7. Men Play a Role. Jennifer, I appreciate and can identify with the things you’ve learned. As a former Lutheran, I too, was somewhat fearful the first time we went to pray outside an abortion business. In addition to the items that you listed, I wanted to add this one. Men do play a role. Prior to going to the abortion business, I somehow thought that the decision to abort was primarily a woman’s decision and that the men simply weren’t involved. However, after having prayed outside of an abortion business numerous times, I was struck by how many times I saw teenagers and adult women being brought in, driven by, accompanied, and at times, forcefully escorted by men. They could be boyfriends, husbands, brothers, and even fathers. It’s a striking thing to witness. The men who are supposed to be protecting the sacred, protecting that life inside, and protecting the health and well-being of their girlfriend, wife, sister, or daughter, are instead acting as an accomplice, or at times, as the instigator. That’s a reality that all men, and women, should contemplate.

Regarding 1., this varies. The first time I prayed, I had the parking directions available from the website, but there were no directions regarding where to stand (I ended up calling the coordinator and asking, just to make sure) and I had to bring my own sign the first time (I didn’t have one as I’d assumed they’d be provided - I’ve since ordered one of my own to take with me).

But by and large the organization involved is very good.

Thanks Jennifer for this post - I’m going to pray with 40 Days for Life in a few weeks (and have talked a few of my co-workers into coming with me).  This article is encouraging in addressing some of my concerns too.  I was a pro-choice agnostic my entire life until entering the Catholic Church 4 years ago.  I NEVER thought I would be where I am now, at age 27, working for the Catholic Church as a preschool director and soon, praying in front of an abortion clinic.  Your blog was instrumental in encouraging me throughout my conversion and this article is one more edifying bit of literature in my continuing formation. Thank you.

Thanks to your article, I’m now thinking of signing up, but I’m really scared of doing it. Prayers would be greatly appreciated.

“And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.”

Yeah, Right - yay context! Notice that Jesus is not condemning ALL public prayer, but rather public prayer done BY HYPOCRITES solely as a vain display of false piety.

The whole point of the 40 Days for Life campaign is for prayer warriors to be seen, but to be seen so that pregnant women know there are people available to help them AND their baby, and to touch the consciences of those working in abortion facilities—both motivations are ones of which Jesus would approve. No hypocrisy whatsoever.

Thanks for this post!  I got involved in 40DFL for the first time during the last spring campaign and am glad I did.  I was intimidated and fearful about going out to pray publicly, too—despite having been a pro-life Catholic my entire life.  After reading “unPlanned” by Abby Johnson last January, I couldn’t help BUT get involved.  This book helped to dispel some of the myths and misconceptions about praying “on the front lines,” and allowed my DH to feel comfortable supporting my prayer efforts as well.
***
To anyone who feels even the slightest nudge to pray publicly, but is reluctant (and understandably so!), please just give it a try.  Go with a friend, even if for 20 minutes, and experience it for yourself.  I can tell you that I have had legitimate concerns about taking a public stance as I live in a relatively small town and am also a healthcare provider, but I have also found much more support than opposition.  The best thing we can do for all affected by the abortion industry is to be a visible sign of love and compassion.

Yes, the evil is palpable there.  My husband and I were blessed with being the godparents to two little baby girls whose mothers needed help and were going to abort out of desperation.  They were both illegal, afraid, and CATHOLIC.  Instead of tempting me to pride, this experience never stops humbling me.  I have a large family now, and hardly ever get down to Planned Parenthood anymore. For a while I would think of “the killing hours” that happened on certain days. The thought of nobody standing witness there most the year still makes me cry, but I know that the daily, silent, offering of our sacrifices isn’t contained to just the sidewalks.

I too was scared—shaking!—the first time I went out to the clinic to pray. After a few minutes of praying, I realized that the hardest part was getting up the courage to actually go out and do it, to be “that person”, “that anti-abortion zealot” that people make fun of. Getting over that fear is hard, no two ways about it.

The first 40 Days I participated in, I took at least an hour a day, since I was a childless student and had the time to give. Never have I experienced the depth of prayer that I did out on the sidewalk—it was amazing. The community generally responded positively—Strangers would bring me coffee on early Saturday mornings, the owner of a local pizza shop dropped off a few pies late one evening, and passersby would offer their encouragement. There were many angry yells and honks, but in my experience they came from post-abortive women, some of whom accepted information on post-abortion healing and talked with us, and young men.

My husband, on the other hand, had a much different experience—he was often out alone on weekend mornings and was accosted several times by angry women who would yell and scream at him that he had no right to say anything about abortion because he was a man. The men who prayed on the sidewalk were much more likely to report these kind of problems—verbal abuse, threats, and things being thrown at them, than women. So bless you, faithful men, for standing up for us women and children.

On spiritual warfare…I often went out to pray when I was pregnant with my first son. I would feel fine all day, but as soon as I got outside the clinic and started to pray, I would become dizzy, nauseous, and unable to stand—which never happened anywhere else or at any other time during my pregnancy, or after I gave birth. I would have to sit down and let someone else lead the prayers, often not even being able to say the words out loud. Obviously I can’t say for sure whether this was the work of the evil one, or my body manifesting my own revulsion about what was going on inside the building while I sat outside with a new life growing inside me, but it was very strange.

I will be returning to pray with my son and 7 months pregnant with my second son for this campaign, so we will see if this happens again.

I’m not a Catholic, and I have no interest in prayer. Is there a place for me to become involved in the pro-life movement?

Paul - absolutely! Check out http://secularprolife.org :)

JoAnna, thanks!

It seems the organization also has some issues about contraception, and is comprised mostly of Catholics, but it shows great promise, and seems to be open to divergent views.

My views are contraception is necessary to minimize abortions, and that abortion before brainwaves can be measured is morally acceptable because the group of cells is not yet a person.

These views seem to be acceptable to the secular pro-life group (though I may get the opportunity for interesting debates!). It looks like a place for me. I wonder if they organize any activities at clinics or statehouses?

Paul - I don’t think the folks at secularprolife.org would agree with this stance: “...abortion before brainwaves can be measured is morally acceptable because the group of cells is not yet a person.” They believe that life begins at conception and that human rights (e.g., the right to life) also begin at that point. But I’m not affiliated with their group officially, I’m just a subscriber to their blog and a fan on Facebook, so it’d be a better conversation to have with the folks who run the group.

I think they do organize various activities as well.

Joanna: Many thanks.

Another great article, Jennifer. I have to share an experience I had a an aboriton clinic in Northern Illinois one day a month or so ago. I happened to be in the area on Friday (one of the “abortion” days at the clinic). I stopped there to pray the rosary. A priest and about a dozen people were there when I arrived. They were in the process of reciting the Divine Mercy chaplet when I got there. I joined them. I cannot adequately explain the feeling that overcame me in the midst of that prayer. It was quite emotional and almost electric, but not in an unpleasant way. I’ve never exerienced that before or since (yeah, I know…it’s only a month ago). But I was convinced that whatever it’s source, it was a good thing. Keep up the good work Jennifer. And for those considering this ministry, I can say unequivocally that it is well worth the effort.

“The whole point of the 40 Days for Life campaign is for prayer warriors to be seen, but to be seen so that pregnant women know there are people available to help them AND their baby, and to touch the consciences of those working in abortion facilities—both motivations are ones of which Jesus would approve. No hypocrisy whatsoever.”

That’s exactly what that quote is referring to.  If you want pregnant women to know there would be someone to help them…then tell them that.  Praying for it in public is just silly and does nothing but project a sense of false piety.  The women are there to avail themselves of a legal, private service. After all the MAJORITY of women going in are themselves Cristian/Catholic.

