do I need to stop putting money into the basket too?  I heard that it’s called remote material cooperation, and that it can be permissible and not a sin.  Exactly why then do I “need to oppose this plan”?  Do I need to oppose the collection basket too?  According to Catholic Church teaching, God “loves all things that exist” and that would seem to include “this plan” just as “all things that exist” includes “this plan”.  So why should I too not also love “this plan”?  Would someone please explain this?

“If you like your healthcare plan, you can keep it” would still be true, but you might not like your healthcare plan after it’s been changed.  I say this because the President never said insurance companies wouldn’t have to change their plans to accommodate the new law.  Everyone ought know the new law has new requirements for insurance companies and who/what they must cover under their plans.  For example, under the new law, the plans will have to cover pre-existing conditions, I was told.  If that’s so, I don’t think it’s fair to pretend that the President was claiming that no plan would have to change in any way.  That wouldn’t be a fair interpretation of his statement.

If there is anyone reading this who voted for Barack Obama, you need to *run* to confession right now, lest you die in your state of mortal sin and spend the rest of eternity burning in the fires of hell.  I know it may be hard for you to believe, but the blood of Christ can wash away *even this* sin.  God’s name is Mercy.

EVIL AT WORK….........

Well what could possibly be the problem Sr Carol Keehan said everything was fine now.  She’s getting a new pen and everything.

Here is what I don’t get…Pregnancy is detrimental to the family, so says the World Health Organization…so preventative “medicine” is Birth Control. The Pill, specifically.  But that same World Health Organization has also said that the Pill is a Group 1 Carcinogen.

Also, abortion was won on the grounds of privacy…what a woman does with her body is between her and her doctor. YET, they are now dispensing the Morning After Pill from vending machines.  Which medical school are these machines going to?  If someone sees a woman purchasing the MAP does she get to sue the vending machine under the HIPPA law for a breach of privacy?  I’m so confused!  ;)

The truth is, this is NOT about “healthcare”, it’s about TOTAL control of the masses;  to even THINK that any administration could come up,with something this egregious is horrifying.  A president does not have the power to “compromise” when it comes to the first amendment; barak Obama is nothing more than a dictator, ruling by fiat. As usual, the catholic church will thank him for his religious tolerance and tell us its ok to vote for him AGAIN.  If you think this is bad, just wait for the next four years. At least I can say I never bought his lies, never voted for him, it won’t be on my catholic conscience.

MK, that’s interesting, but of course, alcoholic beverages such as the wine used at mass are also classified as “group 1 carcinogens”.  So too are many medications used to treat medical conditions, as well as many natural radiations including solar radiation, for which one does not need a prescription, but some doctors do prescribe it nonetheless.  And as you noted, “estrogen-progestogen oral contraceptives (combined)” are also classified likewise.  But I also see that the carcinogen classification for oral contraceptives comes with the following “Note: There is also convincing evidence in humans that these agents confer a protective effect against cancer in the endometrium and ovary.”

You people are simple-minded, superstitious fools. I’m so happy I left your archaic beliefs behind me. Leave women alone. 98% of Catholics use birth control. Those who say they don’t, are either lying, hypocrites, or both. 58% support the president. Do you just pull this out of your butts? Evil? If there is such a thing, you are it.

Tom, I appreciate your research.  The key difference is that estrogen-progestogen birth control is taken for a very extended period of time.  The wine of Communion is consumed in extremely small amounts once per week, and if one drinks substantial amounts of alcohol socially, well, society acknowledges that is unhealthy.  Same with the sun.  Some medications may be carcinogenic in the long-term, but people typically take them over a limited time, and even if not, they are willing to trade the potential risk of cancer for the definite risk of whatever disease they are currently fighting.  Regarding the protective properites of the Pill against two specific types of cancer, avoiding cancers A and B in the course of developing cancer C is an empty victory.  In short, our healthcare dollars are being forced to pay for something that uses unnatural chemical means to render an optional human activity consequence-free, meaning those dollars are not covering real diseases, like childhood leukemia.

Bryan Kirchoff
St. Louis

Maybe I’m simple-minded, but I wonder why Jimmy described the new plan as “more evil” when Cardinal-designate Dolan said it’s “a first step in the right direction.”  Can it be both?

Somebody said:
Leave women alone. 98% of Catholics use birth control.

I love how the percentage of Catholics that use contraception keeps going up. Two weeks ago the number being spread was 90%. Guess people are getting antsy.

If these figures are true, my saintly, elderly grandmother must go out and buy the pill when we are not looking, probably helped out by my 10 year-old who goes along to pick hers up.

Until I see a reputable study, I simply will not believe this number.

No Tom, it just means that Jimmy is manifestly more intelligent than most of our bishops.

Remember, these are the same bishops who took $5,000,000 donated by the faithful to the Church and handed it over to ACORN to elect this monster.

It’s not for nothing that Augustine said the floor of hell is paved with the skulls of bishops.

This was his plan from the very beginning ,to make this provision knowing we would fight it then he would come back with this one. All I know is I’ll choose not to sin, you nor I cannot stop some others . I am glad that my church doesn’t have to pay health benefits into an insurance company that will pay for abortion.

More abortions please. Birth control is one of the only two guaranteed ways to prevent abortions. The other is abstinence, and even priests can’t seem to accomplish that. There is one other, and I believe it is shown to be the preferred method for priests….homosexuality. No babies there. How obvious. Little boys can’t get pregnant no matter how many times they’re abused. Sorry, I almost left that one out.

I’m curious.  How long do you suppose a dollar remains Catholic after a religious employer uses it to pay others and they use it to pay others, etc?  At some point, some might rightfully regard that dollar as theirs to do with as they will—without regard to the religious views of others who once had it in their hands a transaction or two earlier.

BillyHW, supposing that it were somehow true that “Jimmy is manifestly more intelligent than most of our bishops”, I still hadn’t heard that that means he’s always correct in whatever he says, and in particular, what he said today.  After all, even smart people can say things that aren’t so smart, can’t they?  In your Feb 10, 2012 6:53 PM post, and pardon me if I misread your post, for as I said, maybe I’m simple minded, but were you alleging that any vote for Barack Obama in 2008 was necessarily a mortal sin requiring confession lest the person will “spend the rest of eternity burning in the fires of hell”?  If so, I wonder how you can make such an allegation, since mortal sin requires the presence of multiple conditions, including conditions that are subjective and cannot be judged ab externo.  In addition, Cardinal Ratzinger said that “When a Catholic does not share a candidate’s stand in favor of abortion and/or euthanasia, but votes for that candidate for other reasons, it is considered remote material cooperation, which can be permitted in the presence of proportionate reasons.”  I don’t know the reasons for everyone’s (or for that matter, anyone’s) vote, and when I ask people about “proportionate reasons”, I get all sorts of reasons and opinions or, perhaps my favorite, silence, which I respect may be the best reason of them all.

Tom,

And the Obama administration is forcing insurance companies to pay for Alcoholic beverages?  Sunshine?  Besides, your premise in incorrect.  Pregnancy is not a disease, so contraception used as contraception does not fall under the category of “medicines”, whether carcinogenic or not.  And I see you didn’t even address the issue of “Between a patient and her machine”...

Actually Tom, now that I think of it, we Catholics view the Eucharistic Celebration as preventative “medicine”.  How would you feel if Obama made insurance companies pay for that bread and wine?

Every healthcare policy I have had provided abortion-birth control procedures. It’s up to us not to take advantage of it. Just because it’s part of the policy doesn’t mean we have to have the procedure. The moral decision is still free will. Just because a pharmacy sells condoms doesn’t give us the liberty to purchase it for use. However, if on the rare chance you have money “to burn” you can always buy them and then destroy them so no one can use them for sinful purposes.

Jimmy, while this is a bad policy, you are wrong on the elimination of the ministerial exeption. That remains in the final rule, which states:

“The religious employer exemption in the final regulations does not undermine the overall
benefits described above. A group health plan (and health insurance coverage provided in
connection with such a plan) qualifies for the exemption if, among other qualifications, the plan
is established and maintained by an employer that primarily employs persons who share the
religious tenets of the organization. As such, the employees of employers availing themselves of
the exemption would be less likely to use contraceptives even if contraceptives were covered
under their health plans.”

You might want to correct this point.
God bless.

People who believe that electing a Republican to office will make any difference are fooling themselves.  The Republican Party has no more respect for basic liberties than the Democrats.  They just attack them from a different front, a front Catholics don’t seem to mind so much.  Until you work for the liberty of all, not just religious liberty, you will have neither.

Right on!

You can’t dance with the devil; if you do, you’re going to get burned!

Any guesses out there on when Secretary Sebelius will tender her resignation? 

I actually don’t think this will happen, but it should:
  - This is accommodation is an obvious sign of a scrambling administration
  - Story is that Sebelius championed this action: the upside from supposed women’s rights voters would be greater than the Catholic outcry

Clearly an administration who wants a second term would have been better off not touching this issue.  But I don’t expect any resignation - the arrogant almost never admit a mistake.

This is only a glimpse of what Obamacare contains.  What does the rest of it hold in store for us?

Thanks Jimmy for being right on the target once again. For those that posted their comments attacking the USCCB, they should have waited, as Archbishop Dolan said NO to this back-door attempt to fool anyone. Now if “planned parenthood” likes this “new deal”, it should be very obvious to all, except poor Tom & that BKoldBull that is heading straight for hell with his stupidity of leaving God’s Church. Tom, when we donate money (goods, etc.) believing that it will be used properly, first you ask Our Blessed Mother to bless the donation and all those that will be handling it, then, you give it freely (it is God’s in the first place) with a clear conscience. Now, if someone misuses the gift, the sin is on them and THEY WILL HAVE TO ANSWER TO GOD. Please re-read and study Matt 16: 21-23 (especially 23) very slowly until you can understand just what Jesus is saying to our very first pope (in the making). JANET: your statement about shopping where they sell counter-ban is not the same as what that man of evil is shoving down our throats. Using your line of reasoning:  when you watch t.v. you are helping to spread evil, as many of the shows, people, etc. are condoning evil. When you buy products such as Kodak, Ben & Jerry’s Ice Cream, shop at places such as Home Depot, you are directly helping satan, as these and far too many others, support birth control; sex-education; abortion and/or the death-style of the homosexuals. Just by paying taxes or your water bill, you are in league with the devil, using your thinking. The difference is being a willing accomplice which is what Obama’s plan is all about or being a victim, of which we all are.  It is nice to see people such as BKOLDBULL on a Catholic site, now we can pray for his conversion and for him to repent and be right with God once again.  +JMJ+

I think we truly need to pray and let everyone know that this is wrong. Also, Teach our children how this is wrong! Dad’s MUTE the TV during commercials when watching a football game, or other events. Most of them have some type of sexual sales pitch… We need to fight this from all angles. anyways.. Keep up the great work JIMMY! My prayers our with you and all!

I agree that this change does not preserve the rights of insurers not to sell products that violate their consicence.  As such, it needs to be changed.  However, regarding the notion that this change is worse because it removes the narrow exception, this does not seem right.  CNN states:

“Under the new plan, religiously affiliated universities and hospitals will not be forced to offer contraception coverage to their employees. Insurers will be required, however, to offer complete coverage free of charge to any women who work at such institutions. Female employees at churches themselves will have no guarantee of any contraception coverage—a continuation of current law.”

The same Obama statement you referenced also said: “Churches had already been exempted from providing employees with health care that covered contraception. The new policy announced today ensures that if a woman works for other types of religious employers with objections…”

It doesn’t seem like he is abolishing the first narrow exemption as claimed… can you explain the disconnect?

I am amazed why some people don’t get this!
How about insurance companies that are owned and run by the Church organizations like the Knight of Columbus and Providence Health System owned and run by the Sisters of Providence. These are forcefully mandated not only to provide by also to pay for these evil acts! Where is this coming from? Can’t all of us have a common sense and say, “enough is enough”? God help America! If you believe in the power of prayer, we need to both pray very hard and take bold actions!

Does anyone think this issue is about women? It is control of the masses and the control of religion. At a news conference the goal here was slipped (Secretary Sebelius) said when asked about mandatory use of birth control in young women she answered that it is not required YET. Was this a slip of words or a desire of government?

I didn’t even read any of the above blogs.  Our President really and truly believes that the public, on the whole, are ignorant.  Who do you know in life who got anything free. Nothing is free, someone pays for it. Whether you have health, home, car or death insurance, someone else is paying for it in part. Insurance is a gamble. [Sue a catholic buys health ins. at the Cath. hosp. she works at;  Jane a non-cath.working there also buys the same ins. but she gets her contraceptives free along with it. BIG LAUGH!  That is the same as saying Sue has home insurance but gets free flood ins. along with it free. No way, if I want floor ins added I have to pay for it.Everyone knows they are going to raise the cost of the health ins. to cover those who get the free contraceptives. Mr. President, you and whoever advises you on this are the ignorant ones.

Our Bishops need to keep leading and we as Americans need to keep fighting for our inalienable rights. If moral conscience is allowed to die over a shell game, this country will die.

It gets even worse. Read the NRLC article titled “New Obama Scam (You Must Pay, But Nobody Pays) Lays Groundwork for Future National Abortion Mandate”

“Despite what President Obama said at his White House press conference, the actual regulations make permanent the “interim final regulations” issued August 3, 2011 — the ones that sparked the furor in the first place. ...The bottom line is this: “Accordingly, the amendment to the interim final rule with comment period amending 45 CFR 147.130(a)(1)(iv) which was published in the Federal Register at 76 FR 46621-46626 on August 3, 2011, is adopted as a final rule without change.” [Emphasis added.]
Translation: The Obama administration Friday afternoon (February 10) put into federal law the very regulation that drew objections from almost 200 Catholic bishops, some 50 religiously affiliated colleges and universities, 65 North American bishops of Orthodox churches, numerous other Jewish, Evangelical and Lutheran leaders, and even some liberals — and without changing so much as a comma.”
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/290859/nothing-squid-ink-ed-haislmaier

Jimmy;
  I have more of an understanding of the situation
the way you explain it.
  My representatives in Maryland are pro-choice.
Our Governor who is Catholic stated that they
have the same problem in italy, but Italy isn’t
making a big thing out of it the way we are in America.

Every kind of abortion is the next addition to every health care plan.

Mr O’Malley wants to be president some day. He is laying the ground work
and will pander to anyone or anything that he thinks will get him there. He is a phoney Catholic and truly believes that God is blind to his actions. Pay backs are hell. He better wise up!

