Matt Baglio’s curiosity was piqued.
An exorcism course at a Vatican-affiliated university in Rome? It was an unusual topic. As an American journalist living in the Eternal City, he thought it might make for an interesting article; as a non-practicing Catholic at the time, he approached it with some skepticism.
Taught by exorcists and experts in theology, satanic cults, criminology and psychology, the course he took challenged many of his assumptions. But what really intrigued him was the openness and honesty of a fellow student, Father Gary Thomas, a priest from the Diocese of San Jose, Calif., whose bishop, Patrick McGrath, had asked him to undergo training as an exorcist.
As the two got to know each other, a friendship — and a book — were born. The book, in turn, gave rise to a major film starring Anthony Hopkins, The Rite, to be released in theaters Jan. 28.
Baglio’s book, The Rite: The Making of a Modern Exorcist , follows Father Thomas through his hands-on training with an experienced exorcist in Rome and accompanies him on his first exorcisms. At the same time, Baglio’s research provides a more detailed understanding of the history, rites and rituals of exorcism according to Catholic teaching.
Baglio spoke about some of the insights he gained from researching and writing The Rite.
It’s unusual for a layperson to write about a topic such as exorcism. What were you hoping to achieve with this book?
I wanted the book to be as real as possible. Too often in the past, most books on the topic have fallen into two categories — either they were written by priests who believe 100% or they are written by skeptics who don’t want to believe. I fell right in the middle. I didn’t discount the possibility that it was real, but there were some aspects that didn’t convince me.
Even exorcists admit that 90% of the people who come to see them don’t need an exorcism. I tried to focus my research on that remaining 10% and came to the conclusion that even though some of these cases could be explained, there were still a few that remained outside the scientifically explainable.
Being naturally curious, I wanted to understand what was going on. I wanted to shine a light on this phenomenon so that believers and skeptics could look at this topic and say, “I’ve never seen it talked about like this before.”
In addition, while I had read books on the theology of exorcism before, I’d never read a book about what it was like to actually be an exorcist, and the book was really an attempt to present the topic through the eyes of this journey.
What did you learn that changed your previous assumptions about exorcism?
One was that the exorcist has to be the ultimate skeptic. At first, the skepticism surprised me, but then it made sense — because the last thing you want is a priest who sees the demon behind every corner.
I was also surprised by the sophistication of many of the exorcists; they had doctorates, spoke many languages, and they didn’t have the fundamentalist approach I had expected. Every exorcist I talked to was also incredibly humble. They weren’t these action-hero types you’d expect. Some of them were very old, frail, shy and timid. During an exorcism, they pray the ritual very calmly and quietly. Hollywood wants the dramatic elements; they want the holy water to hit the person, the scream, the cross, etc., but it’s usually not like that.
Another was that exorcism is not a one-shot deal. People think that once the exorcist begins praying the ritual, he doesn’t stop until it’s over, and if the demon isn’t cast out, the exorcism was a failure. But it’s really a journey, a process.
Many people think that exorcism is on the fringe. I was surprised to learn that the theology behind exorcism isn’t. Exorcism was central to what Jesus was trying to do in his public ministry. There was spiritual warfare in the early Church, and it has been passed on to priests today who are now exorcists.
It’s important to note that exorcism works in tandem with the sacraments, especially reconciliation. The goal is to weaken the power of the demon so that the person can return to practicing their faith, praying and receiving the sacraments.
How does an exorcist distinguish between cases of psychological illness and cases of demonic possession?
Exorcists have to work with mental-health experts, because there is a fine line between mental illness and demonic possession, and it can be difficult to discern. Someone who says he hears voices or demons talking to him could be suffering from schizophrenia, for example.
The priest has to be cautious, and there has to be a process. To discern the presence of an evil spirit, they look for various signs: First, they have an interview with the person, then they send the person to see a mental-health specialist, and then the person comes back and the exorcist begins to pray blessings over them.
Exorcism is not an exact science. There’s a lot of mystery to it. In the end, everything depends on the will of God and on the person’s free cooperation.