To Paul,
I will check out that website myself. like some of the other writers I come from an atheistic/socialist conditioning, though I am now a convert. A former UK student nurse who assisted in many abortions, I had no thought about my involvement until 15 years later, when I started to read the Bible on a challenge and was converted to Christ. What sealed my commitment was that I had nightmares, in which I saw many dead babies. However, it took years to get over my ambivalence about rape, incest and birth control. I was not confident about talking about the spiritual aspects of abortion so I pondered the ecological and sociological impacts. In the last year I have read the Finnish ‘STAKES’ study on post-abortive women and know that they have a four-fold increase in suicide and accidents. These events usually occur on the child’s due date, or the anniversary of the abortion. They have another study on the relationship of incest with schizophrenia. Follow-up research in Glamorgan, Wales, showed that the women who died from suicide, had no greater predisposition to it, prior to the abortion. These are reliable studies, done via medical records searches, in countries with universal health care. I would recommend, Paul,  that you go to Population Research Institute and click on the tab “Pop 101”, where you can watch four 5” videos which explain the myth of overpopulation. Under the videos some tough questions are posed and links will help you follow the science. PRI was founded by a priest but the stats are obtained from the UN and CIA.
People like you Paul, are more credible spokesmen these days, than us “crazy, religious fanatics”.

“That’s exactly what that quote is referring to.”

Please actually read my comments. Jesus is referring to hypocrites displaying false, vain piety. He was not issuing a blanket condemnation of all public prayer.

“If you want pregnant women to know there would be someone to help them…then tell them that.” 

We do! At least, we try! I don’t know about you, but I don’t have the direct phone number of every single pregnant woman in the U.S. at any given moment. Some of these women have NO IDEA that there are real alternatives to abortion until they witness the prayer warriors outside the clinic and go to them for more information.

“Praying for it in public is just silly and does nothing but project a sense of false piety.”

How do you know it is false? Can you read hearts and minds?

“The women are there to avail themselves of a legal, private service. After all the MAJORITY of women going in are themselves Cristian/Catholic.”

A legal, private service that murders a human being. As for your statistic, it is not news to anyone that Christians/Catholics sin. We all do, on a daily basis. That doesn’t make the murder of innocent unborn children something to be condoned or celebrated.

One more great article by Jennifer

I don’t understand why one would believe that because something is LEGAL then it is MORAL or right! So when the third Reich made it illegal for anyone to hide a jew then that made it the immoral thing to do. Please be ware of this LOL.

About the use of the term “prayer warrior” I have a serious problem with this categorization. All mankind is involved in an eternal battle for its soul, both communally and individually, and whenever one is in prayer it is in opposition to the archenemy which makes everyone of the faithful a warrior! This term is more of a protestant term that somehow allocates some individuals’ fight against evil of superior quality to others. It is to the extent that our prayers are geared towards the purification of our souls that they are efficacious as witness to the eternal truth, this witness (a kind of sharing) is at one and the same time a part of our purification. This doesn’t make one any more of a prayer warrior than another.

And for this wonderful experience of public prayer I would say that it is very well related to what Paul had said in his letter to the Corinthians {12:8} ‘Because of this, three times I petitioned the Lord that it might be taken away from me. {12:9} And he said to me: “My grace is sufficient for you. For virtue is perfected in weakness.” And so, willingly shall I glory in my weaknesses, so that the virtue of Christ may live within me.’ When we feel resistance to doing a good work, like prayer, especially publicly, that is a weakness. When ever we take this action, originating/targeted at love, the virtues are truly born into our souls to the Glory of God. They no longer are theory. I cannot but encourage all and thank those who have experienced this never to forget this sweet reality. Thanks.

This expresses my experiance perfectly.  I was never an athiest or prochoice, but I did feel that I could not go as far as praying in front of planned parenthood.  I got involved because as I grew in my faith my heart started to tug me to be more proactive in my convictions. I saw the real distiction of good and evil and it brought me to tears.  Your article is as if I myself had written it.  Thank you so much for writing this.

“Please actually read my comments. Jesus is referring to hypocrites displaying false, vain piety. He was not issuing a blanket condemnation of all public prayer.”

What do you think is being displayed in these instances?  False Piousness.  Couldn’t you pray in the closet to get the same results?  Unless your admitting that prayer doesn’t work.

“What do you think is being displayed in these instances?  False Piousness.” 

How do you know it is false? Cab you read hearts and minds?

“Couldn’t you pray in the closet to get the same results?”

In this case, no - not because prayer isn’t effective, but because our public witness is equally effective. The presence of prayer warriors outside the clinics alert people to the evil that is being perpetuated in their neighborhood, give women in crisis a tangible reminder and resource for abortion alternatives, and serve to remind clinic staff of their cooperation with evil. Read Abby Johnson’s “Unplanned” - it was the physical presence of prayer warriors, in addition to their prayers, that helped convince her to leave her job at the abortion clinic and become pro-life.

Is it prayer or public witness?  I call it hypocritical.  Advocate not using birth control and then damn the women who get pregnant.  If prayer is effective why not just pray for them not to get pregnant?  That would make more sense.  The fact is that the MAJORITY of women who get abortions are Christians, address it in church or your closet where the message belong.

“Is it prayer or public witness?” 

Both.

“I call it hypocritical.  Advocate not using birth control and then damn the women who get pregnant.”

How do we “damn” women by treating them AND their babies as precious human beings with equal worth and dignity? Also, do you realize that by PP’s own stats, 54% of women who abort were using birth control when they conceived?
Contrary to the liberal propaganda you’ve been spoon-fed, contraception is far from infallible. Self-control works a lot better.

“If prayer is effective why not just pray for them not to get pregnant?  That would make more sense.”

We do pray for people to turn away from aim and embrace Church teaching regarding sex, but the fact is that people have free will. Our prayers can’t force anyone to convert.

 “The fact is that the MAJORITY of women who get abortions are Christians, address it in church or your closet where the message belong.”

The message that killing innocent human beings is wrong belongs everywhere, so that’s where we’ll proclaim it. Why is that message so offensive to you?

That should be, “turn away from sin,” above… stupid autocorrect :)

JoAnna, don’t waste your time arguing with kids.
Certain people are just here to offend and waste their time.
Don’t allow them to waste yours too.

Nick, I’m not answering for LOL’s benefit (I’m fairly confident s/he is only here to troll), I’m answering for all the the lurkers who may not know how to counter this type of pro-abortion rhetoric.

What rhetoric?  You mean the kind where your not praying outside of fertilization clinics?  After all they are death camps for babies.

The difference?  There isn’t any, oh except for there being less vulnerable women to make feel uncomfortable.

“The message that killing innocent human beings is wrong belongs everywhere, so that’s where we’ll proclaim it.”

So it’s evil you say?

Don’t feed the trolls.
They are immature attention-sponges.

And since they are in high school, they have much more time in their hands than people who have to work. Therefore, if you waste your time with them, you will lose more than them.

Also, what happened with this site’s moderation?

To Paul Rimmer:  Pray anyway….it might make you happier..or go to see what else you can do at:
http://www.amazon.com/Simple-Things-You-Can-Pro-Life/dp/1556611706

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

“What rhetoric?  You mean the kind where your not praying outside of fertilization clinics?  After all they are death camps for babies. The difference?  There isn’t any, oh except for there being less vulnerable women to make feel uncomfortable.”

Or perhaps it’s because embryonic stem cell research and the cryogenic thawing of babies to cause their deaths (that is, when the unwanted embryos are thrown away) isn’t being done at IVF clinics.

“So it’s evil you say?”

Yes, the deliberate murder of an innocent human being is an objectively evil act. Do you disagree?

“Or perhaps it’s because embryonic stem cell research and the cryogenic thawing of babies to cause their deaths (that is, when the unwanted embryos are thrown away) isn’t being done at IVF clinics.”

Then why not where it IS being done?  IVF clinics ARE where the mothers ARE going to have these procedures accomplished that will result in multiple abortions per client success.  Just because you want to play 6 degrees of separation doesn’t make the end result any different.  As you stated that is where the MOTHERS are.

“Yes, the deliberate murder of an innocent human being is an objectively evil act.”

Numbers 5:16? 1 Samuel 15:2-3?  Perhaps it only evil if the target isn’t an Amalekite, or the unborn child of a adulteress? 

“Also, what happened with this site’s moderation?”