I like the picture in your article. It presents the solution to the problem. We just need Obama and his henchmen and henchladies to LEAVE!

the insurance companies SAVE money by offering those services. they don’t have to take the money from the Church. I’m not saying this is going to work out perfect for every employer, because some self-insure, and that’s just what works on the larger scale. They’ve got some time to work on it though, and hopefully some additional accommodation will be made in those cases. This isn’t over, but it’s not WAR yall.

The solution is for all Catholics to unite and defeat Obama and his Party of Death in November.

Indeed it is war…Obama continues to wage warfare against all who believe in Christ and in His Word.  Rise up, Men and Women of God!!!

These people, who are human and have souls in peril, must 1) be prayed for without ceasing and 2) opposed completely and without reservation or fear. 

Onward, Christian Soldiers…BE NOT AFRAID!!!

Jimmy,

Why is “evil spokeswoman Kathleen Sebelius!” on your blog (http://jimmyakin.com/2012/02/dont-be-deceived-evil-obama-policy-now-even-more-evil.html)? As a practicing catholic, I agree that the the use of contraception (especially abortifacients)is intrinsically evil. However, personal attacks are unwarranted. Our focus should be on fighting these misguided policies and educating the culture (which includes many catholics)on the dire consequences of contraception.

First, it was “most Catholic women use birth control.”  Then it was 70%.  Then it was 92%.  Now it’s 98%.  According to the Census Bureau, only 36.5% of the population is between 18 and 44.  Throw in 16-year-olds and you get just a couple more percentage points.  If 98% of Catholic women are using birth control, they’re starting it while they’re in diapers and taking it well into their 90s.

Dear “mk”, you wrote that “your premise in incorrect.  Pregnancy is not a disease, so contraception used as contraception does not fall under the category of ‘medicines’, whether carcinogenic or not.”  No, I had no premise that pregnancy is a “disease”.  Pregnancy is, however, considered to be a medical condition, and medications are commonly prescribed to prevent and/or treat medical conditions.  The “pill” may also be prescribed for conditions other than pregnancy.  And the reason I mentioned alcoholic beverages and sunshine was not about insurance but because “group 1 carcinogen” is a label that can be misused.  As to “How would you feel if Obama made insurance companies pay for that bread and wine?”, I don’t think it’s my “feelings” that the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences does not recommend it, and that’s apparently who the administration uses as a medical guide, not my “feelings”.

I can’t help to think about the real culprits in this assault upon our Faith: The Catholic Left. For 44 years they have publicly opposed the constant and clear teaching of the Church on this manner. Their decent has not only been divisive with in our Holy Communion, but they have used the force of law to pass so-called birth control and pro-abortion laws. Why wouldn’t a leftist government not think it was “ok” to do what they are attempting to do? After all, who has embolden them in the first place?

We are engaged in the Battle between Good and Evil.  Who can condone teaching a young man to strap a bomb to his chest and blow up himself and a dozen innocent people in the name of Allah?
Who can condone teaching a woman to pay someone to kill her unborn child?  Satan, who leads the Evil side of the Battle wants the people and babies dead but moreover, Satan wants us to do the murdering.  Obama had the worst ever pro-innocent-death voting record in the Senate.  Now he has the worst yet pro-innocent-death record as president.  HE WANTS US TO BE LIKE HIM.

“Leave women alone. 98% of Catholics use birth control. Those who say they don’t, are either lying, hypocrites, or both.”  -BKOLDBULL

What he’s saying is that 98% of Catholic women are willfully (or ignorantly) disobedient to the Catholic Magisterium.  That sounds like an insult to women in general. I find it hard to believe that I am part of a 2% minority of women who do obediently and faithfully follow the teachings of the Catholic Church and don’t use birth control. I don’t know who came up the 98% number, but they’re off their rocker. In my personal experience, there are a lot more Catholic women who do follow all of the teachings of the Catholic Church than don’t, and furthermore do so not just out of blind obedience but because reason had told them that the Church is right on this issue!

98%? Really? Even the very young and the old?? My, how statistics lie—especially gov’t stats. Susan is right. And the old bull has lost his mojo so gets his fun trolling Catholic sites. Must be disappointing as he is generally just ignored. But now you are being noted by me so I hope that makes your day. If not, go to Adoration for an hour and see if you do not come out a new person.

I suggest that the Catholic Church apply for a waiver from having to adhere to the mandates of Obamacare.  The hierarchy supported Obamacare, at least in our Diocese of Rockville Centre where “social justice” is king. Over 1,500 waivers have been granted by “Pope Sebelius”, mainly to those labor unions (SEIU anyone?), pharma companies and insurance companies that also lobbied and supported Obamacare, so why not the Catholic Church?  Just a suggestion.  This entire situation and attack on the Constitution brings to mind the sayings “Be careful what you wish for” and “The Devil is in the Details”, not to mention the phrase “Buyer’s Remorse”.

One scarely knows what to think of this “compromise” except to wonder whether the president really believes he is compromising on anything.  In which case, the twenty-fifth amendment really should come into play.

Maybe I’m missing it but what leads one to think that this rule just went into effect Friday?  The way I read it, it was approved in December.  Could this be just a case of the federal bureaucracy moving slowly oblivious to events actually happening?

There was nocompromise and if a person has half a brain they can understand that. One thing I’d like to point out that the government is so into “family planning” and “women’s health” and “choice” yet they will not make insurance companies pay for Natural Family Planning or NaProTechnology treatment of women.

When will the turning point be reached? When will the Church stop caving and start fighting? When will bishops grow backbones?

When you hear these words, brothers and sisters:

“Sebelius excommunicatus est.”
“Pelosius excommunicatus est.”

If you don’t believe in contraception or abortion, then don’t use it.  Simple as that.  Not everyone who works for a catholic organization is catholic.  You seem to be the ones meddling, not Obama.  If I want to use birth control pills, I shouldn’t have to quit my job to get it covered.  Please try to see the reasoning in things and stop the hating.

Maia,
If you were a business owner, how would you like it if the government forced you to pass out KKK pamphlets?  Would it make you feel any better if the government made an accomodation that someone ELSE would come onto your premises to pass out the KKK pamphlets, but they were still being passed out on your premises?

No, you would have to refuse (I assume you are not a racist.)  There could be no compromise.  That’s the situation we are in.

Opposition to Obama constitutes hate, doesn’t it Maia? I mean, the entire conservative movement is a fringe group anyway, isn’t it Maia? When will those Christians get out of the Stone Age, eh Maia? If you don’t believe in gay marriage don’t get married to gays, etc., etc.

You’re just phoning it in.

Dave,
I didn’t realize the government was making you pass out birth control pills.  My apologies.  Now that I know, I can save myself a trip to the pharmacy and come straight to you or your place of business.  This will definitely help me avoid the long lines at the pharmacy!

Maia,
OK, then change it to “provide access” to KKK pamphlets at your own expense.  I don’t see how it changes anything.

” And in those days you will not be able to buy or sell unless you have the mark of the beast on your forheads.” The mark of the beast, in this case, is the ” sanctioned ” approval of the government. You will not be able to run or operate a business or any type of institution unless you knuckle under to this mandate. If this stands we ” de facto ” live in a dictatorship, a Bureaucratic Dictatorship under the tutelage of a dictatorial Executive who would like nothing better than to be a real dictator.

Maia: Catholics have a problem with this because we do not believe in contraceptives, the after pill or abortions of any kind. [therefore our institutions should not have to provide it] The other problem for Catholics and non-Catholics is that we do not want the government controlling everything in our lives.  Little, by little that is what they are doing. We are not like European countries who have a socialistic government. Remember also that when the government says that everyone must have health insurance that they can afford, it really means that if you are rich you have great coverage and if you are poor the coverage is much less. We have medicaid because there are people who cannot afford any health insurance. The Catholic Church is not dictating the the whole U.S. they are only protecting our beliefs.

The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

-William Butler Yeats

So, let’s recap what we have learned thus far-
Next time a Republican or Democrat says, let us have
Universal health care law passed, our
Answer should be, ‘No, thank you!’
Once we let the government in, only tentacles
will prevail. Good intentions will lead us to a corporate Marxist
society.

I agree fully with your article. Obama must be defeated this November as he is the most pro-abortion President in our history.

I got a question for the national media, How do 98 percent of Catholic women use contraception. I don’t mean to be stupid here, but do the math. Do we have 90 year old on contraception? Huh? And what if I don’t want to have that covered on my policy? Why do I have to have it? I thought we were trying to save costs? Here’s the other thing. Planned Parenthood passes out contraception and abortions like candy. Where are women being denied this? What straw man arguement.

90% of US Catholics Support Artificial Contraception.
http://www.catholic.org/national/national_story.php?id=41401

58 % of Catholics believe that employers should be required to provide their employees with health care plans that cover contraception.
http://publicreligion.org/research/2012/02/january-tracking-poll-2012/

Here is another thought: Whenever pedophilia [or anything else bad] is mentioned on T.V. it is always “within the Catholic Church”, yet it is world wide, No matter “what” it is always a fight against the Catholic Church and my opinion is because the Catholic Church is the largest Christian denomination with the most power and therefore, the secular government/society in order to become even more secular will use the Catholic Church to obtain what they want. Little by little, remember “no 10 commandments outside a bldg, no crosses on hills, no God mentioned in schools”, & one can go on and on.  Little by little.

Where are the insurance companies on the HHS Mandate?  Why haven’t we heard from them?  Do they plan to roll over and play dead?

What are the moral “absolutes” ... what are Core Catholic Non-Negotiable Values?

Ask your Pastor or Bishop to have them listed in a “credit card sized corner” of every Parish Bulletin with an instruction to cut it out and put it in your purse or wallet and read and ponder before voting in November.

Pray and Hope but by all means do not also fail to Vote in an informed way this November.

RESPONSE TO STEVEN: “Unfortunately, I think the poor ol’ Bishops WILL be suckered by this deception…”

Steven, I have to respectfully disagree with you. It’s taken Obama, Sebelius, and an undeniable attack on freedom of speech and freedom of religion, but the American Bishops have united. Last I heard (two or three days ago), all but 12 bishops had issued official statements denouncing this bill.

There is nothing “naive” or “trusting” about them; they are our shepherds, appointed by God to lead us and care for us, and that they will do, come what may. It is our job to be trusting of them, knowing they are allowing themselves to be led by the Holy Spirit.

Before you believe the surveys that say anything about what 58% of Catholics believe or 90% of what Catholics do, etc. find out how the survey questions are written.  It’s easy to write survey questions that elicit the responses you want.  And who are the people that are identified as “Catholics”—The ones who attend Mass every Sunday?  The Christmas-and-Easter Catholics?  The folks who never attend, but grew up Catholic?  The ones who want nothing to do with the Catholic Church, but would deliberately answer a survey question in such a way that it would embarrass the Church? And even if 58% of real, actual Catholics are begging for contraception coverage, that only shows we have a failure of catechesis, not a failure of the Church to “get with the program.”

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/Religion-and-Contraceptive-Use.pdf

If anyone is saying that 98% of Catholic women are currently using birth control, of course that is inaccurate. The thing is, the pill has been around for several generations of female fertility. A woman who was 21 in 1962 is now 71. She no longer uses birth control, but she did. Her daughter may still be using it, and her grandaughter will almost certainly be using it if she is sexually active. It is quite possible that 98% of Catholic women at some point in their lives used contraceptives. It is also possible that a fairly large percentage of Catholic couples solved the problem with a tubal ligation or vasectomy. This study says it is about 33 percent. You can argue with the study’s methodology or honesty, but you can’t pretend that it’s not possible.

Has anyone done another study that disproves this study? I would be interested to know.

Obama is a close resemblance to what I think is the anti-Christ that he’s scary.  In the end he will lose salvation and burn in hell forever along with all who follow him if he doesn’t change his ways.  So sad for an American president to stray so far from what our forefathers did when they established our country.

Catholic Families in the U.S. used to have on average 5 children. Now it is 2. In any parish 1/2 of the expected children are missing for some reason. it is plausible to believe that they have preemptively been denied life because of contraception. The Catholic Church and Western civilization are facing a demographic nightmare sometime in the not too distant future.

SusanHG is right. What we have here is “a failure of catechesis”. There were four other couples who took NFP classes with us 16 years ago. The husbands were all engineers, as I am. Because of our profession (recognizing problems and finding solutions) we had all seen the causal connections to evil in society produced by the widespread use of contraception. Last weeks letter from our Bishop was the first time my wife an I had heard anything on this subject in 15 years since.

I hope there are a lot of Obama people reading this: Remember people, our President wants a bill to protect the HEALTH OF WOMEN. So,if passed, women can get “the pill” free of charge. [from what I have heard from the medical world, this pill can give you breast cancer in later yrs., messes up your whole hormone system.  It does not protect you from STD’s or Aids.] Yet, the President says it is to protect women’s health. The ‘morning after pill’ kills the beginning of life, which means the dopey woman did not use “the pill”. and if the “morning after pill” does not work, just go to an abortionist and every tax payer will pay for it, BECAUSE IT IS FREE. THIS IS THE BILL!
Nothing is said about MEN’S HEALTH [wouldn’t free condoms protect women and men from STD’s and Aids?    See how idiotic this whole thing is. I am not talking about Church Law as some of you on this blog are, I am talking about how ridiculous this whole Health Bill is. How much more simply can one explain it. Correct me if I am wrong.

A thought again: Remember recently the leader of China died (forgot his name) and the people stood around crying and from what we were told “false crying” because they were told to do so. China also said only one or two children per family and all of a sudden there were too many girls and baby girls were being killed. The China government controls everything. {this is what we hear and read about China—I personally never lived there).....When I think of this, it really scares me when I hear more and more what this administration is doing to us. To pass a health bill before it is even read by anyone [as Pelossi said “we will know what is in it after it is passed”] is unbelievable. I’d like to know who wrote those over 1,000+ pages. It should never have passed.

I don’t think any intelligent person following this news is fooled, but there will be those who pretend they buy the “accommodation”—including Obama’s puppet, Sr. Carol Keehan, and the Dem congress who will again use her as the front to support the accommodation. Heck, if Sr. Carol, an alleged Catholic leader, says the debate is over, then Catholics must feel all is now well.

The bishops cannot let up for a minute or even allow a press release that signals this is in any way a “step in the right direction.” The press will run with that and never publish the “but” that comes after it.

Here’s a little lyric I wrote about this whole issue of the HHS Mandate using Dylan’s “All Along the Watchtower”, which describes this sad debacle.  http://youtu.be/YRJ-n5-37VE.

“There must be some way out of here,” said the joker to the thief,
“There’s too much constitution, I can’t get no relief.
Bishops, they won’t drink my wine, and priests won’t dig my earth,
I’m giving away free contraception don’t they know what this is worth?”