How do people become victims of demonic possession in the first place?
It’s said there are various ways a person can open a doorway and become possessed. Exorcists told me that it’s mainly people who take their focus away from God, who don’t practice their faith, go to church or receive the sacraments.
According to exorcists, the No. 1 reason is an involvement in the occult. There could be other factors at work, such as a curse or being part of a Satanic cult.
Every case is different, but the one common factor seems to be that it’s about personal choice, personal responsibility. I had one exorcist tell me that demonic possession isn’t a disease; there are no predisposed qualities that a person has that can cause them to become attacked by a demon. A person needs to open up a doorway, and so in this way, we must be aware of our actions and try to avoid grave sins.
This also means that in order for a person to become liberated they have to be proactive and correct the behaviors or actions that may have led them into becoming a victim in the first place.
How faithful is the movie to the spirit of the book? We know that the character of Father Gary Thomas was changed from a priest to a young seminarian having doubts about his faith; that’s one major departure from the book. Does the movie present the priesthood and the theology of exorcism accurately?
The movie is slightly different from the book, but there’s nothing in the movie that isn’t theologically posited in the book, so they’re not pulling things out of left field. The filmmakers have tried to be very faithful to the theology of the Church on the dynamics of demonic possession.
The message is very similar to my book, which is this idea that evil likes to stay hidden, but it’s through belief, through faith, that you’re able to overcome it.
I helped on the set of the film, and Father Gary Thomas was also on the set. He said the exorcisms they were filming were “very believable.” They were very careful to make this film as real as possible. When you’re dealing with this topic, you don’t have to sensationalize it too much. The topic is dramatic enough.
Register correspondent Trish Bailey de Arceo writes from Xalapa, Veracruz, Mexico.
Steven D. Greydanus: The Devil Inside
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I had a cousin (sadly now deceased) who was a Jesuit priest. One of his certifications was that of an exorcist. About 40 years ago I asked him about it. He really didn’t want to discuss the topic, but he finally said that one of the greatest dangers of performing an exorcism was the danger of losing one’s faith.
Interesting. Have to look for this movie next month…or maybe stop being lazy and buy the book.
WHY is this topic being treated like “Maybe there is something to this after all”?
God and The Adversary are AT WAR.
Merry Christmas.
I am looking forward to the film. However I feel it’s worth mentioning that we can still see and feel many of the repercussions from ancient Lacydaemonia. Anthony Hopkins is a wonderful actor and an equally good author.
LeChat. I believe your point about what your cousin said. Even those with the greatest faith struggle mightily when faced with the dark side. I think they are opened up to horrific spiritual attacks by the devil that we could never understand. It happened to many saints. I am sorry to hear about your cousin, he sounded like a warrior for Christ.
My cousin and my father were born within six months of each other and died within six months of each other. He spent many years as a missionary on islands in the Pacific. Oddly enough, they both died of heart attacks. I miss them both very much. That was 30 years ago.
LeChat, I wonder did your cousin mean that the devil attacks the faith of the exorcist, or that he risks losing it because the ritual seems ridiculous with dubious results? Or is that the same thing for a vulnerable priest? I noted that “every case is different” and I wouldn’t be surprised if every exorcist is exposed to different dangers.
Hail Christ!
Our Lady of Victory, pray for us.
Marty W, my cousin’s statement that he was afraid that he might lose his faith was the end of the conversation. He did not elaborate. He was extremely reluctant to even discuss the subject.
Prior to the end of the aforementioned conversation, he did say that that most cases initially presented as demonic possession are actually psychiatric disorders. The Church takes these things very seriously and has specific phenomena to check for when making a determination regarding the actuality of possession. The items that he mentioned are:
1. Speaking in languages that would be unknown to the possessed. Aramaic would be an example.
2. Levitation
3. Telekinesis
This conversation occurred back in 1972 or thereabouts.