That’s the ticket.  Censor those with dissenting opinions.

If it’s about saving innocent lives, why not pray outside the Pentagon, or your local children’s hospital?

Yeah, Right: generally that’s done at the cryogenic facilities that house and store the frozen embryos, which often is not the same place as the IVF clinic. Moreover, I’d love to see your stats for the assertion that ALL IVF procedures result in multiple abortions. Many women choose to implant all created embryos, or donate their “excess” embryos to other couples.

Regarding your Old Testament proof-texting and cherry-picking, luckily Catholics read the Bible in context with proper exegesis so I’m not going to play that game (it’s so true what they say… scratch and atheist, find a fundamentalist). None of the verses you cite out of context change the fact that it is an objectively evil act to kill an innocent human being.

JoAnna,

Reguardless of where the act is taking place, as stated above that isn’t the intent of Praying in front of abortion clinics.  It’s to reach the women, they would be reached by praying outside of IVF clinics also.  Why not pray there and reach would be parents before hand so they could adopt?

Better yet, why not educate your youth on the proper use of birth control?  Seems to me that would be the *MOST* effective use of resources to impact abortion rates.

“Regarding your Old Testament proof-texting and cherry-picking”

GASP, just like your cherry picking?  Must be nice having a church telling you what to think so you can safely ignore the inconvenient portions of your holy texts.  Kind of like cherry picking your causes.

Yeah, Right - “It’s to reach the women, they would be reached by praying outside of IVF clinics also.  Why not pray there and reach would be parents before hand so they could adopt?”

Excellent question. My answer would be that we’re in triage mode at the moment, and we’ll turn our attentions to IVF clinics once we’ve outlawed abortion and saved the 4,000 children per day who have successfully implanted yet are still in danger of being murdered. If the plight of excess IVF embryos that may or may not be destroyed is a higher priority to you than the plight of children who have survived implantation but are in danger of being legally murdered via induced abortion, then by all means do go and pray in front of IVF clinics.

Sadly, there are less resources available to combat the evil occuring at IVF clinics, because many pro-lifers have no problem with IVF. (I find that position inconsistent, personally.) However, I still do my best to bring attention to the plight of IVF embryos in the online sphere and hope I can touch a few hearts that way.

“Better yet, why not educate your youth on the proper use of birth control?  Seems to me that would be the *MOST* effective use of resources to impact abortion rates.”

Given that PP’s own stats state that 54% of women who obtained abortion were using contraception at the time they conceived, it wouldn’t. I think we should instead educate our youth on the proper use and function of SELF-control as well as the meaning, significance, and role of sexual intercourse in relationships.

I advise you to look up the definition of “exegesis” as it applies to Biblical interpretation. Until then, your comments are worthless and irrelevant because you display a lack of ignorance of how Catholics interpret Scripture (as opposed to how fundamentalist atheists do).

As for the Church “telling me what to think”—that’s pretty rich coming from someone who has drank the kool-aid of the liberal propaganda machine (see your comments about contraception reducing abortion, above, which has been proven to be false time and again). But here is my response to that common assertion: http://a-star-of-hope.blogspot.com/2011/02/do-catholics-blindly-follow-vatican.html

“Given that PP’s own stats state that 54% of women who obtained abortion were using contraception at the time they conceived, it wouldn’t”

Cherry picking?  Or obviously ignoring the part about teaching it’s use.  How many of those are a result of ignorance in the proper use of contraceptives?  Quite High if memory serves me.

“I think we should instead educate our youth on the proper use and function of SELF-control as well as the meaning, significance, and role of sexual intercourse in relationships.”

Because that obviously works based on current statistics?  Do you like to save money on buying a car without air bags…because it has a seat belt?Lets take condom use, Perfect use 2% has a failure rate while improper use see’s a failure rate of 10-18%.  The difference?  Education.

“54% of women who obtained abortion were using contraception..”

Somehow I doubt the veracity of this, I’ll go along with it. So 100 who are getting abortions.  This is only half of the statistic.  How many abortions were prevented by proper contraceptive use?  Let’s look at this way.  Using the 18% failure rate of condoms and applying it to the 56% of women who didn’t use contraceptive.  Of 100 women getting an abortion 56 of them didn’t use contraceptives did use condoms that would be about 45 less abortions.  But hey, why not let reality get in the way of practice, after all who needs air bags when you have seat belts.

“As for the Church “telling me what to think”—that’s pretty rich coming from someone who has drank the kool-aid of the liberal propaganda machine”

Except you already told us as much.  “Catholics read the Bible in context with proper exegesi…”.  Your told how to interpret the bible according to the Catholic Doctrine, that is *what* makes you Catholic….geeze.

Yeah, Right - if you don’t believe my stats, check for yourself. See here: http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html Quote “Fifty-four percent of women who have abortions had used a contraceptive method (usually the condom or the pill) during the month they became pregnant.”

As to your statistics regarding failure rate, they don’t take into account the times contraception did indeed fail but pregnancy didn’t occur because a woman was in the naturally infertile phase of her menstrual cycle. It skews the statistics.

Contraception’s been around and available for well over 50 years now, with liberal sex ed around for over 20 of that. If people haven’t learned to use it perfectly and properly by now, what makes you think they ever will?

Once again, all you’re doing is spouting tired liberal/atheist propaganda (about contraception, about abstinence education, about abortion, etc.) that’s been rebutted time and time again, on this site and others. If you’re too lazy to do your research, I won’t do it for you.

From your link:

“Fifty-four percent of women who have abortions had used a contraceptive method (usually the condom or the pill) during the month they became pregnant. Among those women, 76% of pill users and 49% of condom users report having used their method inconsistently, while 13% of pill users and 14% of condom users report correct use.”

LOL.  Cherry pick much?  LOL, I can’t even think of a non-condescending response, so I’ll leave it with the above copy and paste from the supplied site.

“Contraception’s been around and available for well over 50 years now, with liberal sex ed around for over 20 of that. If people haven’t learned to use it perfectly and properly by now, what makes you think they ever will?”

Cars have ben around and available for well over 50 years now, with liberal driving education for over 20 years of that.  If people haven’t learned to drive perfectly and properly by now, what makes you think they ever will….LOL.  Too funny.

Once again, you guys claim the moral high road while you contribute to the problem you claim to be against.

Bob - I’m very sorry for how you and your wife were treated. There are bad apples in every group, unfortunately. You should have been treated with love and compassion. Rest assured the vast majority of pro-lifers doing prayer vigils do not act in such a crude and ugly fashion. Why don’t you stop by your local 40 Days for Life vigil and see for yourself?

However, I’m also sorry to hear that your child was killed because s/he wasn’t perfect enough. There are so many amazing individuals with Down syndrome who being their families pure joy. I’m sorry you’ll never experience that.

Bob, can you cite some sources to back up your statistics about these “multitudes of children”? See, I know tons of families who have been waiting years and years to adopt, and I know several families who recently adopted Down Syndrome orphans via Reece’s Rainbow (fabulous charity, by the way!).

I understand why you are so angry. Guilt will do that. Again, I encourage you to stop by your local 40 Days for Life vigil location so you can witness peaceful, prayerful protest.

Funny how Joanna can espouse love and compassion in one paragraph and judgment and contempt in the next.

Hypocritical much?

If you thought you’d ever change their minds about you guys, all hope of that is lost now. Nice job. Enjoy that foot.

Well, Amy, I won’t apologize for making the judgment that killing an unborn child because s/he has Down Syndrome is an objectively evil act. This is a Catholic website, and that reflects Catholic believe. However, I do realize that Bob and his wife were probably acting out of misguided compassion, and I feel nothing but compassion and pity for them, especially given how they were treated by folks who should have approached them with love and caring, not mockery and rudeness.

Bob - I find it amazing that you can gauge the quality of someone’s independent thoughts via an Internet connection! I assure you all my thoughts are my own.