“No reason to get excited,” Sebelius, she kindly spoke,
“You, Barack, as well as I know this is but a joke.
Besides you are the anointed one, and this is not your fate,
So let us keep talking falsely now, the hour is getting late.”

But all along the watchtower, the voters kept their view
Come November the Joker’s gone, and his servants, too.
Outside in the distance the Church Militant did growl,
They woke a sleeping giant, and the wind is going to howl.

Sorry catholics. . .the rest of the world has moved on without you and history will view contraceptive technologies (pills,condoms, sterlizations, and yes abortion) on the same level as the printing press, harnessing electricty, the microchip, splitting the atom etc in terms of human liberation.  With contraception we are not slaves of our reproductive limits, and have much more opportunity to learn, grow, advance, travel and otherwise self actualize. . .I have to wonder what a living hell life must have been in the days before contraceptiov.  Did they just sit around and think, “man, can I go ahead and die now?”

You are probably already funding these services with your insurance premiums.  Twenty-eight states mandate insurance coverage for contraception.  Fewer than sixteen states restrict insurance coverage for abortion.  If you live in a state that mandates contraception coverage then your health insurance premiums are certainly being used to pay for contraception.  If you live in a state that does not restrict abortion coverage then your premiums may be used to pay for abortions.

We must not allow ourself to be fooled for sake of the unborn!
A follower of Jesus in Los Angeles

@ Bob Rodriguez,
No, the battle is actually already won. “Whoever hears you hears me.”
Yours is a false hope, the Church is built on the a Rock and that Rock is Christ and His Vicar on earth.

(ps. I am not amused by your references to science. NFP is science. I seriously doubt you have had one tenth of the science education I’ve had.)

Here is a new idea on this topic.  Archbishop Dolan should not go to Rome.

This is a major crisis in America.  During the Cuban Missile Crisis, the bishops left the first session of Vatican II early to return to their people.

The surest way to say to the media, Hey, this is not resolved,” would be for the Archbishop of NY to remain at his post, here in America, as the leader of the US Bishops, and leave the media horde in Rome sputtering about his absence. 

Don’t give them footage of a genial bishop happy to become a cardinal—give them footage of their people standing on the sidewalk, empty-handed, talking about the extraordinary statement that this is a such a major issue that the archbishop would rather be in the US, fighting the good fight, than picking up a red hat.

See if the mainstream media can keep THAT story off the front page!  And maybe our separated brethren and Jewish elder brothers in faith will do something like the same—all people of conscience are in this together.

THe fact that Planned Parenthood is pleased with the “compromise” says it all - it’s not a compromise, it’s a sham!

Lol Bob Rodriguez

printing press - the same thing we also used for propaganda and spreading misinformation!

harnessing electricty, the microchip, splitting the atom - Atomic bombs, smart guided weapons of amss destruction, electric chairs…

I have no doubt ‘contraceptive technologies’ will also share such great legacies… although worse because the printing press, electricity and microchip technology and nuclear power have provided some good stuff. And contraceptives and abortion have provided what? Selfish Sexual pleasure? Whoa ho ho now! We’re really advancing the species there aren’t we?

Unfortunately for you, you’ll be contracepting and aborting the next generation of people from appreciating this great new world into extinction; as well as preventing the next generation of future scientists, achievers, geniuses and inventors from ever coming about, thus literally stopping an killing progress! Where do you think all those people came from hmmmm?

But who cares? So long as you just like sex… Which as you know scientific studies have shown, actually tend to make people less interested in expanding their horizons and more obsessed with pleasure and immediate stimuli, rducing their attention spans and giving them a kind of Pavalonian Dog syndrome; rather than going out there to spend time and hard breaking labor and thinking and being able to achieve and accomplish actual things of worth to humanity. That’s what people did in the days before contraception! That’s what they used to think about! The fact that this never occurred to you only goes to show how your contraceptive sex filled brain has blocked off your thinking juices from reaching your brain to consider all these things… so sad…

But at least you didn’t resort to playing the ol’ sex with altar boys card as if that was some kind of argument… So that makes you better than some people here, so good job!

Right on Johnno: Bob Rodriquez does not seem to know what the sin of gluttony is all about.  To put it simply, if you eat too much you will get sick and vomit along with getting obese & other sicknesses.  If you have as much sex as you want, like an animal,  then your brain dries up. Simple. LESSON: Every law God has given us is for our GOOD.

I had lunch on Friday with a priest—we graduated together from Catholic high school. I shared with him social media is the new battle ground for issues that threaten the most important issue facing our civilization: the issue of Life.. Look at the incredible call to arms that took place 2 weeks ago with “PP” donors, advocates, and hell raisers. Komen was brutalized in every way shape and form…and the attacking continues in social media. I am not saying Komen didn’t handle it’s affair in textbook fashion but they were just beaten to a pulp for doing something they were entitled to do and it was PEFECTLY LEGAL to do. My point is, the dinosaur media monitor social media channels constantly looking for patterns and prevailing views. I was in the pew two weeks ago and heard from our bishop…it was a greatly needed (and appreciated) teaching moment. I was there again last week and again today. Other than the Prayer of the Faithful that invoked government policies that have respect for human life at all stages, there was nothing on the HHS mandate. “Fits and starts” will not cut it folks. Not even close. All religions that seek to champion the Life Issue must be constant and relentless and immediate.

A couple more things to share: Carol Keehan pulls down approx. $750,000 a year in salary and it all goes back to her order. She essentially works for the CEOs of our nation’s Catholic hospital systems and many of those CEOs are not even Catholic. That last part is something to ponder when Catholics assess how and if the magisterium jibes with this mandate and the “compromise” that was really not a compromise at all. FYI—some of you might not know Sebelius was born and raised in a Catholic home. Her father was Democrat governor Ohio. She attended public high school and off to Trinity College in Wash., D.C. Look up the article published last year in “Washington” magazine about the Trinity alumnae cohort who were “educated” with this social justice stuff at Trinity. Somebody earlier in this thread brought up cathechesis or in this case lack thereof. Somebody owes an apology to Saint Julia Billiart.

Just don’t just pray that people realize what is going on.  Get out there and voice your opinion.  Say Something!

This mandate will cause a public health crisis by increasing promiscuous behavior and the spread of disease.  Sadly, there will be an increase in the number of infants born with venereal disease due to this mandate.

Condoms are far less effective in preventing the spread of disease than most people think.  Theya re also far less effective at preventing pregnancy than most people think. When it is said that they are “97 % effective” that is the annual rate, not the lifetime rate.  Also, it is the “perfect use” rate, not the rate actually experienced by condom users.  If you use the “actual experience” rate, over a four year period over 40% of condom users can expect to conceive a child.  And if you have had enough contact with someone to conceive a child, you have probably also had enough contact to contract a disease.

Please contact your legislators to prevent this abomination( or should I say Obamanation).

Obama wants to be a dictator tell everyone how they should live. No one is suppose to object to anything he does or say’s Please pray for our POPE that He will honor MARY"S request to consecrate Russia To Her Immaculate Heart!!
And She Will cause PEACE to reign All over the world.

Thank you, Jimmy for a brilliant essay.  You are right on.  You and others, such as Scott Hahn, had the humility and courage to convert to the Faith once you found objective Truth in the Catholic Church.  If anyone can lead the Church out of the desert, it is people like you, who have the knowledge and courage to tell it is like it is.

Re: Maia @ Feb 11 @ 5:58 PM.  She posted the old “If you are against contraception, don’t use it” ploy.  Of she were alive in the 1850s, her surry with a fringe on top would probably have had a sign which read “Against Slavery?  Don’t own one”.
Re: BillyHW @ Feb 11 l 1220 AM.  I believe the correct attribution should be assigned to St John Chrysostom, and should read “The ROAD to hell is paved with the skulls of bishops”.  At the rate we’re going, they will soon be able to add another lane.
Re: Lynn @ Feb 11 @ 4:32 PM.  She suggested that the bishops should ask for a waiver from the “health” plan mandate.  Back in 1992, when Ben was still Joe and head do the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, he wrote: “where a matter of the common good is concerned, it is inappropriate for Church authorities to endorse or remain neutral toward adverse legislation even if it grants exceptions to Church organizations and institutions.  The Church has the responsibility to promote family life and the public morality of the entire civil society on the basis of fundamental moral values, not simply to protect herself from the application of harmful laws”.  In addition, every Holy Father since Pius IX in 1849 (with the exception, of course of John Paul I) has condemned socialistic programs, which the health care plan undeniably is.  Waivers don’t do it.  We need to fight Evil whenever and where ever it is found.
Re: Dejah @ Feb 11 @ 3:49 PM.  What a beautiful witness for authentic Catholic morality!  May God bless you for your choice of a true Christian lifestyle.  My wife and I chose NFP during our fertile years, and can attest to the fact that it drew us closer together than any other choice possibly could.

Tom Jablonski
St Louis, MO

This is all a smokescreen to eliminate our First Amendment rights.

Let’s hope Baracchio listens to Timothy Cricket and saves us all from becoming donkeys enslaved by the coachman.
See cartoon at:
http://sytereitz.com/2012/02/a-tale-of-two-presidents-the-drama-continues/

I just checked the internet on what the Baptist Southern Convention thought of this issue and they think the same. It was a good article but we don’t hear of this coming out of the Baptist Church on T.V., only from the Catholic Church….the Press again, who is concentrating on contraception and not also on the abortion part of it.

Did you want a hamburger for $2.00 and fries for $1.00? Or how about a hamburger for $3.00 and we’ll give you the fries for free.  Hello?

agreed

Had another thought.  This is not just about abusing our first amendment rights.  This is establishing a National Religion in which we are told what we can believe and how we must conform or suffer the consequences.  Cardinal George recently said that he will die in bed, his successor will die in prison, and his successor will die in the public square.  I think his time line is too long.  I’m 74, and I think I will have the opportunity to be a martyr, especially if the current regime is re-elected.  Praise God!  Please let me be ready.  The forces of evil are not just at the city gates, they already control the city.

Tom Jablonski
St Louis, MO. (city included so they know where to find me)need36

Wait a minute - here we have a Christian president here trying to ensure that women have access to contraception, yet this crowd is siding with the Catholic leadership? The same folks who are responsible for the sexual abuse of countless young boys and girls under their care? Who holds the high moral ground here? On what possible planet can anyone argue that Obama is the evil one or against religion? And are we also to ignore the evils of poverty, suffering and death by AIDS in developing countries caused by this irrational stance on condoms? Survey all those who describe themselves as Catholic - you’ll find that the overwhelming majority use contraceptives, because they realise that the true meaning of the Catholic church has nothing to do with outdated dogma like this.

Look at the incredible call to arms that took place 2 weeks ago when “PP” unleashed its donors, advocates, and hell raisers on Komen, which was brutalized in every way shape and form…and the attacking continues in social media. I am not saying Komen didn’t handle it’s affair in textbook fashion but they were just beaten to a pulp for doing something they were entitled to do and it was PEFECTLY LEGAL to do. My point is, the dinosaur media monitor social media channels constantly looking for patterns and prevailing views. I was in the pew two weeks ago and heard from our bishop…it was a greatly needed  (and appreciated) teaching moment. I was there again last week and again today. Other than the Prayer of the Faithful that invoked government policies that have respect for human life at all stages, there was nothing on the HHS mandate. “Fits and starts” will not cut it folks. Not even close. All religions that seek to champion the Life Issue must be constant and relentless and immediate. Then I read this from Peggy Noonan. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203824904577212832724317096.html    Please clip it out and send to your priests and bishops. Please please please. God give us strength. 

Look at the incredible call to arms that took place 2 weeks ago when “PP” unleashed its donors, advocates, and hell raisers on Komen, which was brutalized in every way shape and form…and the attacking continues in social media. I am not saying Komen didn’t handle it’s affair in textbook fashion but they were just beaten to a pulp for doing something they were entitled to do and it was PEFECTLY LEGAL to do.  I read this from Peggy Noonan. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203824904577212832724317096.html    Please clip it out and send to your priests and bishops. Please please please. God give us strength. 

@mark…yawn. Big yawn!! tired argument. Nice subterfuge. Move on down the road brother.

The Scorpion and the Fox
The scorpion ask the fox to carry him across a river. The fox is afraid of being stung during the trip, but the scorpion argues that if it stung the fox, the fox would sink and the scorpion would drown. The fox agrees and begins carrying the scorpion, but midway across the river the scorpion does indeed sting the fox, dooming them both. When the fox asked why, the scorpion said “It is my nature”.

Folks, it is Obama and his administration’s nature to mislead the public in their policy. Havent we learned our lesson yet. For those cafeteria Catholics who voted for Obama before, time to wise up!

Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.

Caveat emptor.

Pax Christi

Here is a “compromise”.  The Catholic Hospitals, Pharmacies and other Christian institutions distribute contraceptive pills and other devices of murdering babies (contraception, abortions and morning after pills all do that)  and in exchange ALL the recipients at the government’s expense also MUST receive Rosaries, Bibles and Catechisms with religious instructions.  Obama and the other Powers personally pays 1/3% of everything and receive an education in Church history; and, Obama goes to rehab for deprogramming black liberation theology.  Of course, being Catholic, the instructions entail homework and testing.  Those who fail the tests must repeat and services are suspended until they pass.  And, as a show of good faith, all public buildings will have crucifixes in every room and the Ten Commandments posted in the lobbies and restrooms.  Rosaries, Bibles and Catechisms with religious instructions will be made available at every abortion location including Planned Parenthood.

@pleasehearmenow - yeah you caught me, I’m part of Obama’s not-so-secret-anymore conspiracy. We plot to restrict religious freedom by providing free preventive care to church employees that the church prefers to withhold. Even though the polls clearly show Catholics prefer to have this benefit because they use contraception. Even though non-Catholic employees may not share your beliefs. Even though a church isn’t being forced to do anything for employees that they weren’t doing before. Why would the insurance companies offer it at no cost? No, they’re not part of our conspiracy group, they are corporations that know that it will cost them less than not providing it.
Whole lotta anger in all these comments from those who preach understanding and forgiveness, where’s the love bro? BTW, which of my “arguments” are tired - the one that it’s hard to take morality lessons from the scandalous church leadership, or that (gasp) most Catholics use contraception and would like it included in their company benefit plan, or is it that the president is really, truly, also a Christian and not the anti-Christ and generally wants the same as you?