The book itself was very good. It was one of those page turners where I wished it wouldn’t end. I only hope though that more Bishops appoint exorcists in their dioceses, and both priests and Bishops believe in Satan’s power.
Secular liberalism is close to demonic posession in that it is so inceredibly dishonest; for example, gay “marriage,” Obamacare, economic “stimulus,” ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell,” the new EPA regulations…
Is it illogical to think that ALL illness be it physical or mental, be inately evil beause of the fall of man? Jesus istructed his diciples to heal and cast out demons-so why should any christian believe His instuction does not stand today - even more so? He called satan the “deciever” and it would be fitting that satan would use physical OR mental illness as a ploy to inflict oppression, obsession, or possession.-For men to believe that a ‘pill’ can ‘fix’ a problem without prayer and spiritual guidance is very dangerous and also a lie. Christians must more fervently pray and witness to the Good news of our Lord - for deliverance from the attacks of the evil one - and should all put on the armor of our Lord! The time draws near and satan knows it and is working very hard at his misson. Let us be discerning and ever mindful of his lies.
If you read the book, points are made that not all physical or mental illnesses are caused by Satan. Before an exorcism is done, the individual must go through a physician and a psychiatrist (Catholic) before this claim can be made. And St. Michael would be the saint to pray for deliverance from Satan.
Some illnesses and such are things that God allows, for his own reasons and probably for our own good in some way God can see and we can’t.
I do agree though, that with all of the things happening like Obama care, same sex marriage, abortion, etc. Satan is certainly behind it, and what is scary is some of our politicians, Hollywood “stars” and music may have sold their soul to Satan either voluntarily or involuntarily. And yes, we must pray and sacrifice.
I really liked the book, just hope the movie is believable. One of the worst things that can happen with this movie is it goes too far from what reality is for these priest. If people question demonic possision, a hollywood blood and guts movie will drive people further away from the real truth. A special note to Warner Bros. Pictures, the maker of the film., the world is watching so please make this movie but leave the real facts in place. This world really does not need any other reason to disbelieve the power of evil. Seems that most just believe it is fairytail already.
///Side-Note:\\\ I am a member of a paranormal team in North Alabama, Before I joined the group, they investigated a case in Central Alabama of possible possession. This did indeed turnout to be a case of possession with almost unbelievable bodily contortions along with many of the typical signs and symptoms associated with a possessed person. (( The possessed lady, in her 60’s, bent over BACKWARDS and the back of her head almost touched the back of her ankles, all-the- while keeping perfect balance and continued to communicate the answers for the question being asked to her at the time. She was not a contortionist in any way and had no previous history of anything paranormal in her life )). This case was turned over to a demonologist which, in-turn, had an exorcism scheduled. After my group returned to our home town, a couple of the members had lasting negative effects for months and one is just now correcting theirself after almost one year. This has changed their lives forever. Please don’t underestimate the power of satan and his army!)
If you grow up and see ghosts or have a brush w/ something negative and otherworldly, you don’t need a movie or books to prove anything. You need St. Michael and St. Benedict.
Paranormal groups that watch TV and buy equipment to set up shop scare me. I have never advertised what I see because of ridicule, and find that the people needing my help seem to cross paths with me. You don’t need a Catholic priest to exorcise, but someone who will go toe to toe with what is feared, and learn to live with the unsettling aftershocks that try to shake your faith.
What has happened is that people throw the word demon around all the time, and most of the time that is not the case. Believe me you know when a dark presence is in your life. And you are certain when it is a low level entity.
I firmly believe that Satan and his demons can possess people. But, I also think that this is a rare occurrence and one rarely “voluntarily sells his/her soul to Satan.” In response to rosemary curie’s post, I believe that the sins of Hollywood stars are more likely their own errors of judgment. Satan may have had a hand in their response to temptation, but I doubt that any stars have sold their souls to the devil. As I said before however, I do firmly believe that it does happen, but one cannot attribute any error of judgment to Satanic possession. We must pray for those who fall prey to temptation (ourselves included) as much as for those who are literally possessed.
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