I would love to adopt a special needs child someday. Sadly, it’s not financially feasible for my husband and I at the moment. I hope that will change. In the meantime, head over to Carla’s blog and check out little Henry - isn’t he cute? http://bringinghenryhome.blogspot.com/

Bob, do let me know of all of these children with special needs that you personally know who need homes—I’d love to spread the word! Maybe we can hook them up with some adoptive families.

Praying publicly in front of abortion clinics is not false piety or being hypocritical, rather it is standing up publicly for what we believe. We all have a duty to do this! We should publicly stand up for the truth even if we have to suffer ridicule for it. Christ promised that we would be persecuted for following him. Telling the truth about the evilness of abortion and contraception is not popular but we have the responsibility to do it anyway!

Bob, do you know how much it costs to adopt a child, special needs or otherwise, domestically or internationally? The costs range anywhere from to $10,000 - $25,000 (unless you go through the foster care system, and right now my family doesn’t fit the qualifications necessary to be foster parents in my state).

I don’t know about you, but we don’t have cash like that just laying around. However, if YOU do and you would care to to donate it, let me once again direct you to the excellent charity Reece’s Rainbow - http://reecesrainbow.org. Your money would do a lot of good toward helping those children find loving homes.

I’ll be judged by the Lord, yes, thank goodness.

Roe vs. Wade is not even law, someone reminded me this week.  It is a Supreme Court decision. 

Killng our own is not good practice…say that 100 times and get thee to an abortion clinic to pray!

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

“Roe vs. Wade is not even law, someone reminded me this week.  It is a Supreme Court decision.”

Except it *is* the law.  It confirms the right of a women to make decisions over her own body as being Constitutionally Protected.  It’s as much a law as the freedom of religion.

Barring this right, society could make all reproductive choices for women.

“Praying publicly in front of abortion clinics is not false piety or being hypocritical, rather it is standing up publicly for what we believe.”

It’s not hypocritical?  It is when your contraceptive policy directly increases the number of abortions you are praying to prevent.

“I would love to adopt a special needs child someday. Sadly, it’s not financially feasible for my husband and I at the moment. I hope that will change.”

LOL, it must be nice to have a CHOICE.

IMHO and please read http://www.answers.com/topic/roe-v-wade
The right to kill unborn children…and this is the real issue…..cannot be law because the US Constitution states….and I quote without the copy in front of me…....the words ‘life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness ’  can’t have liberty without life…..can’t have the pursuit of happiness without life.

The website I stated above brings out the many loopholds in Roe v. Wade. I truly believe for 40 years, people have been living a lie.
Abortion clinics are closing…people are praying in front of abortion clinics….go to www.silentnomore.org    

NO WOMAN CELEBRATES HER DECISION TO HAVE AN ABORTION.  in many cases, she does not even make the decision…her husband, family, boyfriend, ‘good other friend’ make the decision for her.

Over 3,000 babies area killed each day in the US.  It is lessening due to prayer and the people’s realization that killing one’s own is not such a terrific action after all.

Men may be responsible for having their girlfriend get an abortion….I said MAY.  And that if why they think abortion is such a necessary law…protects their sexual activity and covers their sin.  Killing is a sin…...

I am talking about the issue of legalized abortion. I am not talking about individual people.

Oh, if you want more evidence, go to the library and check out Hand of God by Dr. Bernard Nathanson.  He and his friend made up the numbers of back-alley abortions that would justify abortion on demand.

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

“the words ‘life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness ’  can’t have liberty without life…”

ummm, that’s the Declaration of Independence…...****rim***shot****

Don’t like abortion, don’t get one.  The fact of the matter is that a women’s body is her own.

I noticed that Yeah, Right On did not respond to anything in my previous email except what I missed..Declaration vs. Constitution.

Well, at least I have my priorities right!!!!!

BTW, my parents used a contraceptive and removed it when they wanted to have children….so I am missing the many other possible siblings in my family due to my parents’ choice.  I do not fault them…..I just will wait hopefully to greet my Lord and Master and tell Him I tried to save babies already conceived…ones He sent us…and someone said….well, no thanks…thanks, but, I will wait a while….not knowing that that same baby will not appear again, ever again….it was unique and special and just wanting our love.

See, the money is not the issue….we have not enough love…that is what the issue is…increase love and babies will find the homes they so want.

Great blog….chances to spread the life word in every entry.

Praise God!!!  Patricia in St. Louis, MO

“The fact of the matter is that a women’s body is her own.”

Irrelevant, as it’s not her body that is killed and mutilated during an abortion - it’s a child’s body.

“Irrelevant, as it’s not her body that is killed and mutilated during an abortion - it’s a child’s body.”

Not really.  Until the fetus can self sustain life outside of the mother it’s her choice.  Otherwise you’ve regulated women to a government incubation facility.

“NO WOMAN CELEBRATES HER DECISION TO HAVE AN ABORTION.  in many cases, she does not even make the decision…her husband, family, boyfriend, ‘good other friend’ make the decision for her.”

So let the GOVERNMENT decide what to do with her body?  Crazy.

“See, the money is not the issue….we have not enough love…that is what the issue is…increase love and babies will find the homes they so want.”

So you still have a CHOICE.

Don’t like abortions?  Don’t get one.

Yeah, Right - so, when I was pregnant with my son, did I have a penis? If not, whose penis was it?

Women are are obligated to respect the rights of the separate, distinct human being within their bodies, given that 99.9% of the time they made the CHOICE to engage in the act that put that human being there.

The government decides what we do with our bodies all the time. There are laws prohibiting illegal drugs, drinking, tattoos, etc. Michelle Obama wants to regulate what kind of food we put in our bodies now. San Francisco wants to outlaw circumcision. So, why do you approve of government intervention with “our bodies” in those cases, but not in the case of an innocent unborn child being slaughtered?

“Don’t like abortions?  Don’t get one.”

Don’t like child abuse? Don’t abuse a child.
Don’t like slavery? Don’t own a slave.
Don’t like domestic violence? Don’t beat your wife.

Would you agree with the above, YR?

An unbeliever in God challenged God that he could make a human being just as God did….and God said, “OK, let’s see.”

So the unbeliever bent down to get some dirt.

God said, “Oh, oh….that is MINE.  You get your own dirt!”
————————
A woman’s body was created by God and created for a purpose.  A man’s body was also created by God for another purpose…..One complements the other.  If you do not see the connection, then you would not understand if I told you that when the woman’s egg and the man’s sperm come together, this union creates a new human being because God is there is make this happen.  Ask any person with lots of medical degrees who might say….no one knows how the human being is created, but it happens when the sperm breaks into the egg.

Who can kill what God creates…....a woman’s body is not her own, like her car is her own because she paid for it, and her refrigerator and her clothes….they belong to her.  She has to care for these things as she cares for her body…..does abortion make her a better person….not really…she will mourn.  Go to www.silentnomore.org if you doubt my words.

I am so sorry no one has ever told you that her body is not really her own.  This short period of time she can use this body and THEN, when she dies, her soul which governed her body for her life on earth will live forever with God or in a place that starts with an H and ends with 1 ls.

God bless your work and your continued learning about the purpose you have on earth.

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

“When I was pregnant with my son, did I have a penis? If not, whose penis was it?”

Did you? Inquiring minds want to know.  Out of curiosity, would you still be able to get married:)

“Women are are obligated to respect the rights of the separate, distinct human being within their bodies, given that 99.9% of the time they made the CHOICE to engage in the act that put that human being there.”

Except it’s not *separate, distinct*.  It’s not viable outside of the mother, what the mother chooses to do with her body is her choice.

“The government decides what we do with our bodies all the time. There are laws prohibiting illegal drugs, drinking, tattoos, etc. Michelle Obama wants to regulate what kind of food we put in our bodies now. San Francisco wants to outlaw circumcision. So, why do you approve of government intervention with “our bodies” in those cases, but not in the case of an innocent unborn child being slaughtered?”

What do all of these have in common?  They apply to people outside of the womb.  Allowing the government to have control over womens reproductive rights is insane.  Once this door is opened it becomes feasible to force women to have abortions in the case of genetic defects or what ever crazy idea the moral majority feels is a-ok.