@Sue,
I understand where you are coming from when you state that Catholics do not believe in contraceptions, and therefore do not want your institutions to provide it and the government interfering with your lives.  My point is exactly the same. I work at a hospital that is partly owned by the Catholics.  Because of that, I do not get birth controlled covered.  That to me is the Catholics trying to control my actions with their beliefs.  How is that different?  Can’t we all agree that contraceptives will help reduce the number of abortions?

I was horrified when I learned of all the Catholics who were backing Obama before the election.  All aboard for the hopey-change train that was guaranteed to to you straight to the happy land of socialism…where were the wise, thoughtful keepers of our religious heritage?  What on earth were they thinking when they promoted this man and welcomed him as their leader with open arms?
I was one of the many who rallied at the Capitol against the passage of Obamacare…standing opposite groups of nuns who were there in support of the bill.  I spoke to many asking if they even read what is in the bill, which they hadn’t only believing in the spoken “promises” of the president.  They treated me like I was the spawn of the devil.  We all know the outcome of that bill now, though some are still hard headed about what is the truth here.
Catholics, both clergy and laymen are getting a second chance to stand up for the laws of our Constitution, for the First Amendment.  Hopefully this time around we will be united in our efforts, as we must be to get back the liberties that our leaders, who are acting against their oath of office to uphold the Constitution, continue to chip away the freedom that is the right of the citizens of all faiths.

Wow, it sure is different here in Canada.  We have been paying for abortions and sterilizations through all of our taxes for years and no bishop or leader of any church has called for civil disobiedience.

All insurance providers who cover perscriptions in Canada cover birth control, morning after pill, etc.  Catholic school teachers, hospital workers all have access to these services through their insurance.

No outrage up here… but there isn’t an election comming up in the fall.

@ Mark

- Obama is as much a Christian as Judas Iscariot. He denies the most basic tenets of the Christian faith through supporting abortion and the mass murder of children and open promotion of homosexuality and in expanding government powers to take away freedoms granted by the American constitution to impose his tyranical desires. In any case, he follows some off-shoot faith numbering amongst whatever flavor of Protestantism happens to be in vogue. Catholics don’t care for his ‘false faith’, and it’s not surprising other Christians of various Protestant sects don’t care for his false faith either because they also reject whatever supposedly ‘christian’ community he belongs to. Obama clearly doesn’t want the ‘same as us.’ This is why we have this big problem here if you can manage to follow along…

- The Catholic Church has unfortunately screwed up with regards to protecting children and young adults from sexual predation. But your precious government and public schools and other institutions have it far worse, & support pornography, encourage sexual immorality, and along with the U.N. and certain segements of secular society and homosexual groups are pushing for the decriminilization of pedophilia and pedaresty as a whole supporting the sexual rights of children and condemning sexual ‘age discrimination.’ Do you like them better? Are you even aware of what is going on? Are you even aware that it was rampant liberalism, radical changes to Church tradition, it’s holy Mass and other modernist changes and secular morality alongside adherence to pro-pedophilia academia and psychology that fostered the sex abuse crisis within the Church? Or do you imagine it was just something that magically happened? Don’t you know Obama protects Planned Parenthood and its clinics that have been caught on video providing services to pimps and abused underaged girls brought in by their adult lovers and never informing the police, and whoom under Obama’s own cohort Sebelius destroyed evidence that would potentially incriminate them? Where is the outrage and lawsuits and court cases over that? The (authentic) Catholic Church, if it can be heard over the voices of its enemies and the ignorant, still holds the moral high ground.

- Obama has been against religon for awhile now. Particularly the Catholic Church whose doctrines and morality concerning sex stand in the way of his ideological eugenist and population control agendas as well as his brand of morality that he wishes to spread worldwide into Africa and the phillipines whom he intends to bribe or coerce by witholding financial aid.

- Poverty will always be around for a variety of reasons. Doesn’t give anyone an excuse to be irresponsible and sexually immoral, nor to murder someone to fix their problems. Nor is preventing the poor from breeding for the sake of the upper class liberals helping them much.

- AIDS is primarily driven by sexual immorality. Abstinence and monogamy within hetrosexual marriage (the only sort of marriage) should be the leading method of preventing it. Condoms have only made the situation worse because it has made people engage in sexual immorality more frequently from some unscientific notion that condoms are perfect and foolproof, which they are not. Anyone stupid enough to risk their lives by adopting immoral sexual lifesyles will endanger their own lives wether they use condoms or not. COndoms are not the solution. Not to mention the rates of cancer and STDs that have gone up due to contraceptive use, or don’t you care about those evil things?

- What the majority of Catholics do is of no bearing on Church morality. Morality is not determined by democratic vote. And Catholics are human beings who are sinners, and everybody does what is wrong beacuse they are weak to temptation. Besides, just because someone may succumb to sining doesn’t mean they agree that they are not sinning. Many people look at pornography, but I doubt many of them think it’s a good and virtuous thing. Many people get angry and do bad things, but that doesn’t mean they agree their actions were justified. And if any Catholics are willflly sinning then that is their problem and they can face GOd when they die and explain to Him how ‘outdated’ they think contraceptives are. Contraception destroys the significance and union of marriage, encourages sexual immorality, denies life and denies the role God plays in creating human souls and participating in the creation of life, where every child has purpose and is special, and the people who use contraceptive for immoral purposes cement sin in themselves and condition themselves to reject natural truth and reject God, thus choosing Hell over Heaven when they die, not to mention endangering their own marriage stability. It’s no wonder why adultery and divorce rates have gone up with the profileration of contraceptives and condom.

- Nothing in life is free. Those contraceptives will not be free. Someone will be paying for them. And thsoe will be people who find it morally evil. You’d just be arguing accounting semantics.

- Non Catholics have no business demanding Catholics to violate their consciences to help them be sexually immoral. They are free to find employment elsewhere or to be ‘responsible’ and have their ‘privacy’ by buying their own contraceptives. WOuld you like your insurance companies and government to come and buy, cook and safely feed you dinner on a baby chair too?

- We preach love and forgiveness. Out of love we will inform you that contraception is evil because we do not want you to be evil, nor want you to harm others, nor want you to spread disease, nor want you to get aids from sexually immoral lifestyles. Out of love, we inform you that you are morally obligated to learn and understand what the Church teaches because someday you will die and you will risk your eternal soul on where you will go next. But should you understand and admit your sinfulness, you can turn to God who will forgive you freely and help you to overcome your sins and your faults. And you will understand what proper love, poverty, charity and forgiveness truly are.

@Adam - I think this is different if I’m understanding you correctly.  Paying taxes where some money happens to go to morally illicit programs is different than requiriing faith-based organizations and insurers to cover these morally objectionable services explicitly themselves.

Adam,

Now tell us about the Church in Canada; how the Church is limited in scope and function; how many churches have been bulldozed.  Do your homework first.  Also, remind the people how long Canada and England have been on a version of Obama-care; how long the waiting lines are for real medical treatment beyond band-aids.

@Adam: You are right Adam, that is the way it is in Canada and the UK. Also, that is why the Canadians WITH MONEY come to the U.S. if they are really sick. I also knew a Canadian doctor, personally, when I lived in VA and he moved to the States “because I could not treat my patients the way I wanted to”. His words. His whole family lives here, though they loved Canada, except for their healthcare.
Obama wants everyone to have insurance they can afford and it means if you have money you get great care, if you have little money you get lousy care.

Maia,
No, we cannot agree that increased access to contraception will decrease abortion rates.  In fact, the exact opposite is true:

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/new-study-links-contraception-hike-with-increased-abortions/

http://www.pop.org/content/presidents-page-contraception-reduces-1874

Obama is just evil. We must pray that he is voted out of office.

Where do I send thee thy kneeler so you can kneel to the demigods of the GOP????  They are not the answer be all to end all. Oh,  they lie.

Both sides lie.  Are you running for office?

Enough said. If Barack asked you to sit down and actually dialogue why you believe what you do,  would your pushiness and Pharisee like behavior be enough to sway him.  Even Jesus got mad at the Pharisees.  REad Feb 13’s Gospel.  But did you already? 

How come all you so called “I am more pro-life than you ares are not adopting older children to show just how pro-life you are?” 

But you can’t answer.  That is why many of us centrists in the Church see y’all as a buncha balloons with pissed off hot air.

You are not the Magisterium, the Catechism, the Summa,  the new saint blah blah or the Bible.  Sorry and neither is Dr. Scott Hahn.  There are entire pops IN THE Cath world who grow in the Spirit WITHOUT YOU ALL. Sorry.  You are not God.

Before this change, which is indeed worse and deceptive, the bishops could have opted to become self-insured.  They should have, immediately.  Then Obama’s change, which was predictable, would have been seen for what it is.  Our bishops are nothing if not naive, and that is putting it nicely.

Frodo: I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.
Gandalf: So do all who live to see such times; but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you were also meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought.

Obama just lost an important SCOTUS case 9-0 regarding religious entities right to hire/fire their own personnel without the assistance of POTUS. There are lawsuits filed already regarding the egregious power grab by HHS over our lives. Should those also be decided against Obama, and particularly if also by 9-0, Impeachment proceedings should be considered.  RJR

If anyone has studied history, the destruction of a government is to take away the rights of the individuals and of their religious beliefs.  God reminded Peter that Christianity & or the Church would expiernce many difficulties.  We see that today in the Holy Land and is the starting in our country.  Its divide and conquer.  We as a nation can undue what Obama is trying to impose on religion.  We have the right to vote.  It is time for all Catholics to express our objection to his mandate.  We can by praying.  Also voting to remove this scourge, that we as Christians take as an afront on our religious freedom and our first amendment.  Its amazing how ten years ago abortion was on the back burner.  Today it is up front.  We have to keep up the pressure.  Our laws come from GOD.  As He said in Luke ( which Obama left out)  render to Ceaser that is Ceaser and to God what is Gods. Not his version refering to money only.
God Bless and continue to pray.

While I support that the Church should not be subjected to infringement of its rights to conscience as guaranteed by the 1st Amendment, I have to disagree with your position here.

If you want to ask if by a Catholic moral understanding if this is bad?  Sure.  But it no longer violates the rights of the Church.  The Church itself is no longer harmed.

Now, pretty much just like always, it is up to the consumer’s conscience.

I can’t support the US bishops on this, because they already blew it.  Supporting this law was a horrible mistake, even if all the individual elements are acceptable.  Socialism is evil because (in the unanimous opinion of the ten popes who commented on socialism since 1849) it limits itself to the well being (defined in their own minds) of the people.  No thought of the afterlife.  When you’re dead, you’re dead.  What a horrible world they want to create.  The only solution is for our bishops to demand total abolishment of ObamaCare, and to finally catechize the laity regarding true Catholic moral beliefs.  They also must do something about our many apostates who hold political offices, such as Biden, Pelosi, McCaskill, and many others who have sold their souls for wealth and prestige.  The bishops must defy this “law” to the point of being imprisoned.  Maybe then we’ll get somewhere.

We have a grand daughter with Down Syndrome.  She is a bundle of energy, eats like a horse, and I’d bet she doesn’t have one percent of body fat.  Great sense of humor, and definitely her own opinions, just like most six year olds.  Today, about ninety percent of the unborn who are diagnosed with Down are aborted.  We have two friends whose pregnant wives were told their unborn children were defective and should be terminated.  Both were born perfectly normal.  How many years will it be before ObamaCare demands that ALL imperfect children be terminated?  It’s the nature of totalitarianism to destroy all competition, especially Religion, which is a higher authority than itself.  I think the Moslems are supporting the bill because it attacks Christianity.  If Obama is successful, he will turn on them, next.

I also have to comment on the hate comments directed against the Church.  I agree that is a scandal that so many bishops and their staffs acted as they did regarding the homosexual conduct of so few priests (a tiny percentage of those were pedaphiles).  They acted like any secular bureaucracy in this regard.  As shameful as all this is, studies about sexual abuse against children ALL conclude that the Catholic Church has the LEAST problem of all organizations which deal with children.  Limiting the focus to the problems in the Church is just another campaign to destroy the Church.  Incidentally, the Church has addressed the problem, and largely corrected it. 

Thomas Jablonski, St Louis, MO

@Dave

Poor women have a significantly higher rate of abortions.  Why?  Because the majority of them do not have insurance or their insurance does not cover contraceptives.  We could play this game all we want with research.  THINK LOGICALLY!!!!
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/WomensHealth/abortion-rate-poor-women/story?id=13665925#.TzlcyZUyY5A
http://www.fhi360.org/en/RH/Pubs/Network/v21_4/NWvol21-4abortcontception.htm
http://www.aidemocracy.org/students/increased-access-to-contraceptive-options-can-reduce-abortion-rates/
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/02/09/contraceptive-use-drives-teen-pregnancy-rate-to-30-year-low-study/
http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/tgr/06/4/gr060407.html

Maia,
I am thinking quite logically, thank you.  Poor women have a lot more abortions because they are more afraid that they will not be able to support the child.  In fact, they are often poor because the men who put them in the situation have abandoned them.

Contraceptive use leads to an increase in abortion for two main reasons:

First, contraceptives fail a certain percentage of the time. A 5% failure rate means that 5% of the couples using a certain method will be pregnant at the end of the year.  But since use of contraception changes their thought process, such that they now think it is “unfair” or an “accident” that she got pregnant, there is the need for abortion as a backup option to solve the “problem.”

Second, the use of contraceptives gives a false sense of security that leads to much higher rates of sexual activity. The result is more “unplanned” pregnancies and hence more abortions.

Just nasty.  Until doctors and scientists become truthful and say a baby is a baby at conception, all this nonsense will continue to our own detriment.  We get what we deserve and most Americans and American Catholics don’t understand the evil of contraception.  Let’s make it known what it really does, how it works and what it consists of to clarify! Like Dr. Bernard Nathanson said, “it is too gargantuous to turn around now.”

@Maia,
I’m an electrical engineer, very logical. Calling for more contraception is like throwing gasoline on a fire thinking it will put the fire out. What’s needed is chastity, hope and the sure knowledge that marriage, sex and babies go together. The State is telling the Church to cooperate or else. The State is the aggressor. This shall not stand.

@ maia

No, it is the other way around, you are trying to control Catholics by forcing them to become accomplices in your immorality. Next you will be telling Catholic hospitals to become accomplices in murder for abortion and euthanasia because non-catholics don’t share their beliefs. Why not invite devout Jews to join you for a pork roast too?