When you have an applicable analogy I’m all ears.

“Did you? Inquiring minds want to know.”

I’m asking you, YR, but it appears you’ve been caught up by your own illogic, thus why you don’t want to answer. If, at the time I was pregnant, my son’s body was merely a part of my own body, then I had a penis during my pregnancy. If, however, is body was separate and distinct from my own, then his penis belonged solely to his body and not mine.

So, answer the question. When I was pregnant with my son, did I have a penis? If not, whose penis was it?

“Except it’s not *separate, distinct*.”

Yes, it is, otherwise you are claiming that I had a penis when I was pregnant with my son. Ever hear of a little thing known as DNA?  A baby has its own unique genetic code, separate from that of its mother, from the moment of conception.

“It’s not viable outside of the mother, what the mother chooses to do with her body is her choice.”

She’s not choosing to do anything with her body; she’s choosing to kill and mutilate her CHILD’S body. “Viable” is not a synonym for “separate and distinct.” I’m currently 28 weeks pregnant; my child is has his/her own separate, distinct body and s/he is also viable. However, I could still get an abortion as long as I claimed to be depressed and got a doctor to sign off on that. Do you think that would be moral, given that my child meets your (apparent) 3 criteria for being regarded as a human being?

Viability is 21 weeks and falling. Do you oppose all abortion prior to 21 weeks?

“What do all of these have in common?  They apply to people outside of the womb.”

I assume, then, you FULLY support women drinking and doing illegal drugs while they’re pregnant, and even encourage same? After all, if the baby’s a part of a woman’s body until birth, then drinking and drugs will only affect HER body and no one else’s, right?

When you start making logical sense, I’m also all ears.

To the person who said it was hypocritical for me to pray for an end to abortion and condemn contraception: They are both serious evils. There is no excuse for either of them under any circumstances whatsoever. They are totally immoral and evil and both should be illegal.

As for the arguments about it being a woman’s own body all I can say that this is false. If you look at it from a scientific point of view it is a separate body, a separate individual. Those that deny this are denying science on top of denying all the religious arguments. If you deny this you are denying the science you seem to hold up so high to try and erroneously disprove religion with. Science supports the true religion-Catholicism. Whether the unborn child can survive outside the womb or not is not the issue. This does not change the fact that there is a separate being in there. The government should protect life those that support abortion should be prosecuted as criminals for that is wehat they are. Supporting murder at any stage of life is sick and perverted.

“So, answer the question. When I was pregnant with my son, did I have a penis?”

I’m pretty sure that you’re the only one that can answer if you have a penis.  If your trying to insinuate that it takes two to tango, than it’s a moot point.  It’s women who gets pregnant. 

If it’s separate and distinct then the fetus will have no problem living outside of the mother, her part of the equation is solved.  Now Everyone can rejoice.  Oh, wait…reality.  Damn, thought we had this one solved.

“She’s not choosing to do anything with her body; she’s choosing to kill and mutilate her CHILD’S body”

Not really.  You do realize that over 30%  of all pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion, typically before a women realizes they are pregnent?  Right…. How is deciding what is going to happen to her body different than blind chance?

“Viability is 21 weeks and falling. Do you oppose all abortion prior to 21 weeks?”

Actually I don’t care.  Not my problem.  It’s a womans body, and her right to choose what happens to it.  She will have to reconcile the choices that she made with her body.

“If you look at it from a scientific point of view it is a
separate body, a separate individual.”

Fine take it out, see how that works.  Reality check:)

YR, it’s a question anyone with a basic knowledge of human biology and anatomy should be able to answer. The fact that you can’t/won’t answer it speaks volumes. Put it in hypothetical terms if it’s easier for you: if a woman is pregnant with a male fetus, does she have a penis? If not, to whom does the penis inside her body belong?

“If it’s separate and distinct then the fetus will have no problem living outside of the mother,”

We’ve already established that “separate and distinct” is not a synonym for viable, YR. A newborn child is a separate and distinct entity that is 100% reliant on another human being for survival. Does that mean that newborns aren’t human?

“You do realize that over 30%  of all pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion, typically before a women realizes they are pregnent?  Right…. How is deciding what is going to happen to her body different than blind chance?”

Seriously? Let me reframe your question. “You do realize that the majority of senior citizens die of old age, right? How is murdering my grandmother different than waiting for her to die in her sleep?”  Do you condone the murder of senior citizens, YR, just because some die of natural causes?

“Actually I don’t care.  Not my problem.”

Why don’t you care that human beings (by your OWN criteria) are being murdered? Does your callousness and apathy extend to all murder?

“Fine take it out, see how that works.”

We’ve already established that “separate and distinct” is not a synonym for viable, YR. Someone who is hooked up to life support is still a separate and distinct human being, entitled to basic human rights, even if that person needs assistance to breathe.

Reality check - viability is not the definition of what constitutes a separate being. Both humans and animals require a period of pregnancy whether in the body or externally as in the case of birds. A rational person cannot deny that it is a separate being. It is a distinct life form with its own bodily processes and its own unique DNA. You cannot say it is part of the mother’s body but it is totally dependent on the mother. This is the natural order of things. A infant or small child if left to itself could not survive either. Are you suggesting infanticide should be legal as well? Because if vialbility is the definition of being worthy of life then an infant does not fit that criteria either. There is no difference. They are both wicked. Reality check - I do know what I am talking about since I am well-versed in human anatomy and physiology and I work in the medical field.

The issue is love….if you love abortion SOOOOOOO Much, I cannot make you have the child. 

I will definitely make my views known when $365 million of our tax dollars are going to kill our own citizens…..not with my tax dollars!!!!!!

Enough people agree with me that over 300 world cities now have a twice a year session called 40 Days…to pray and offer women options to killing their own.  Simple and easy.  If you love babies, pray at an abortion site very son.  It might change your way of thinking.
Patricia in St. Louis, MO

There is something most people overlook: the woman. What woman wants to allow a stranger to axe-murder her own child? Very, very few. What woman wants to allow a stranger to rape her with medical instruments? As Frederica Mathewes-Greene said, a woman doesn’t want an abortion as she wants a Porsche or an ice cream cone. She wants an abortion as an animal caught in a trap wants to chew off his own leg.

If the baby is part of the mother’s body, she is indeed chewing off her own leg. If not, we’ve made our case. I consider it an insult that anybody would claim my sons’ penises were part of my body. I am a woman and proud of it.

64% of women report they were coerced into abortion. 90% report woefully inadequate or no counseling. Abortion is the biggest fraud that ever happened to us, and the most insidious form of slavery. Anybody who thinks abortion availability is good for women either is totally ignorant or hates women. It’s that simple.

We deserve better.

I am blessed to be a volunteer counselor @ a pregnancy counseling center right beside an abortion mill.  We spend as much time with the women and men who enter our doors as they want and need.  It’s wonderful to see and feel the relief, love and compassion that develops in the majority of these parents if their PT if positive.  Should they decide to also have an ultrasound, when most see their beautiful babies own little bodies in their wombs, the exhilaration is priceless.  Even if they later choose abortion, they know of multiple choices and are educated as to possible physical and mental results down the road in their lives either way.  I’ve held the hands of many women who break down and are finally able to share the stories of their past abortions and the horrors of guilt and loneliness that have been riddling their minds and hearts for days, weeks, months, and years.  When a woman chooses life @ our facility, we offer her many tools, support and love for now and the future.  It’s a joy to see the FDFL prayer warriors next door.  Don’t you consider it odd that you seldom see any kind of support for those who leave abortion facilities from the pro-choice side?  Where is that compassionate concern?

Powerful article!  Love this because it tells her actual experiences while also dispelling many myths!

I can see where this is, in her area, by her comment of not wanting to disrupt businesses - where the clinic is located here is on a side road with offices - some medical.  It wasn’t until we the witnesses were standing out there, that people even started to realize that there was “one of those places” there - we had quite a few slow down to ask or even just to stare, with their mouths hanging open - “Harry, I didn’t know!”  “Martha, neither did I!”

Saying that a baby is not life at the beginning of conception is like saying when you plant a seed with fertilizer and it begins to sprout it is not the beginnings of life for the plant, tree or whatever you are planting.  If it is taken care of, it will grow and prosper—just like when a mother takes on the responsibility of not smoking, drinking or doing drugs when pregnant.

I remember being very afraid the first time I prayed outside an abortion clinic - and I’m a counselor at a crisis pregnancy center! It was one of the most PEACEFUL experience of my life. I don’t think I’ve ever felt more confident that I was doing God’s work as I did saying the Rosary outside of that clinic.

#3 is very true!  Even in my area!
Where we are, the clinic and the pro-life pregnancy center are across from each other, and we are directly in the middle.  It’s quite the advantageous location.
-
Regarding prayer: enough people have cited the praying and the dedication of the volunteers as a key factor in changing their minds that I know it is hardly a vanity trip.  I myself have been out for only two days and have already been humbled by some incredibly genuine piety. 
-
Today it rained.  I was kinda grumpy from getting up early, and compared to yesterday it was kind of a ho-hum day and I was feeling ambivalent.  This evening just before sunset we were treated to a jaw-droppingly gorgeous rainbow.  There is HOPE! :)

In St. Louis, MO we have the one and only remaining abortion site in MO.  The site in Columbia, MO closed a few days ago…amid cheers from all!! 
The abortionist would enter the ‘clinic’ (hardly regulated as a clinic) with a hood over her head and accompanied by a uniformed person.  THe prayer people shouted to her….hi, doctor _____, we are praying for you with love and smiles. 

Apparently, she could not take the love any longer.  We have the 40 days event here in St. Louis with over 80 churches covering the 40 days from 7 AM - 7 PM.  We need to be there. 
When a person has a wound, the white blood cells go to this site and stay there until the infection leaves the site. No one would question why the body does that.

That is what we are doing…..staying there until the ‘infection’ goes away.  The only people who would question our being there at Planned Parenthood are those who LOVE abortion!  IMHO   Being there energizes me for the rest of the day.

Until the abortionist quits and the staff leave and go to other jobs and the women quit filing in and stumbling out in pain and sorrow.

Please do not say only the baby is killed in there.  The mother sustains guilt and her life is forever changed…not right away but sometime in her future.  Who has read www.silentnomore.org?  Who knows aout Rachel’[s Vinward, the healing ministry for post-abortive women?

In Christ,  Patricia in St. Louis, MO

I am a pro life pagan and this is my second 40 days for life vigil I’ve attended. I found the people to be open despite my religion. Thanks to the people who’ve accepted me and others to join in saving lives and helping women and men affected by abortion. Also, if anyone wants to join us we are on Facebook under Pro Life Pagans. It is a group open to anyone regardless of religion or lack of.

You guys are terrible. I’ll tell you right now, if I got pregnant I would get an abortion as soon as possible and laugh in the face of anyone who tried to tell me not to. It’s seriously none of your business what someone does with their own body.

I agree with you. It’s nobody’s business what you do with your own body. But the baby isn’t your body.

If you can die for a friend…then surely you can save one!!!  Get involve!!!

http://www.ewtn.com/vexperts/showresult.asp?RecNum=555885&Forums=0&Experts=0&Days=2008&Author;=&Keyword=leaving+the&pgnu=1&groupnum=0&record_bookmark=48&ORDER_BY_TXT=ORDER+BY+ReplyDate+DESC&start;_at=

http://www.ewtn.com/vexperts/showresult.asp?RecNum=555885&Forums=0&Experts=0&Days=2008&Author;=&Keyword=leaving+the&pgnu=1&groupnum=0&record_bookmark=48&ORDER_BY_TXT=ORDER+BY+ReplyDate+DESC&start;_at

TO:  Posted by Me on Wednesday, Oct 5, 2011 8:09 AM (EDT

$363 million of US taxpayers money is paying for abortion EACH YEAR.  If you want an abortion, no one can stop you…you have free choice.  We want to offer you options for you and your baby….so you do not sound like these people on www.silentnomoreawareness.org  

I want my tax mney to help women who are being pressured and want to have their baby.  Over 60% of women are pressured to have their baby.

No abortion, giving live birth and you avoid post-abortion syndrome, possibility of mental and physical illness and sorrow for killing your own baby.  Now that you know that, why would you choose an abortion?

In any event, I will pray for you…please pray for me!

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

Patricia, I’m sure you meant over 60% are pressured to have an abortion.

Pat you are right….over 60% of women are pressured to abort their babies.  See this website….very telling on the horrors of killing babies.

http://www.wrtl.org/resources/churchpastor/statistics.aspx

Did anyone else read the autobiography or Steve Jobs?  How many babies with skills similar to Steve Jobs have been killed/

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

And, is it not possible that the child or children who were sent by God to find a cure for cancer have been killed by abortion.

There are already multiple cures for cancer, but the medical Establishment doesn’t use them because they’d lose a huge moneymaker for pharmaceutical companies and cancer organizations. That said, perhaps the person who could break through the logjam once and for all got aborted. Aside from that, each child is precious in God’s eyes, and God has a plan for each child’s life. I would rather think in those terms, personally.

One of our adopted children is a paramedic. He was obviously at risk of being killed by abortion before he was born. I don’t know how many lives he has saved, but it is not a small number.

The Jews say if you save one child, it is as if you saved the world. Folks, we have galaxies to save! Every abortion is a tragedy of incalculable proportions. With each child killed, they have possibly killed entire future families.

@ Pat - please share - What are these multiple cures for cancer that you say are out there? We do our best with radiation and chemo and are constantly doing research but if you say there are many cures out there pleaselet me know what they are.

@ Sam, This is off topic, but I’ll give you a brief answer. I can only scratch the surface here. This is my fourth attempt to post. The site is throwing up roadblocks.

Laetrile in combination with heavy doses of Vitamin A, dietary changes, and other treatments, often works well. I have had two friends with cancer. One went to Mexico, and went into remission for over a decade. Another simply kept apricot pits on her desk and ate them. This cleared up the problem for decades.

Electrolytic regeneration, which restores the balance through diet, creates a fever, and includes heavy doses of Niacin, reverses the course in a few days. My friend who went to Mexico had a recurrence, and used this method, and went into remission within 3 days, and I saw her a couple of decades later and she was still healthy.

Vitamin D3 at the proper blood levels keeps most cancer at bay. Avoiding sugar is also very helpful. Resveratrol is also good.

Avoiding abortion is a major way to prevent breast cancer (other risk factors may kick in, but this would cut a woman’s chances by at least a third, if not more)

There are numerous herbs that are very helpful to reverse the course of cancer. Cancer is actually caused by malnutrition in most cases.

There is a lot of information at the site of Mer cola. Google his name. Newsmax has several doctors that provide good information. There are also other sites that have information. There are books on cancer healing that are full of information, discussing many different methods. Read alternative literature. If you are a doctor, you will be doing your patients a huge favor.

There is something everyone needs to understand about medical issues. Our medical profession has turned away from basic medical ethics. Doctors have become shills for powerful and poisonous chemicals. Most doctors still care, but they don’t read their own medical journals, which is where MOST of this information comes from in the first place. Decades of practicing bad medicine led naturally into acquiescence when some colleagues started actively killing unborn babies, the elderly, and the disabled. I personally believe that when doctors concluded that it was acceptable to hurt in order to heal, that’s when the corner was turned. It started innocuously enough, with being willing to give a child a shot without numbing the flesh first. Vaccinations are a whole other story. Many contain some very toxic substances, and some are made using human fetal tissue (from aborted babies). When doctors turned away from herbs and accepted the isolation of pharmacologically active substances from all the protective substances in plants, that was another step in the wrong direction. Doctors are very good at patching up damage from accidents. That should be their specialty. They rarely know any effective methods for anything else. It is their responsibility to demand accountability from their colleagues. Without their acquiescence, we wouldn’t have abortionists. They would have been run out of town on a rail. Abortion is unethical, and it’s bad medicine. In my opinion, so are all standard cancer treatments.