And contraceptives have only led to a rise in abortions. See Planned Parenthood’s own research and findings. Contraceptives have only led to an increase in sexual activity and thus simultaneously an increased chance of pregnancies when contraceptives fail. So despite that contraceptives are made to ideally prevent pregnancies, it is only to reduce the chance of pregnancy. And pregnancy reduction have a ratio equvalency to the frequency of sex. The contraceptive mentality has only led to more irresponsibvle sex, and thus more prgnancies, and thus that results in more abortions. Planned Parenthood and abortionists know this from their research data. Since they make money on abortions, it is to their financial gain to push more and more contraceptive use knowing it’ll bring in more customers for abortion due to the statistical failure rate of contraceptives, not to mention that some contraceptives are abortificents. Abortion is big business, and thanks to contraceptives encouraging sexual immorality, business has been good.

If they demand that we all pay for this, doesn’t this mean we are “putting the blood of another on our hands?”  Will we have to end our insurance policies so that we aren’t a part of the evil?  If so, then we will be dying from lack of insurance coverage.  Ironic considering they made abortion “legal” so that women wouldn’t die.  None of these irrational people’s plans make any sense until they decide to become truthful and call a spade a spade.  Abortion is murder.  Contraceptives contain abortifacients that knowlingly or unknowlingly make us guilty of manslaughter in either the first or second degree if we decide to participate in using them right??????  I mean, isn’t this how the courts work folks?  I don’t know ... I think we are on a downward spiral.  Heaven help us.  St. Michael pray for us.

I hope I go to hell.  I wouldn’t want to be stuck in heaven with all the child molesting priests, murderers who “found jesus” and all you lunatics with your blinders on.  Just think, not too long ago the Catholic church was discriminatory against blacks.  I am sure there were people just like you that thought they were an abomination and didn’t deserve to share a pew in church.  You say “that would never be me!”  Well, take a long hard look at yourselves.  Someday your kids are going to look back at your beliefs on contraceptives and gays and I hope you are all ashamed of yourselves.  Take a look at this picture: http://i.imgur.com/oy2PF.jpg
The Catholics do not have a history to be proud of.  That doesn’t always have to be the case.  Learn from mistakes and go forward.

Joshua,
Who says that the child molesting priests will go to Heaven?  They may, but only if they are truly repentant.  Otherwise, they’ll be in the depths of Hell, where you say you want to be.

I suppose Catholics don’t have a good history, if you look at all the bad things, and exclude all the good.  There are always Judases, but don’t forget that there were 11 other apostles.

The Catholic Church was a lot better than most religions in their treatment of blacks.  There weren’t many Catholics in the South.

I absolutely love your defense of the Catholic church’s history in treatment of blacks. My point proven. Religions only bring like-minded people together, causing segregation from the rest of the people in the world.

Posted by Sue (old) on Sunday, Feb 12, 2012 2:49 PM (EST):Right on Johnno: Bob Rodriquez does not seem to know what the sin of gluttony is all about.  To put it simply, if you eat too much you will get sick and vomit along with getting obese & other sicknesses.  If you have as much sex as you want, like an animal,  then your brain dries up. Simple. LESSON: Every law God has given us is for our GOOD.

Sorry to say but from my observations as a forty-something single person I think that getting married and becoming sexually active seems to make people’s brains dry up.

Great article on NFP:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/guest-voices/post/catholic-women-and-contraception-why-dont-catholics-use-natural-family-planning/2012/02/13/gIQAyZ3fBR_blog.html

@ Johnno – Wow, the love and forgiveness is overwhelming. So if I understand you correctly….
- Obama doesn’t agree with some minor Catholic views, so he is not a true Christian. Catholics have the true version of Christianity; all other versions are false and therefore not true Christianity. I was born, raised, and educated Catholic, my kids go to Catholic school, and we go to church regularly. So when you claim that “this is why we have this big problem here”, I’m part of the “we”. I suppose you will say that I’m not a true Catholic, and therefore not a true Christian. If this is your definition, then I guess you’re right.
- “rampant liberalism” and “pro-pedophilia academia” have “fostered the sex abuse crisis within the Church”. This is almost too crazy to type, let alone think. Let the blame fall where it belongs. It’s not only the crimes that are appalling, it’s the cover-up by the senior leadership, including the current Pope, that failed to prevent countless more children from being victimized.
-when you make statements like “ideological eugenist and population control agendas”, you disqualify yourself from engaging in rational discussions regarding a fellow Christian’s efforts to provide care for those who clamor for it. You may disagree, but statements like this betray your ignorance.
- “condoms have only made the situation worse” and “the rates of cancer and STDs that have gone up due to contraceptive use” is not supported by any evidence. Condom use in N. America has reduced the spread of diseases like AIDS and other STDs, but in Africa where the Catholic church (among others) discourages condom use, the spread of AIDS is rampant. Brother please.
-church morality and doctrine is not determined by democratic vote, nor does how the majority of its members feel. The church doctrines are what you must believe, or you’re not a Catholic. Actually, I must agree with you here.
-the “free contraceptives” are not really free, it’s simply accounting semantics. Incorrect - the insurance companies are willing to provide it free to the members of the health care plan, because they know it will save them money in treatment costs by helping those members prevent disease, abortions, etc. Even if this was semantics, why do you care? The church isn’t funding it.
- private insurance companies providing free contraceptives = demanding Catholics to violate their consciences = wanting “the government to come and buy, cook and safely feed you dinner on a baby chair”. That’s quite a leap.
- “we preach love and forgiveness”.  Your hate of a fellow Christian who disagrees on such a minor point of Catholic doctrine is truly shameful. The Catholic church objected to their organizations being obliged to fund contraception services to all employees. It’s actually a very valid objection, since the church is explicit on its position on contraception. But I fail to understand the need for the hateful rants when Obama actually agreed with the church and thus removed this requirement. The church wins, the employees win, the insurance companies win.
Turn off Fox News and channel your rage towards supporting the GOP this fall, who seem to have no shortage of people who you probably feel are “truer” Christians than Obama. You can support the serial-adulterer Catholic, or the wing-nut Catholic who without a trace of irony wants to protect unborn babies from murder but advocates unilaterally bombing thousands to death in Iran, or perhaps even the Mormon candidate, who I suspect you already hate because he has the wrong interpretation of Christianity.
Love thy neighbor bro.

Excellent article. After reading the Health Care BILL (and it took 2 1/2 months) This legislation took this country into Socialism-Communism. I am angered that
our Bishops even considered counciling with this corrupt man. Now they want to converse again ?  Forget it, You can’t change Evil and take back our first amendment rights. You have made a pack with the Devil who is deteremined to destroy this country and pit one race against another.We have secularism run rampant in the Catholic Church. It is disgusting and
hard to attend mass.I pray God forgive the Priest that have the souls of
so many in their keep and have turned a blind eye. To do nothing is to speak
loudly for all catholics to see. Where are our Constitutional catholics ?

For heaven’s sake!  The Catholic Church began speaking out against slavery with Pope Eugene IV back in the 1400s.  Without the Church we’d probably still have it.  Please! Find out what you bigots are talking about before publishing you foolishness.  The Internet is a great place to do research, but you need to verify what you find there before taking it for granted..

Science has already determined that a one cell fertilized egg has a unique set of DNA which will not change for the PERSON’S lifetime.  A heart beat starts by the 18th day.  Brain activity is not far behind.  Etc, Etc.  if that’s not a human being, scientifically defined, what is?  Denying the facts is a lie on which pro aborts and pro contractives depend.

So unfaithful Catholics widely use birth control.  That doesn’t negate the fact that birth control is objectively immoral.  In nature, sex is for prorating the species.  What is so difficult to understand about that?  If you birth control advocates have your way, it won’t be long before only Catholics and Moslems will occupy the earth.  At least we’ll for sure what we have to contend with.

Please pray for our bishops, even more than for Obama and his minions in the press and elsewhere.  Therein lies our only hope.  Unless they return to the Faith, we are doomed.

Tom Jablonski, St Louis, MO

@Tom Jablonski. Thank you, well said. For a beautiful exposition of where Obama is headed and why go to:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/02/whom_the_gods_would_destroy.html
The Manchurian Candidate comparison is apt. One way or another he has indeed been programmed. He is perhaps taking on more than he can control—but he is banking on more people voting to get $$ and similar benefits than people who vote for moral values. The Catholics who voted in the majority for Obama were minorities, according to the poll I saw. They see immediate benefits coming to them and obviously do not realize they are handing over their liberty, bit by bit. If everyone voted their conscience rather than their pocketbook, Obama would be out of office come January.
Please, God, give us light and courage to do the right!
Baruch 4:21-22 Catholic OT

Take courage, my children, call on God: he will deliver you from tyranny, from the hands of your enemies; for I look to the Eternal for your rescue, and joy has come to me from the Holy One at the mercy soon to reach you from your saviour, the Eternal.

I see all these references to our first amendment rights.  We have no first amendment rights, nor any other amendment rights.  The Bill of Rights grants no rights, it forbids the government from our Natural, God given rights.  Reading our Bishops’ letter, even they bow to the State.  When they say our Founding Fathers granted us the right to worship God as we see fit, they implicitly bow to the idea that if the Courts decide that the first amendment is not consistent with modern society (that Living Document, you know), they will have no moral, philosophical, or legal basis for refusing to worship at the altar of ObamaCare, which will have been established as our National Religion, and Obama will have no coherent opposition.

Tom Jablonski, St Louis, MO

As a proud supporter of President Obama, I say to all the Obama haters on this comment board, keep it up!  I’m sure you have a winning strategy here.  Yeah.  No doubt about it.  Catholics expressing a deep and abiding hatred for the leader of the free world.  That’s going to win you a lot of votes in the fall.  In fact, I think you folks should sponsor a contest:  Who can say the most disgusting, vile and hateful things about the President?  Jesus would be so proud of you.

Oh, our pious devout Orthodox Bishops have awoken, have they ? How many of them voted for the OB,  danced with the devil and supported OB abortion care ? Oh yes, our double talking OB Czar promised the “open minded” Bishops to love life and instead he decided to put it up their keisters. They ignored the fact he is the Planned Parenthood President. I ask you fellow Catholics and Patriots,  is it the unborn[54 million murdered and counting] our Holy Bishops care about or is it the fact that their church sponsored health care premiums are going up, up, up to pay for contraceptives, abortifacients and abortions ? “You aint seen nothing yet” as OB “fundamentally transforms” us.  Imagine if those good Kennedy catholics Biden, Pelosi, Sebelius, Kerry, Chris Matthews, et. als. decide it is unlawful discrimination not to marry the gangsters, I mean gaysters ? Imagine our Catholic hospitals being forced to provide abortions or being closed down. Is Holy Eucharist being denied to public figures who obstinately promote grave sin [abortion] ? Was Phony Father Jenkins ever threatened with ex-communication for inviting the OB to speak on the once holy grounds of ND ? Was Georgetown ever reprimanded for covering up images of J.C.? Was Georgetown’s Newman Society ever disciplined for schmoozing and fund raising with Elvira Pelosi ? Did anybody ever answer why our hard earned church donation envelope was giving money to Acorn ?  Of course not. I know, it’s that good old catholic “social justice”. After all, Jesus Christ was a communist, right ? DO AS YOU ARE TOLD or I will cast a 501©(3) spell on you,  Bi Chops. Being “Catholic” get’s to be a bit challenging after you’ve taken the “30 pieces of silver” ! Just ask Judas Iscariot.

From my understanding, Pres. Obama got about 53% of the Catholic vote.  After hearing of his history in Jeremiah Wright’s church, and his vote in the Senate concerning the refusal of medical care and disposal of children who survive botched abortions, I’m wondering how many Catholics actually did any reflection on their vote for this man.  Also, the more progressive Catholic priests and nuns who not only voted for him, but pushed his “collective” salvation of universal health care under government control (a Marxist concept)-did you not consider the fact that you were crawling into bed with someone disingenuous? Perhaps someone who may come back and bite you in behind concerning your core beliefs later on?  If you can’t recognize evil in someone’s past choices, how do you ever think that you can prevent evil choices from becoming the law of the land further down the road? Seems to me that there was a moral sell-out of core principles for a progressive leaning in both the Church hierarchy and the congregation as well.  Shame on us all.

Excellent exchange and I am pleased so many catholics see how we have been
betrayed by liberal-social justice Bishops. Whatever happen to ‘Moral Justice”? Are these Bishops reading the scriptures or making up their own.
Its time for Bishops to step forward and defend our First Amendment Rights.Its amazing that the liberal left isn’t reading any of this Legislation and have never read the Constitution which America was founded on.You can’t have a desent conversation with a person who isn’t reading the Legislation and BO’s Executive Orders.

It seems to me that the bishops are missing a HUGE opportunity here.  They could offer an alternative coverage, which would be free NFP classes for all of their employees.  They could even promote it as the healthy, GREEN alternative to chemicals.  They could take warnings and statistics straight from the package inserts on pills and IUDs, etc. and educate the public about them. They could say, Look, we have X number of employees and, statistically, birth control pills will give X number of them breast cancer, and X number of them fatal blood clots.  We think that’s unacceptable.  So instead, we’ll offer them free NFP classes, so they’re not punished with a tumor/blood clot/whatever.  They could also discuss the chemical pollution and fish malformations we have now thanks to BC pills, and show how NFP is the green, natural alternative.  Don’t just keep rejecting the Obama plans. Put forth a real, intelligent, sane, doable alternative.

A petition has been started by the Becket Fund:

http://www.becketfund.org/ibelievepetition/

I don’t see why you just don’t cut your employees’ hours to part time and don’t pay for their insurance. Then it would be up to the employee as to whether they want to pay for contraceptives along with their own health care. Other business are doing so.
OR
Why don’t Catholics sponsor their own insurance companies and refuse to include contraceptive in their policies?
Get proactive, people!

Great post, SusanHG…that’s exactly what the Bishops should be doing.  But under the monstrosity that is ObamaCare, is that even legal?

Susan,good thought & here is another one: Obama is a GREEN PRESIDENT, meaning he wants us to use organic vegetables; don’t put chemicals on your lawn, it goes into the water system and we drink poison….don’t smoke…eat the proper foods every day….cows and chickens are not suppose to be injected with hormones, because it would upset our hormone system when we ingest their milk and meat… we can’t drill for oil or dig for coal, because the air we breath would be poisonous & I could go on & on…..but he thinks we females should ingest chemicals to keep us from getting pregnant….he picks and chooses what is natural. Mr. Green President, we are HUMAN BEINGS, NOT ANIMAL AND NOT VEGETABLE, SO PLEASE, STAY OUT OF OUR PERSONAL LIVES.
@ The bloggers: I am not being funny, this is how ridiculous things have become;
also I had a wonderful husband so I am not against men, but why has he not mentioned the men in his plans, hmmmmm Ego ;o)

@ Johnno.  I’ve carefully read all your posts and found nothing except your desire to speak the Truth, to point out the real material and spiritual consequences of immoral and unnatural behavior, and to ask people to turn to God.  There is no hint of hate or intolerance in anything you say.  I am not surprised at the vicious ad hominum attacks directed at you.  These come from people who recognize the truth in what you say, and who can’t build any kind of coherent response.  They can’t refute the message, so they attack the messenger.  Wear those attacks as a badge of honor.  Do not fall into the error of resenting those folks.  That would make you like them.  Pray for them that receive God’s mercy, and that they recognize that God wants them on His side.  Don’t forget: WE are the Church Militant.  It’s up to us to fight the good fight. God bless you.

Thomas Jablonski, St Louis, MO

Great idea Chuck! Then if they or their children get sick or hurt, they can just mortgage their home to pay for the treatment. As an added bonus the reduction in their income by cutting their hours would leave them less money to pay for evil birth control, even if they want it! Sad for them, but hey, at least you’re thinking outside the box Chuck!

Thomas - apologize for this “ad hominum” (sic) attack, but I find it hard to accept that a person with elementary school reading skills could claim to read Johnno’s hateful bile and find “no hint of hate or intolerance”. Here’s just a few gems gleaned from his/her past few posts:
-“Obama is as much a Christian as Judas Iscariot”
-“The fact that this never occurred to you only goes to show how your contraceptive sex filled brain has blocked off your thinking juices from reaching your brain to consider all these things(responding to a male)
-“pro-pedophilia academia” (WTF?)
-“ideological eugenist and population control agendas” (speaking about the democatically elected and lifelong Christian president)
-Obama plans to somehow “take away freedoms granted by the American constitution to impose his tyranical desires”
-“Catholics don’t care for his “false faith” (hint - not Catholic)

Regardless, I haven’t seen any rational response to what is the core issue here - the president has publicly and explicitly revised his stance so that church institutions are NOT required to fund the services to which they morally object. Why the outrage? Didn’t you win this battle?

If you want to argue that NOBODY should have contraceptives, fine, you’re entitled to think that, and even proclaim it, but don’t try to impose it on others who don’t share your religious views. You’re in the minority, even amoung your fellow Catholics, like me.

The fact is is that Obama has not changed one bit.  When he was running for President, he declared that if one of his daughters got into trouble, he would gladly let her have an abortion.

This and other things he said should have signaled a red flag warning but too many of our Bishops and parish priests weren’t listening.

Our pastor in fact revealed that he would vote for Obama precisely because of his health care mandate, overlooking his approval of abortion.

We sure need better information for Catholics on what the Church teaches since many see nothing wrong in contraception for example.  Perhaps some of the Bishops could install some type of program in every diocese to see that this is openly discussed.  If they’ve done that with “stewardship” they sure could do that with this.

@Mark: “Regardless, I haven’t seen any rational response to what is the core issue here - the president has publicly and explicitly revised his stance so that church institutions are NOT required to fund the services to which they morally object. Why the outrage?”

Err, why that question?  The article we’re all commenting on already explained why church institutions are still paying for these objectionable services, even though Obama is trying to make it sound like they are not. Granted, I’ve come into this particular discussion a bit late.

@Mark. Just a few observations regarding your response to me.
You object to Johnno’s comparing the “Christian” president to Judas Iscariot.  You know, the president who spent his formative in the “Reverend” Wright’s church damning America, not blessing it; the president who promised to abort his grandchild if his daughter mad a mistake; the Christian president who gave one percent of his income to charity last year; the constitutional scholar who is now telling others what they must believe or be fined.  That “Christian” president?  He has rejected about as much of our Lord’s message as Judas.
Your objection to Johnno’s comment to Bob Rodriguez’s contraceptive sex filled brain:  How else would you describe one thinks it may be better to die than to abstain for just day?
Pro-pedophilia:  early on in his administration, a spokesperson said she would like to drop the age of consent to twelve, as an interim step to full freedom.
Ideological eugenist and population control agendas:  The president fully supports PP and it’s population control and racist, YES racist agenda.  Margaret Sanger founded Planned Parenthood with the aim of eliminating the black race.  Talk about eating your young. 
You talk about our lifelong Christian and democratically elected president.  I think his devout Christianity matches yours.  Democratically elected?  So you will/must support Mr Santorum if he’s elected?
Catholics don’t care for his false faith:  too bad you don’t have elementary school reading skills.  If you did, you would plainly have read that Johnno explicitly noted that Christians of other non-Catholic beliefs agree with us on this matter.
Well, I agree with you on one matter.  The president is NOT trying to take away freedoms granted by the constitution.  The constitution doesn’t grant any freedoms.  It constrains the government from interfering with our God-given “unalienable” rights.  The president is trying to do just that.
And next to last.  The president has not given a waiver to “church institutions” on this matter.  All Catholic institutions which follow our Lord’s command to care for the poor, etc will be forced to finance immoral activities.
Finally, up to 1930, all Christianity was united in it’s opposition to contraception and abortion.  Then our unity on these practices was broken.  But while we Catholics remain faithful in these matters, we also stand with Aquinas, who stated that the number of laws should remain limited.  We should not outlaw all sinful practices.  Neither should we be obliged to finance them.

I will pray for you.

Tom Jablonski, St Louis, MO

Thomas Jablonski, your post was In great part sinful.  For example, Obama was not “the president who promised to abort his grandchild if his daughter mad a mistake.”  No, what he said while talking about education was he didn’t want his daughters to be punished with a baby, and if you interpreted that as promising to abort his grandchildren, well, that is your doing, not Obama’s.  Likewise, Obama is not “the Christian president who gave one percent of his income to charity last year.”  The Obamas tax return filed last year showed the he donated $245,075 to charities, or 14.2 percent of their adjusted gross income of $1.7 million.  And so forth.

@Thomas.  Wow, where to begin, I don’t anticipate a fruitful exchange of ideas here. First of all, your intolerance and hatred for others who don’t agree with every jot and tittle of Catholic dogma (like the overwhelming majority of those calling themselves Catholic) is astounding. This kind of discourse only contributes to the sorry state of politics and religious discussion in this country. I can only imagine the degree of hatred you have for the non-Christian religions. Eliza is correct -statements like “the president who promised to abort his grandchild” might be clever table talk on Neptune where you live, but you know it’s false, he never uttered those words and you know it. His charitable donations in 2010 were approx. 14 % of his earned income or $245,000, anyone can google it. I suppose it’s possible he only gave 1% this year (2011) but since tax returns aren’t due yet, I have no idea how you could have this information. I suspect you are just making it up, just like the quote about Obama promising to abort his grandchild.

Pro-pedophilia: actually I was simply poking fun at the “pro-pedophilia academia” statement, but this takes it to a whole new level of crazy. Now you are inferring that the president’s own administration supports pedophilia! I can’t find any reference anywhere to an Obama spokesperson claimed she would like to drop the age of consent to 12. Would a man with 2 young daughters advocate that? Would anyone except a hardened pedophile advocate that, and even then actually make a public statement to support that? Don’t you think the GOP would be putting up billboards with that on it if anyone in his administration had uttered such a statement? You are bonkers my friend, and rational discourse is not possible with those like you and your moon-base pal Johnno.

The president fully supports Planned Parenthood. So does the majority of the population, because it is better to prevent unwanted pregnancies than to increase the number of women who legally or illegally abort their babies. 90+ percent of women use contraception in this country. I suppose in one sense it is population control, but not in the evil sense like the “government is limiting your family size” or a 1 child policy. But do go on, I’d love to hear how his agenda is racist - that should be an entertaining read. Sure, Margaret Sanger (who has been dead for 45 years) was a racist who thought the black race was inferior, but she was vehemently opposed to abortion. Somehow you conclude that: the president supports planned parenthood = founder of predecessor to planned parenthood in 1916 was racist = president has a racist agenda. You do know he’s black right? Wait, there’s more -  his agenda is also “eugenist” which conjures up images of forced sterilization and Nazi’s. Nice touch, love to hear how you spin this one.

And now that we’re past the Obama bashing, we arrive again at the core issue, which is what the article is about. The president has INDEED given a waiver to “church institutions” on this matter. The false argument that has stirred up all the fundamentalist Catholics here is that the contraceptives are really not being supplied “free”, the institutions are still somehow paying for them. This is utter crap - the hardcore rants about the evils of birth-control and sex for any other reason than to create children betrays your true intentions. You simply don’t want anyone to use contraception because you consider it evil. The insurance industry has stated publicly that their own analysis shows it is cheaper to provide contraceptive care than to not. It makes them more profitable, which is the goal and duty of any private sector corporation. Why wouldn’t they offer it for free? They know that it’s more expensive to treat a group of people they insure for unwanted pregnancies and STD’s, and providing contraceptives reduce this cost. I suppose you’ll argue that the boards of directors of the major health insurance companies have been infiltrated with secret racist eugenists (with Obama’s tyrannical support of course).

Thomas, you are a hateful, narrow-minded, bigot. You give cover to the evil and rot at the highest levels of this church. You are a large part of the reason people are leaving the church in droves in North America. Statements like the Catholic church “acted like any secular bureaucracy in this regard” when referring to the cover-up and perpetuation of child abuse for decades or longer pretty faint praise. It’s not just any secular bureaucracy Thomas, it’s the freaking Holy Catholic Church for crying out loud. People entrusted their precious kids to their care, and the church betrayed that trust. Look what happened at secular Penn State – people were fired and many are going to prison. The Cardinal who was once complicit in allowing the abuse to continue by failing to act is now the Pope. Don’t pray for me, pray for the church instead, it’s sad what it has become. Pray that they focus on Jesus’ teachings and adapt to the modern world. Pray that you learn to love and understand others, not preach hatred, intolerance, and spread lies about people who don’t share your narrow-minded 16th century views.

Mark,
The only problem is that contraception actually increases abortion.  See these two links:

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/new-study-links-contraception-hike-with-increased-abortions/
http://www.pop.org/content/presidents-page-contraception-reduces-1874

Contraceptive use leads to an increase in abortion for two main reasons:
First, contraceptives fail a certain percentage of the time. A 5% failure rate means that 5% of the couples using a certain method will be pregnant at the end of the year.  But since use of contraception changes their thought process, such that they now think it is “unfair” or an “accident” that she got pregnant, there is the need for abortion as a backup option to solve the “problem.”
Second, the use of contraceptives gives a false sense of security that leads to much higher rates of sexual activity. The result is more “unplanned” pregnancies and hence more abortions.

@Mark: No one in life gets anything “free”.  Someone pays for it. As to the Insurance Companies; most insurances, like homeowners, have package insurance, meaning they insure you and charge you for what you do not have on your property.[I may not have a shed, but it is covered] I am 85, paying auto ins. since I was 21 and have never had an accident. Wonder where my money went?.....it paid for those who have had accidents. As to the free contraceptives, it will be buried into other health insurances. Even your kids don’t get anything free, their dad/mom are paying for it. So please don’t say the insurance companies are giving it free because is lessens the cost of abortions. NOTHING IS FREE!!!

@ Eliza:Mr Obama, in the 2008 campaign said he did not wan his daughter to be burdened with a child if she “made a mistake”.  What other interpretation can you give that?  My apologies for remarks about Obama’s giving.  I took Mike Huckabees’s remarks to mean Obama’s current giving, when he obviously was referring to his pre-2005 average of just over one percent.  Sloppy research on my part.
@ Mark:  I apologized above for my use of Mike Huckabee’s statement.  That doesn’t negate the other facts about Obama’s attendance at Rev Wright’s church, and the other comments about his background.  I don’t have a record of the other things I covered, but those attitudes were present in the 2008 campaign and soon afterward.  What I didn’t mention were then-Obama Communications Director Anita Dunn expressing admiration for Mao Tse-tung and the White House’s defense of her statement that Mao was her favorite philosopher.  One of history’s greatest mass murderers, admired by both Obama and his former Communications Director.  Others have defended Obama’s saying positive things about Mao.  Nor did I mention Obama’s former science John Holdren advisor stating that a baby “will eventually become a human being”.  Nice Christian attitudes, don’t you think?  Is it hate-mongering to bring these up?  As noted elsewhere, contraception increases, not decreases, the “need” for abortion.
Are you saying only white people can be racist?  Wow.  Racism is wrong, no matter who embraces it.
You mention how contraception reduces health care, since such devices are less expensive than children.  So you put a price tag on the value of a human life.  And I’m the one who is hateful?
It is a lie that all Church institutions are exempt from the mandate.  Schools, charities, and any other church organization or church affiliated organization such as the Knight of Columbus are not exempt.  Please get your facts straight.  I am not arguing that the health care industry is infiltrated by “secret racist eugenists”.  I am arguing that such attitudes were present in the administration.
I was not “covering up” for anyone in the Church involved in the sex abuse scandal.  I am saying that these people are human beings, with all human failings like all of us and that they made things worse by their actions.  As to Penn State, the abuses recently made public reinforces my point.  The Penn State abuses also took place years ago, and were only made public when someone exposed them.  Neither the Church authorities nor the Penn State authorities acted as they should have.  The guilty should pay the price, no matter who they are.  It is curious that an extension of the statute of limitations was changed in some venues only for abuses in the Church, and nowhere else.  Isn’t that an example bigotry, Mark?
As to the Holy Father, there is no proof of any kind that he was involved in a cover up of sex abuse cases.  His letter regarding internal church investigations was just that, a letter which applied only to internal church activities.  He did NOT direct that secular investigations be resisted.
Where have I preached hatred?  Mark, disagreeing with you is not preaching hatred.  You should know that, seeing your extreme disagreement with the thrust of the article, and with anyone who agrees with it, but obviously that is not the case.  I have no hatred for you or anyone else on your side.  I do wish to temper the intolerance in your remarks and hatred of the Church.  It is strange, going through the comments in this and practically any other blog, that the word “hate” is most prevalent in hate-filled comments directed at people who are actively looking for reason and discourse regarding volatile subjects.  You can’t refute the message, so you attack the messenger.
By the way, what is a “tittle” used in your opening remarks?

Thomas Jablonski, St Louis, MO

@Thomas - “Jot and tittle” is from Matthew 5:18, but I’m referring to the narrow thinking of literalists who dwell on the concept of biblical inerrancy, focusing on the minutiae of scripture rather than the general message.