TO Paul Rimmer:  who wrote recently on this blog…...

Posted by Paul Rimmer on Friday, Sep 23, 2011 4:11 PM (EDT):JoAnna, thanks!

It seems the organization also has some issues about contraception, and is comprised mostly of Catholics, but it shows great promise, and seems to be open to divergent views.

My views are contraception is necessary to minimize abortions, and that abortion before brainwaves can be measured is morally acceptable because the group of cells is not yet a person.

Dear Paul:  God Himself at the moment of conception…when the sperm breaks through the egg helps the man and woman create the baby or babies..
It is a person smaller than the size of the period at the end of this sentence.  You cannot decide when the person becomes a person.  Contraception causes abortions in many different ways…..do some internet search, perhaps…this may not be an issue I can explain here.
I will pray for you.

TO:  Sam who wrote:

Posted by Sam on Sunday, Oct 16, 2011 11:08 AM (EDT):@ Pat - please share - What are these multiple cures for cancer that you say are out there? We do our best with radiation and chemo and are constantly doing research but if you say there are many cures out there pleaselet me know what they are.

Sam:  Go to www.oil-testimonials.com and read some of the testimonials on the healings of the oils…...can’t say cure.  I can personally relate about a friend who acquired Gulf War Syndrome and beat it with the oils.
Her daughter with ovarian cancer beat it with the oils. 

A doctor recently did a research project on a woman with late stage cancer.  In several weeks or months she had no more cancer symptoms after he gave her the frankinsense oils.  This doctor recently had a peer review with doctors at Washington University so that he will soon be publishing his good news on this woman’s good news…no more cancer healing.  Her medical cost was a fraction of the cost of chemo.

If you want to contact me further, I give permission to the moderator of this blog to give to Sam my email.  I would be happy to share the good news.

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

@ Pat and Patricia - Thanks for the very interesting info. I will definitely have to do a little research into it. However I will tell you that all oncologists I know will agree that vitamins and healthy diet are a great preventative and lower one’s risk of getting cancer. However once the cancer is present this option is not strong enough. I also know of people who have refused our standard treatments go a natural route only to return a year later with the cancer spread throughout the body. I also know of a guy who had prostate cancer which is 99.9% curable but refused radiation and all other standard treatments. He opted instead to go an all nautural route. He died 12 years later with cancer throughout the body. Prostate cancer is generally slow growing which is the main reason he survived so long.
Doctors acknowledge the importance of diet and vitamins etc but this is not all there is to medicine. The danger that is often seen is that people totally reject all modern medicine. Yes by all means check out your options but don’t dismiss a cancer treatment because it might be mainstream. We have made amazing progress in the past few years. Just dont dismiss our efforts and acuse us of hiding a cure to make money.
We see people suffering, their families suffering, dying etc. and wish we could do more but not every disease has a cure. At least not yet. The other thing that makes cancer so hard is that cancer is not just one disease, it is many many diseases. It comes in multiple forms, often acts unpredictably, and can attack any part of the body.

So all I’m asking is don’t be too quick to dismiss what we do, just as you dont want the nautural routes to be dismissed.

@ Paul: Your criteria for personhood leaves a lot to be desired. It is based on when we can DETECT brain waves. The baby is very tiny. It’s amazing we can detect brain waves at all! But if you look at development, you’re not looking at a clump of cells. The baby’s body is well organized from the very beginning. By the time most women are sure they are pregnant, the baby has fingers and eyes. To begin with, the baby forms a ball of cells, each of which is extremely complex. A form starts to take shape, where the head is clearly the largest part. The first organ to form is called the Primitive Streak. This is actually the early spinal cord. From there, the neural network forms next, and the network delineates shapes of internal organs. The electrical impulses cause the totipotent cells to differentiate into various types of cells, depending on the organ that is being formed. The heartbeat can be detected at 21 days. In order for the heart to beat, there HAS to be brain waves. This is because without an impulse that travels from the brain through the vagus nerve to the heart, all the heart would do would be to fibrillate, because that impulse coordinates the cells of the heart so they all beat synchronously. So indirectly, we know that there are brain waves at 21 days. Do they occur earlier? We don’t know. Perhaps they do. Perhaps there is a “spirit” that experiences thought, and settles into brain tissue to express itself later in the baby’s life (once the brain exists). We are more than just our material bodies. That much is clear. Are we prepared to say that before the spirit has a body in which to settle, we can take the life God created with impunity? I’m not! That mother bonded with her baby within a few hours after fertilization, even though she is not consciously aware of it yet. Every time the morula touches the Fallopian tube, hormonal messages are exchanged. This is what stops the mother’s period. I personally was aware I was pregnant within a couple of days of conception, each time. Many women are not. But you tear that baby out of a woman’s body, and you do her grave harm as well. Don’t be so fast to make the mother vulnerable to other people, who will find abortion convenient, or who can make money from it. We deserve better.

Contraception isn’t the answer. Contraception doesn’t prevent abortions. In fact, use of contraceptives outside of the bonds of marriage actually encourages abortion, when they fail. Studies have shown that unmarried people rarely get the same reliability from any contraceptive method that married people do, and even with married people, there is a failure rate. Failure rates with condoms are very high. Remember, a woman is only fertile for 10-15% of the month. Condoms also fail in ways that allow one partner to contract sexually transmitted diseases from the other. The contraceptive pill also has a failure rate which is greater than properly practiced natural family planning, and in addition, changes a woman’s body chemistry so she becomes MORE susceptible to STDs, including HIV.

No, I’ve never been a Catholic. These are my own views, derived after a great deal of study.

@ Sam:

I hope you didn’t read my responses as advocating vitamins and diet alone. I wasn’t. There are other supplements, not classified as vitamins, that play a vital role. There are a number of substances derived from plants and other sources that cause apoptosis. Furthermore, it looks like the major issue for many cancer patients is cachexia, so if you treat that successfully, it prolongs life. And there are things like using heating of the body. As you read about these things, you may well find that the answers surprise you. I personally have been keeping track of some of the later Establishment treatments, and quite frankly, I’m finding that they don’t meet my standards. If I had cancer, I would forgo even these new treatments in favor of letting the cancer run its course, if that were my only choice. I have already reduced my chances considerably in many ways, and have favorable genes. But even if that were not the case, I simply find the standard treatments, even the new ones I know about, to be the cure that is worse than the disease.

I don’t doubt that a lot of oncologists are sincere, but they have been “educated” into their mode of thinking, partly through cult mind control techniques employed during internship and residency, where they are not allowed to get enough sleep and thus lose many of their discernment capabilities, together with the massive propaganda from pharmaceutical companies and the media, which propaganda plus bribery also tend to lock in inability to discern.

And yes, I know it is claimed that cancer is really many different diseases. I don’t totally buy that. If it were, you wouldn’t have the metastasis you do. There are things most doctors don’t seem to take into account. There is a SYSTEMIC problem when cancer takes hold. Address that, and “many different diseases” doesn’t matter.

Lest you think this is a problem peculiar to cancer treatment and oncologists, I assure you it’s not. It also applies to the treatment of diabetes and heart disease, and to abortion. The use of statins is unconscionable. They CAUSE the very things they are supposed to prevent, just by a different route. Doctors are not taught how to do cost accounting. If they did, they would weigh the adverse effects of proposed treatments into the equation, and they seem not to do this. It has gotten to the point where they overlook the damage they are doing in all these areas.

My sister was on a boatload of drugs for diabetes, including statins. I spent many months, and ended up with harsh words and shunning, to try to get her to stop putting them in her mouth, to no avail. She, along with the Establishment, was literally petrified to distrust her doctor and listen to me. While I was not speaking to her, I asked God to intervene, which He did, and the next time we talked, I learned she had gone on the Atkins diet, and dropped the statins, and although it’s too early to tell what it will do to her weight, she said her blood sugar readings were wonderful!