Regarding Obama comments about his daughter, that is correct what he said. However I challenge any fair reader to equate “not wanting his daughter to be burdened with a child” with “promises to abort his grandchild” as you interpret it. He was talking about education and birth control. You may say this is about abortion, but if you watch the clip or read the transcript, it’s clear that like any father, he wouldn’t want his young daughter to make a mistake and become pregnant at a young age. Your boy Santorum would discourage his young daughter (I think she’s 13) from abortion, even if she was raped. Can you imagine wanting your grade school daughter to carry the child of someone who raped her and give birth? Who would you rather have as a father?

Anita Dunn was addressing a high school high school graduation and referenced Mao Zedong and Mother Teresa as two of her “favorite political philosophers”. It was meant to be ironic. Funny or not, that’s how it was meant. Yet you take the enormous leap to equating a white house staffer trying to be entertaining at a high-school graduation ceremony to Mao is “admired by Obama”.  Anita Dunn isn’t speaking for Obama, John Holdren doesn’t speak for Obama.  How can anyone have a rational conversation with you when one must continually put out these little fires you start?

You earnestly ask: “Is it hate-mongering to bring these up?” Of course it is, because as anyone who takes the time to research your outrageous statements can verify, your statements are false. Implying that Obama admires mass-murderers, is racist, hates America, doesn’t donate enough to charity, promises to abort his grandchild, isn’t really Christian, etc. is hatred because you made it up. That’s what hate-mongering is, or as the Bible calls it, bearing false witness.

When you return from Neptune, do some research on the Holy Father.  After his promotion to cardinal, he was put in charge of the so-called “Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith” (formerly known as the Inquisition).  Pope John Paul II placed this department in charge of the investigation of child abuse by Catholic priests. In May of 2001, Ratzinger issued a confidential letter to every bishop. In it, he reminded them of the extreme gravity of a certain crime - but that crime was not the rape and torture of children. It was the reporting of those crimes to secular authorities. This is a cover up, and he should be held accountable.

But the issue here is whether Catholic institutions are truly exempt from paying for contraceptive services. Plainly, they are not required to pay for it; the insurance industry will provide it free because they make more money. Spin this all you want by saying that nothing is really free. Note to Sue – repeating the same thing over and over doesn’t make it true – but I will agree with your premise that all the money that the insurance companies collect gets buried into other health services. They don’t divide up all the premiums they collect into little piles allocated for various health care claims, the premiums are essentially pooled and they reimburse the health care providers from those revenues. So I suppose that, indirectly, insurance premiums from Catholic institutions will go to fund these services.

But I still maintain that this isn’t the same as paying for contraceptives. These same companies insure thousands of secular organizations who provide coverage for contraception. By your logic, even if the church gets its way on this, by paying premiums to insurance companies that fund these services for other employers, the dilemma remains. After all, the money all gets buried. There is clearly no solution that will satisfy the fundamentalists.

@ Mark.  I’m not familiar with the version of the Bible you are quoting.  The versions I am familiar with use the words “dot” and “iota”.  If you want to embarrass me with the use of obscure words, you can congratulate yourself.  If you are accusing me of trying to live my life as Jesus wants me to, and as taught by the Church He founded, I plead guilty.  I am not a “cafeteria Catholic” who picks and chooses the doctrines I like and rejects those I find hard.  I don’t always succeed, but I do endeavor to live up to ALL of Jesus’ teachings.
Obama’s comments are about him not wanting his daughter “making a mistake and being punished with a child”.  Punished?  Children are a gift from God, and are never a punishment.  As to your extraneous remark about rape, it is extremely rare for a violent rape to result in a pregnancy.  In any event, even in this very distressful circumstance, it is still wrong to give the child a death sentence.  The Church’s rejection of contraception and abortion go back to the Didache, a late first century catechism.  The Church has spoken out consistently and forcefully against these evils for 2000 years.
Obama did put an ornament with Mao’s image on it on the White House Christmas tree.  So you say it’s hateful for me to this up?  As far as Anita Dunn and John Holdren not speaking for Obama, the president did say: If you want to see what I stand for, see who I surround myself with.  So, do they speak for him when making public, prepared statements, or not?  And, don’t put words in my mouth, which you continually do.  Santorum is NOT “my boy”.  I admire him for this courageous stance, but I am not a supporter of his.  Shame on you for inserting this misleading and hostile comment.
And, oh yes, make sure you put the word “inquisition” in there somewhere.  I’m not going to go into something so far away from this subject.  But could you please provide a link to substantiate your accusation that Joseph Ratzinger directed that any secular investigations into the homosexual scandal be resisted? 
Your repeated references to “Neptune” are childish.  Grow up.
Your emphasis on funding contraception, sterilization,and abortive pills being less expensive than children is not the issue (the fact that you still put a dollar value on human life, though, is telling).  As noted, the Church has always condemned both abortion and contraception.  Experience shows that when you make sex a recreational sport via contraception, it leads to all kinds of unintended consequences: more, not less abortion; extra-marital activities; homosexual activity (after all, if sex is just about fun and purposely not open to procreation, why not try different ways to have fun).  Is bestiality next?  And again, don’t ridicule me for that last statement; there already was a “man” in Great Britain who filed for license to marry his dog.  Experience and statistics prove these assertions, these are not “my opinion”.  And don’t twist my words to say I want to limit sexual conduct to just those of child-bearing age.  That is NOT the teaching of Jesus, and it is nor is it biblical.
And, I’m getting tired of this.  If you can’t come up with something new, and can’t put anything in more charitable words, let’s make this the last exchange.  I would like to see the source on which you base your slander the Holy Father.

Thomas Jablonski, St Louis, MO

@Thomas
In your statement, you mentioned that contraception leads to homosexual activity. Why is being homosexual a sin?  I am honestly interested in your opinion and how you came to those conclusions.

How much did the GOP catholic ticket demigods pay to get your votes?

Before I eat my turkey sandwich on a Friday, just answer that q. 

How much $$$—billions are we sending to China by shopping at Walmart or any store that has the majority of our stuff that we buy on a daily basis that is Made in China.  Now be smart about this AND PAY ATTENTION: WHAT DOES CHINA DO WITH THE MONEY OR FUNDS THEY MAKE OFF OF US? 

REad this slowly:  with that money they get from us in their businesses over there,  a portion, a large portion of it goes to pay for one child policy and abortions that are mandated by the government.

Now read it again a few more times. Remember to read it slowly. 

Play it smart folks.  How about a large bill that plays it one thing at a time, so other groups that are not us will not laugh at us.

Sorry but this is why they are laughing at us. They laugh because they have our pocket strings EITHER WAY. And we believe EVERYTHING THE GOP SAYS. We need to take our Pro-life stuff and stand up like that Wall Street group and tell them we will not vote for them until we get what we want. 90 percent of the businesses support abortion. Yes, I wrote that and yes, you have to admit that they believe having kids is an interruption to their slave of production and greed. 

Take a look at the whole picture and not a wee bit of it.

@ Joshua.  Joshua, I appreciate the respectful tone of your query.  I acknowledge that in some of my posts I have been a little less than charitable, but my intent was to try to uphold the Church, while (not always successfully) trying to not purposely condemn anyone.  I probably never will learn not to overreact when I’m stressed.
The Church teaches (and it makes absolute sense) that temptations are not sinful, so it follows that being homosexual (or having temptations to commit any other sin) is not sinful.  It is our willful decision to give in to any temptation that is sinful. 
I thought what I said was included in Humanae Vitae as a warning regarding the consequences of contraception, but I was mistaken (the older I get, the more difficult it is to remember things).  I know I have read articles that cite studies connecting the contraception mentality to an increase in homosexual activities, as well as to increased adultery and abortion, but I can’t find any of them right now.  Increased adultery and abortion are pretty intuitive here, but the connection to homosexual leanings is not.  It’s been some time since I read those articles, and they have gone down my “memory hole”. 
Humanae Vitae para 17 points to how the use of contraception by married couples (and by implication unmarried couples) leads to a cheapening of the conjugal act, and to reduction of the wife to an object of pleasure rather than a “respected and beloved companion”, but it does not go further.  An article by Jeff Mirus at http://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/articles.cfm?id=179 does make the connection deductively, but does not statistically document this.  As I said above, I have seen studies cited which reinforce Mr Mirus’ conclusion. 
There is a good article by a homosexual man at http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/column.php?n=2037 and the struggles he has. 
No one seems to know for sure WHY some people have homosexual leanings.  Some say some childhood experience leads to it, others say it is innate in an individual person’s nature.  Some say this tendency can be “cured”, others not.  Probably the national secular “if it feels good do it” culture contributes greatly.  Sex saturates practically everything we are exposed to.  The only thing we can say for sure is that we all have temptations, we all occasionally fall, and no one should be condemned for any of this.  We should also all be aware, in my opinion, that sins of weakness are much less culpable than sins we commit with not just full, but enthusiastic, consent of the will.  The good news is that God is very forgiving to us all.
Sorry I couldn’t cite the exact studies which make this connection, but these are my thoughts on the matter.
God Bless.

Tom Jablonski St Louis, MO

Lets keep in mind that todays evil happens because authentic Catholics did not come out of their closet ‘yesterday’ to prevent it. ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’. One can only pray that the same authentic Catholics woke up or will wake up and get into gear!

@Joshua.  Joshua, I have responded to your query.  Should have been posted yesterday.  I’ve had some comments delayed because the firewall thinks they’re spam.  All but this one got through eventually.  We will be away for the weekend, so if it doesn’t get posted, I’ll try to see what happened and/or resubmit it.  But the short answer is that homosexuality is NOT a sin anymore than the temptation to commit any other sin is immoral.  Talk to you Monday or Tuesday.  Regards, Tom Jablonski, T Louis, MO

Mark, Mark, you have cleary missed the mark and, I don’t know if you are a practicing Catholic and if you are, then you are in the catagory of Sibelise and Palosi, a cafeteria Catholic. 

Anyway, I never voted for Hussein Obama, I thoroughly investigated his background and I didn’t like his policies then and more so, now!  This guy is the precursor to the anti christ as far as I’m concerned.

Yep, spam filters wouldn’t accept my reply to Thomas a few days ago, although I suppose the exchange has gotten out of hand. When I pointed out that, yes, it is hate-mongering to spread misinformation (nice to see others finally correcting the garbage he trots out here) his reply is that Obama put Mao ornaments on the white house Christmas tree. And then some crap about how contraception leads to homosexuality, and inevitably, bestiality. After all, some guy married his dog. I suppose that put me over the edge.

The Humanae Vitae (1968) tells Catholics what to think about contraception. Some here seem to buy it, but thankfully only a small minority of Catholics (including councils of Catholic bishops from most western countries) agree with the Vatican on this. Clearly then the majority of these people are cafeteria Catholics like me, as are the vast majority of Catholic women whom have used contraception. They refuse to allow dogmatic old men who have never been married to require that they believe that contraception cheapens the conjugal act. I have never fully understood how NFP advocates (a vanishingly small percentage of people anyways) reconcile the fact that NFP provides a way to have sex in such a way that it avoids pregnancy. How is this any different?

So for all you ultra-pious Catholics (not cafeteria like me), how do you reconcile the following beliefs of the dogmatic Catholic Santorum?
- Pope John Paul II was against the war against Iraq. Santorum ignored that Catholic teaching.
- The Conference of Catholic Bishops requires that health care be provided to all Americans. Rick Santorum’s opposition to universal health care is a betrayal of his Catholic faith.
- The Catholic Church opposes the death penalty for criminals in almost every case. Santorum supports them.
- The US Conference of Bishops has urged that the federal minimum wage be increased for the working poor. Santorum in the Senate repeatedly voted against the minimum wage.
- The bishops want welfare for all needy families. Santorum is a critic of welfare.
- Catholic bishops demand the withdrawal of Israel from Palestinian territories occupied in 1967. Rick Santorum denies that there is any such thing as a Palestinian.

Somehow these views are acceptable for a Catholic, but contraception is vile? Oh right, Thomas doesn’t support Santorum, but neglects to mention who he does. And somehow these views are more Christian that Obamas?

Espe, nice Hussein comment, with an anti-christ chaser! Well, my wife and I go to church weekly, my 2 kids are in Catholic school (as were my wife and I), give to charity, and volunteer a lot. But I do support the use of contraceptives, and I do regret that some of the money I put into the collection basket each week has gone to pay hush money to the families of little boys that have been raped by priests. So, yeah, cafeteria Catholic, clearly not holier than thou.

@Mark, I read your posts. Whatever you are, you’re definitely not Catholic.

What is the healthy and morally acceptable alternative to contraception? 

Natural Family Planning. 

Information and resource links can be found here: 

http://allhands-ondeck.blogspot.com/2012/02/benefits-of-natural-family-planning.html

@David - beware of alienating those like me, who regularly go to church, conduct our lives and raise our kids according to the morality of Jesus, without asserting the “sure knowledge that marriage, sex and babies go together”. We are the vast majority of Catholics, as any polling shows. We represent the only hope of survival of the church in this era of modern religious practice. Demanding rigid agreement on minor, outdated, and frankly ridiculous points of Vatican dogma else they be deemed “not Catholic” is a losing strategy. This is why our fundamentalist evangelical brethren, who adhere to a literal interpretation of the bible, believe the earth is approx. 10,000 years old, and deny evolution are viewed as extremist lunatics by the rest of the world. As they rightly should be.
But if you insist on playing the dogma games, here’s a question for a logical thinking engineer (as you remind us in many of your posts).  Pope Pius IX in Casti Connubii considered the act of frustrating the act of conception for any reason to be a “grave sin”. The Pope was clear on this, NFP is a form of contraception. You mention that you took NFP classes 16 years ago. I don’t know, perhaps you have 22 children, but I’d wager you don’t, and have used NFP for other than “serious reasons” (Humanae Vitae really lowered the bar on this one). How is this significantly different than using a condom for the same purpose? There are many within the church who don’t consider “don’t want more children” a “serious reason” to use NFP. How do you support NFP and not be a cafeteria Catholic in this respect?

When the Pope speaks on Faith and morals i.e., ex cathedra, he is the Vicar of Christ and is infallible. The Pope/Bishops position on the War on Iraq, the minimum wage, universal health care are opinions deserving respect, but are Not infallible. When the Pope goes to Greenland holding hands for “love the earth” and then politically gives “lip service” to life in the womb and puts being stewards of the earth on equal footing with loving God’s creation in the womb, he is wrong. He is caving in to political pressure. You are called to respectfully disagree here. Progessive paganism/leftism has infiltrated the “Holy Catholic Church” just like all other walks of life. You do not get that option with artificial birth control and Humanae Vitae. Pope Paul VI spoke infallibly here. If you cannot see the difference between spouses abstaining from sexual relations for a short time period as opposed to using condoms, IUD’s and the pill, you are just being conveniently ignorant.  What percentage of Catholics following Humanae Vitae is not relevant. A very wise man once told me, being a true Catholic is like being a U.S. Marine, many are called, few are chosen. Don’t try to water down our Holy Catholic Faith down to make life easier. Work hard, struggle at it, just like the rest of us !

When the Pope speaks on Faith and morals i.e., ex cathedra, he is the Vicar of Christ and is infallible. The Pope/Bishops position on the War on Iraq, the minimum wage, universal health care are opinions deserving respect, but are NOT infallible. When the Pope goes to Greenland holding hands for “love the earth” and then politically gives “lip service” to life in the womb and puts being stewards of the earth on equal footing with protecting life in the womb, he is wrong. The Pope is caving in to political pressure. You are called to respectfully disagree here. Progessive paganism/leftism has infiltrated the “Holy Catholic Church” just like all other walks of life. You do not get that option with artificial birth control and Humanae Vitae. Pope Paul VI spoke infallibly here. If you cannot see the difference between spouses abstaining from sexual relations for a short time period as opposed to using condoms, IUD’s and the pill, you are just being conveniently ignorant.  What percentage of Catholics following Humanae Vitae is not relevant. A very wise man once told me, being a true Catholic is like being a U.S. Marine, many are called, few are chosen. Don’t try to water down our Holy Catholic Faith to make life easier. Work hard, struggle at it, just like the rest of us !

Why does the Church agree with the rhythm method and not barrier methods of contraception?  BOTH allow the act with the intention of avoiding conception.  It’s hypocritical to be for one and not the other. 
Regarding President Obama, I am a devout Catholic who is all for him.  I’d much rather pay for someone else’s contraception than vote into office someone who will annihilate social programs for the poor and guarantee that the rich stay as rich as possible on the backs of everyone else.  To say he is “evil” is a bunch of propaganda and simple-minded rhetoric.  I’d hate to believe that all Catholics are that unthinking.  We can be faithful and not blindly follow what a blogger tells us.  I don’t blindly follow anyone.  There are a myriad of issues that should be weighed.  I don’t find ANY possible candidate that I totally agree with.  However, the idea of paying for someone else’s contraception because “I” don’t use it is, imo, truly a selfish, very “American” attitude of “why should I pay for something for which I get nothing.”  It is self-centeredness wrapped in a facade of religious indignity.  Most Catholics would be fine with barrier methods.  I can understand not wanting to promote the death of a fetus starting at conception but barrier methods don’t do that.  So why not fight for that?  Because it’s better for YOUR pocketbook to make sure that you don’t pay for some poor woman’s barrier method.  Obama isn’t any more evil than other candidates who would have babies born to the poor and then give no support for their healthy upbringing.  I know I’ll be bashed for this but I’m willing to be honest.  I don’t think being Catholic means going along with the crowd all the time.  And those like @David who judge who is ‘truly’ Catholic and who is not are being as unChristian as one can be.  Again, that’s hypocrisy.

@Joshua.  Two things I should have included in my response to you.  First, St Paul tells us to “work out our salvation in fear and trembling”.  The closer I get to my own “last judgment “, the more meaningful that advice becomes. We are called to do our best to please God, knowing full we will all fail at times.  Also, Jesus tells us not to judge others, lest we be judged.  It seems to be the authoritative opinions I have read about this passage is that while we can objectively judge actions, we should not judge the relationship anyone has with God. 
In my opinion, a person who falls, realizes his failure, and tries to do bettering the future, is more pleasing to God than one who might commit a much lesser sin, but tries to justify it by saying everyone is doing it.  Seems there is a lot of the latter going on.
God Bless.  Hope to see you in God’s kingdom some day.

Tom Jablonski, St Louis, MO

@Mark, Casti Connubii was promulgated in response to the Anglican capitulation to the world on contraception after one thousand, nine-hundred years+ of constant Christian Teaching, before that all Christian denominations taught against contraception. Humanae Vitae was promulgated in response to the Pill. The Church Teaches against artificial birth control not because it’s artificial, but because all artificial means of BC are either contraceptive or abortifacient. Contra-ception means “against-the beginning”. NFP or STM are neither contraceptive or abortifacient. Yes both contraception and NFP have the same end, but the two are very different means. One acts against life beginning, the other involves fertility awareness and appreciation. “The End Does Not Justify the Means.” The catechesis on this “has been” sorely lacking… It’s easy to see how contraception is an anti life act. The very definition of when life begins was changed from conception to implantation, not for any scientific reason, but because abortifacients like some versions of the pill are abortifacients, and companies wanted to market them as “contraceptives”. The name Plan B is really a backup plan to Plan A; Plan A being act against the beginning, Plan B kill it if a new human life has begun.

On being Catholic. I did seek the Truth with faith and reason, I questioned everything, and I found Him. Jesus Christ is on earth!!! He is Present in the Holy Eucharist. Anyone who believes that is a Catholic, anyone who does not is not. I know that this truth has not dawned on everyone that calls himself a catholid, but once this truth dawns on a person, they believe everything, and I mean everything the Church Teaches. Christ is in His Church, and like Him, She can neither deceive nor be deceived.

My wife and I have 4 children, each 2 years apart. The youngest is 13.  STM works very well and it is not anti-life.

@David, then you have participated in the act without being open to its original intent, that of procreation.  By using natural family planning, you have deliberately chosen to behave in a way that is just for your pleasure (at least much of the time) and not at all to procreate.  That, as far as the Church has delineated, is a sin.  Regardless of how romantic you try to make it sound (“fertility awareness and appreciation?!”  Seriously!), you have performed an act with the clear intent of NOT allowing the natural reason/consequences of that act to come to fruition.  Since no conception is possible with NFP or barrier methods, I don’t see the difference, nor would anyone who thought about it logically.  The fact that anyone is for one method and not the other is hypocritical in my opinion.

@Thinker,
God created fertile and infertile periods…
There’s nothing wrong with awareness. We have serious reasons to stop at 4 children.
My wife and I totally gave ourselves to each other. We would have love to had a fifth child.
For you to be right. The Church would have to have been in error and in error. LOL. LOL.LOL.
I’m not that stupid.

@David, why then would a barrier method of birth control be wrong for you and your wife to use.  If, as you seem to believe, the Church sanctions sex for the sake of having sex and with the clear intent to avoid a baby, why would NFP be okay but a barrier method NOT okay?  Both keep you from conceiving.  Yet the Church advocates one and calls the other a method that proves you are not “open” to God’s will.  In fact, BOTH methods are proof that you are not open to God’s will.  If the Church were not hypocritical on this issue, it would deem it necessary for all couples to abstain unless and until they are ready to conceive.  But it doesn’t. The issue is your willingness to accept God’s will and the Church’s contention that sex is only for procreation.  The use of NFP or barrier methods BOTH prove you do not just accept God’s will and you do not believe sex is only for procreation.  How is that possible?  I believe I made it pretty clear that THAT is my issue/question.  Hmmmmm. Yet, you never did answer that particular question.  I certainly didn’t call you stupid, evasive maybe, but not stupid.  I, for one, am more respectful to other posters and would never call one stupid or laugh at what they have to say, regardless of how illogical I think they’re being.  Doing that just proves how little one really has to say and discredits anything they DO say.

“Morality is all very complicated to a man who has lost his principles.”

1. The end does not justify the means.
2. It is never licit to do evil when good might come from it.
3. Everything God Wills is Good.
4. There is a time and purpose for everything under heaven.
5. The fertility to cooperate with God to create a new human life is a great good.
6. Killing that fertility is evil.
7. Don’t argue with chatterers.

@Thinker/LH- please cease your posting and let us just accept that David is right and admire his critical and logical thinking (i.e. repeat what the Vatican says).  The views of the overwhelming majority of Catholics, and the rest of mainstream Christianity are not worthy of respect, because that would entail that the church would be in error.  It’s just that simple!

Fortunately those of us that ponder these inconsistencies are no longer tortured by the Inquisition (rebranded as the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith), or labeled as heretics like Galileo. Hopefully by examining this bronze-age thinking, this vocal and intolerant minority will not be able to prevent birth control from being part of every company health care plan if the employees want it. They claim it’s about religious persecution, but it’s clear that they consider it evil and would ban it from everybody if they could.

From Humanae Vitae: “No member of the faithful could possibly deny that the Church is competent in her magisterium to interpret the natural moral law. It is in fact indisputable, as our predecessors have many times declared….” Read that over a few times and marvel at the sheer arrogance and superiority of that statement.

If the Obama administration has the power to force a private entity to provide goods or services without charging for them, then the administration could mandate that the manufacturers of contraceptives and abortificient drugs should provide them without charging for them.  Likewise, those who perform surgical abortions or sterilizations should be mandated to provide these services for free, to women who desire such services. 

In this way, there is no violation of the constitutional rights of any citizen or violation of their conscience.

The Obama administration’s newly discovered constitutional or legal right to force someone to provide something without charging for it is surely of general applicability, or does there exist an exemption for the providers of certain products or services.

if people are not going to follow the tenets of the catholic church then why do they call themselves Catholic?

I believe the Church has sent mixed messages by not being strict enough.  Excommunicate politicians like Pelosi, Biden, Selibus, Kerry and the Kennedys who continually advocate abortion.

Wow - lots of interesting terms in the comments.

Bottom line for me is “what should it matter what non-Catholics do with their bodies?” That is between the individual and their GOD. It is not something that we should get involved with (politically). It is not for us to decide or to judge. Isn’t that one of our teachings??

If, as Catholics, we are to have non-waivering views of our morals, beliefs and standards then we should abide by them - ALL OF THEM. Not pick and choose a convenient one of the day. Or is this now an a-la-carte affair?  Anyone who doesn’t abide by ALL of our teachings should be excommunicated (period).  But then we might be surprised by how few remain…

The author of this article is obviously insane and would keep the world in the dark ages forever. Why not just admit that you are no better than the “evil Taliban” ?

@lois: agreed. Anyone that uses the word “evil” as many times as the author does is clearly not very well balanced.  I don’t understand why they allow this stuff to be posted on a Catholic blog. It really is shameful.

“Evil” pervades and thrives when good men stand by and do nothing. The “God Loves you” crowd, i.e., The Catholic version of the Woodstock crowd, which has been by far the dominating viewpoint in Catholicism since Vatican II, has crowded out all notions of a Just God and a balanced sense of good and evil directed by the the Ten Commandments. HELLO, 56 million U.S. abortions and counting [just pause for a moment and realize how big that number is-> that’s 1120 50,000 seat stadiums], tomorrow there will be another 4,000. Do yah think there might be cause for getting busy with the concept of evil ? The audacity of you lefties is nihilistic. That’s it, silence or drug away the truth has become the modern American way. Thank you Mr. Santorum and May God Bless all our soldiers for Christ.

@TtT, “the truth” is subjective, depending on your religion, can we not agree on that? What is true for Catholics isn’t necessarily true for others. You can’t force people to accept that using contraception to prevent pregnancy is evil, or that a mass of cells smaller than the period at the end of this sentence is the same as a person. Yet Santorum believes that a corporation is a person.
You wish to impose your religious views on the rest of the country, and thereby join only the Islamist countries in maintaining a theocracy. Which as you may be aware, are the only countries on the planet where abortion is illegal. This thinking would fit right in there. These views are anti-democratic, anti-freedom, and the reason that the Obama administration is popping champagne corks watching the GOP candidates argue about theology.

The folly of a moral relativist: “Can’t we agree that it’s true, that nothing is true?”
For more on moral relativist thinking, and why it is so damming, visit Peter Kreft at http://www.peterkreeft.com/podcasts/index.xml
Look for “Relativist”
Great Stuff. Free Podcasts!

@David, after reading your posts I am wondering, do you actually have original thoughts or do you just read/listen and repeat?  Blind following is not true belief, it is just robotic.

Yeah, that’s what passes for logical thinking by the absolutists. Clearly I didn’t state that “nothing is true”, merely asked for agreement that different religions hold different things to be true. Your view is that Catholics have the only version of truth, all others are mistaken and therefore untrue. The church’s morality obviously evolved over the years, as it did not always abhor slavery. Where’s your outrage against moral relativism here?
Looking forward to more of your cut-and-paste replies from other dogmatic sources that you agree with.

I see. You don’t believe “that nothing is true”, but you believe that there are different “versions” and that this view is true.
Here’s an original thought: Aren’t we back to where we started?

I am tired of hearing that X number of Catholic women use contraceptives on a regular basis.  The Church must be governed by God’s will, not human will. Being Catholic means nothing…are you obeying God’s laws; are you following Christ’s teachings.  If not then being Catholic means nothing more that being a republican or democrat.  You will still not be saved.

I could stand to be corrected on this but I think I read somewhere that Muslims living in the U.S. will be exempted from this mandate. Could someone verify please.
Thanks !

Well, tell me what you think about this:

-
On Fox News Sunday this morning, Chris Wallace challenged Rick Santorum on why he’s given such a small percentage of his salary to charity (1.76 percent) compared to Mitt Romney (13.8 percent) and President Obama (14.2 percent). Santorum explained that he was unable to give because the costs of caring for his daughter Bella — who has a severe genetic disorder — were so high because they are not covered by his insurance:

SANTORUM: Well, we always need to do better. I was in a situation where we have seven children and one disabled child who we take care of, and she’s very, very expensive. We love her and we cherish the opportunity to take care of her, but it’s an additional expense. We have to have around-the-clock care for her, and our insurance company doesn’t cover it so I have to cover it.

Santorum has a million dollar income, and yet, still struggles to support the medical costs of his daughter.

By admitting that the health care system has created a financial burden for families, Santorum is essentially conceding the need for the Affordable Care Act. Even though he has repeatedly claimed that children like Bella would receive inferior treatment under “socialized medicine,” the ACA actually guarantees that insurance providers cannot use disabilities like Bella’s as an excuse to deny service, nor can they cap how much money is spent on an individual’s medical benefits. It also prevents insurers from denying or limiting benefits. Children of families that don’t have a million dollars would have a better chance of managing costs.

How ironic indeed. The issue that prevents him from donating more to his church or charity is the cost of health care for his daughter, whom his insurance company discriminates against because of pre-existing conditions. Yet Santorum (and the majority here in the comments section) rails against other provisions of the ACA that prevents employers from similar discrimination.

Catholics are Evil,Vile abnd have killed morec people on this Earth than the NAZIS and Stalin. Priests should be castrated so they don’t rape kids. So they can really Love GOD and only GOD.
Semper Fidelis

Obama is a 32 degree freemason their entire janus philosophy is based on deception and satan is their god. The devil has decieved america well, we must call on JESUS and unite.

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