In my personal experience, diagnosis is only correct about 25% of the time, even though I depend on diagnosis to know what natural treatments to use, and if I do try to get standard medical treatment, it rarely works for me anyway. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times standard medical treatment has worked for me, and I don’t even have to use my thumb. Given the mindset I am describing, it’s no wonder doctors look the other way regarding abortion. The biggest problem is that doctors don’t even read their own medical journals, which is where most of us get the information we use to begin with.

If doctors would just adhere to the standard, “Primum non nocere”, a lot of this stuff would never happen, including being willing to accept the utilitarian mindset behind performing abortions for social reasons.

Check out the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons. They have a web site full of eye-opening information. They’re primarily Establishment doctors, but their mindset is quite refreshing. They are revising their site, but I hope it will soon be possible to find once again their discussion of various medical oaths, and why they were written that way, and what happened to them.

We are rapidly reaching the point where Establishment medicine will have to change radically anyway. The current treatments and tests are just too blasted expensive. We cannot afford them. So far, the answer seems to have been to abandon or actively kill patients, unfortunately. And it’s a direct result of the 53 million children we have killed through abortion, who could now, as workers, support the system. But sooner or later, the difference between those who go natural, and those who stay in the Establishment, will become stark, especially as people are forced to go natural because they cannot afford anything else, and that would include me, by the way. I pay for all my own care.

On my previous bog comment I said:

A doctor recently did a research project on a woman with late stage cancer.  In several weeks or months she had no more cancer symptoms after he gave her the frankinsense oils.  This doctor recently had a peer review with doctors at Washington University so that he will soon be publishing his good news on this woman’s good news…no more cancer healing.  Her medical cost was a fraction of the cost of chemo.

Correction:  ..no more cancer healing     should read no more cancer symptoms.

Sam:  I never negated the medical doctors in this blog, from their attempts to cure people with cancer.  Remember, in Europe, doctos use our essential oils FIRST I am told….THEN….if they do not work, go to drugs.  I will have to verify this.  Please do not fear…..I have a quality health plan.  At 72 years of age, I take ONLY the pills of Calcium 600 mg and Vitamin D3 1000 mg.  I care for people who tak 10-12 pills a day.  I am losing weight for the first time in my life, using Young Living Essential Oils…...see why I am excited.  I hope this comment goes through. I accidently used the enter key to make small paragraphs.  Patricia in St. Louis, MO

Read more: http://www.ncregister.com/blog/what-i-learned-from-praying-in-front-of-an-abortion-clinic/#ixzz1b5FanPV1

Patricia, the sooner you divorce yourself from Young Living Essential Oils, the better. It is a multi-level marketing company, and the business model of MLM is fundamentally flawed. Only the people at the very top make any money. Everyone else loses their shirt. It can destroy your family relationships. I can tell you this from PERSONAL experience. A dear friend of mine has lost his wife, and may lose his kids, and has also lost his shirt, all because SHE got involved in MLM. I won’t even buy products from MLM, because I won’t have anything to do with them.

One of our economic problems as a nation is that there is too much of this kind of scamming going on. Not only do corporations do this, if they follow the MLM business model, but so does the government with its endless welfare schemes, tax and spend. Our economy is a major factor in the push for abortion, because being unable to afford a child is a prominent reason for having abortions. By scamming people, MLM and government contribute to the problem. MLM ought to be outright illegal, but some of the prominent companies have made a lot of money and used it to lobby Congress to get the loopholes necessary to stay in business. MLM wouldn’t even work if it weren’t for people’s greed. They are attracted by the false hints of huge profits to be made. Take a look at the web site of Pyramid Scheme Alert. They explain the mathematics, and why it doesn’t work. Also, a fellow named Eric Scheibeler wrote a book, Merchants of Deception, about Amway (one of the first MLM) it would be well worth your while to read.

There are many companies that provide good products to do the very same things these essential oils do. You can even get the very SAME oils from other companies, and they are usually far less expensive because you have to pay all those middlemen in MLM. MLM is giving natural healing modalities a very bad name.

PLEASE don’t be involved anymore.

“it looks like the major issue for many cancer patients is cachexia”
Yes treatment does take a toll on the body. Depending on where the cancer is people also lose their appetite. But most cancer facilities have a dietitian on staff who meets with the patients to help them with proper nutrition during treatment.
“so if you treat that successfully, it prolongs life” - it will not prolong life if the cancer is allowed to run rampant.
“And there are things like using heating of the body” - this is something I have studied. It is still being experimented with but it has not shown to be very effective.
“There are a number of substances derived from plants and other sources that cause apoptosis.” - Did you know that a number of chemo drugs are derived from plants?
“In my personal experience, diagnosis is only correct about 25% of the time” - If that is true then how would you know if they are wrong? One can’t diagnose oneself by looking at symptoms etc just over the internet.
“If I had cancer, I would forgo even these new treatments in favor of letting the cancer run its course, if that were my only choice.”—running its course the cancer just keeps spreading and will lead to death.  God did give us knowledge and doctors. Just because it is mainstream doesn’t mean it is worthless. We have had amazing successes and survival rates are improving.
“And yes, I know it is claimed that cancer is really many different diseases. I don’t totally buy that. If it were, you wouldn’t have the metastasis you do. There are things most doctors don’t seem to take into account. There is a SYSTEMIC problem when cancer takes hold. Address that, and “many different diseases” doesn’t matter.”” - They are different diseases because they behave in different ways. Some respond well to radiation and some don’t etc. Cancer arises in abnormalities in the cells. For example a cellular mechanism that tells the cell to stop replicating is broken and the cell keeps replicating out of control etc.
Because the different forms of cancer respond differently they must be treated differently. This has been demonstrated scientifically.
“The biggest problem is that doctors don’t even read their own medical journals, which is where most of us get the information we use to begin with.” - actually doctors very much do read medical journals especially in the oncology world. When they choose treatments they must be able to back it by published research. They do not just pick a treatment on a whim. Plus many of these articles are written by the very doctors you claim do not read them.
“The current treatments and tests are just too blasted expensive.” - new treatments are always expensive because of all the research that went into them. This takes money.
“This doctor recently had a peer review with doctors at Washington University so that he will soon be publishing his good news” - What do you mean by this? Do you mean he submitted his research and other doctors verified it or do you mean that they all discussed it together and agreed that it was worthwhile? Many cancer clinics have peer review on each patient. I have personally been present for many, many of the latter.
As for Dr. Mercola - He seems widely discredited by the scientific community. I would also find his promotions suspect because he is selling the very products he advocates as having amazing properties. In the scientific world this is called a conflict of interest. Obviously not everything he says is false but some of it is certainly far out there.
As for essential oils - testimonials are not sound scientific reasons or proof.

Sam: I have had my say on this topic of Young Living Essential Oils with you.  I will concentrate on people who are interested in learning about them.  God bless you real good!

Patricia in St. Louis, MO

My other message is awaiting moderation. I should add that you personally would probably find more benefit in reading the writings of the various MDs that are affiliated with Newsmax. This is where people like Dr. Mercola and the Health Ranger often get their information in the first place; they are saying the same things.

This message is for the young women who still believe what their culture is telling them. THe real truth is::::: Abortion is genocide…period!!!  It was legalized using many brainwashing techniques. Where are the babies from the baby-boomer generation???  Why has America been forced to recruit immigrants from other countries just to continue the economic growth here???  If every baby boomer would have followed God’s teachings we would all be living with our own extended families. (This is not meant to bash any immigrant…just to open your eyes.)...  Population reduction/destruction is the goal of abortion as well as monetary gains for the wrong people…  Anyone who has had an abortion will tell you that they have had periods of pure sadness at the loss of their own children. Your child will not come looking for you 20 years down the road. You will then see what you have lost.DO not listen to this putrefied culture that we have allowed to proliferate. There are ways to give birth to this beautiful life and there is help for you. Whatever this culture is offering you instead…is fleeting and it is not God’s plan for your life. My heart is sad in thinking that the new immigrants who come to this country will too become brainwashed by the lies. Pray hard and save your baby!!!!