A FB friend writes:
Totally serious with this question. With all the Dustup going on with HHS etc. and living in a “Liberal” diocese with it’s own collections of “Liberals” (or Insert Loons if you’d Like), We’ve gotten the Bishop’s Response, but where does one find the Highest Ranking HUMAN Female of the Church? I do realize who our Highest Ranking Female is, and I have prayed to her for helping me in my unbelief and confusion, but this is one of those questions when I heard it Really made me go Hmmmmmmm.
Unless someone has been baptizing female aliens, all females who are members of the Church are human females.
The highest ranking female is thus the highest ranking human female, who is the Virgin Mary, who I am assuming is the one the reader has prayed to. Rank, in her case, is assessed based on her relationship with King Jesus, her son.
At the present moment, however, the Virgin Mary is in heaven and thus is not active except through her intercession in the Church Militant (i.e., the Church here on Earth).
If the reader means, “Who is the highest ranking female in the earthly Church” then the answer will depend on how one interprets the concept of rank. This can be assessed by different criteria, including honor, power, and authority, both secular and religious.
I don’t know how you assess honor apart from power and authority, though there are various women who have special honor even though they do not have corresponding power and authority. These might include the Catholic queens who head some nations. They have notable honor in the secular sphere, though since most are in constitutional monarchies, they do not now wield significant power and authority.
The difference between power and authority is that power involves the ability—in practical terms—to get things done, to have an effect. Authority, by contrast, involves the legal prerogative to exercise power, whether one actually has that power or not.
In terms of which women have the greatest power, it might well turn out that some of the pope’s assistants have that. They may not have high-ranking (highly authoritative) positions, but in terms of their ability to influence the actual course of affairs. Some of these women are members of the papal household, they take care of the pope, they have his ear and can get messages to him whenever they want, and—I am led to understand—one such “behind the scenes” woman is entrusted with the sensitive task of writing some of the current pope’s public addresses, which means that words she writes can become magisterial statements when he endorses and utters them.
These women, despite their great influence, do not have legal authority, however, which is measured along a different axis.
Because the Church’s organization depends fundamentally on the apostolic succession instituted by Christ and conveyed historically through the sacrament of holy orders, no women are part of this apostolic-sacramental hierarchy. The members are all a subset (a small subset) of baptized males.
The apostolic-sacramental hierarchy, however, does not exhaust the Church’s administrative structure. For example, there are offices in the Roman Curia, which assists the pope in the administration of the Church, that do not require ordination.
In recent years, some women have been appointed to position in the Roman Curia, and in terms of legal prerogatives, some of these women would exercise a corresponding legal authority, apart from that exercised by members of the Church’s apostolic-sacramental hierarchy.
The relationship between the legal hierarchy and the sacramental hierarchy is something that awaits further clarification.
The more fundamental of the two is the sacramental hierarchy. In a certain sense, anyone who is ordained will always have powers that are not possessed by someone with a merely legal (juridical) office. On the other hand, those with juridical offices may possess the authority to do certain things that a person is not entitled to do merely by virtue of ordination.
The relationship between sacramental and juridical authority thus is complex and may well be clarified in the future.
Because of the complex relationship between sacramental and legal authority, it will never be the case that you can point at a woman with legal authority and say that she “outranks” a man who is ordained without qualifying the type of authority in question. You could, however, say that she outranks him with regard to certain legal powers, and that he outranks he with regard to certain sacramental powers.
The same is true of non-ordained men. They can in principle be given all kinds of legal authority without having any sacramental authority whatsoever.
Historically, the bestowal of legal authority in the Church has been tightly linked with one’s place in the sacramental hierarchy, but this has been loosening in recent years, and we will have to see what the future holds.
This all deals with the question of authority within the Church. The question of authority in the secular sphere (e.g., those women in national governments who wield secular power) is a completely separate topic that does not map onto this one.
Thus, whatever influence Kathleen Sebelius wields in the Obama administration, she is not the highest ranking female in the Church, regardless of her power to force abortion and contraception down American Catholics’ throats.
What do you think?
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... did you answer the question? Maybe I was expecting a particular person or persons to be pointed out by name, but maybe such was unrealistic.
@ the ubiquitous
i agree…unless one’s son is high up in the authority of the church, she has no authority…and only then by how much authority he grants her…
.....
mother mary holds the ultimate authority, because her SON wields the most authority and HE has granted her more than even a saint (who is dwad first, saint second) can grant to his mother ... who, by the time sainthood hits, is usually dead too…
.....
so, every woman should have as many sons as possible to get 1 chance to become somebody…no woman who aborts any child can ever fill the bill…and evem more so for sebelius, who is “for” everything we hold most abhorent…
For the record, I disagree with your feelings here. The game isn’t about the referees.
You could have been honest and state that women have no standing in the Church. By maybe being a secretary to the pope really doesn’t qualify. Womens place in the Church is little different than in the Muslim world. The only difference is that the Church is not as active in the secular world as Sharia law.
If we are to believe that parents are the primary educators of the faith, then surely my earthly mother was the highest ranking female in the Church. Now, my wife is. Do either of them carry Apostolic succession? No, but neither did my earthly father or the vast majority of men.
(Great article, I’d like to share the following.)
Jesus is the greatest human BEING that ever lived.
If we saw Jesus coming over a hill and we asked: What is that?
- We could say that’s a man, or we could say that’s God. Both would be right.
If we asked: Who it is? -The Second Person of the Holy Trinity, begotten not made one in Being with the Father…
The greatest human being (created being) -is Mary.
If we saw her coming over a hill and we asked: What is that?
-That is a Woman. Who is that? - Mary the Mother of God.
Mary Is, and Will Always Be, the Greatest Human Being that ever lived.
AND She is not only the greatest human being that ever lived, She is the Greatest Created Being that ever lived. Queen of Angels.
The Womb is sacred, God Himself chose conceived there.
Notice that there was no gap in the “I” that is the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.
-You can’t be Christian and be for Abortion
-You can’t be Catholic and not have the highest respect for women.
Jimmy, why did you take this bait?
Rank is NOTHING to us — God is everything. To receive Jesus in the Eucharist is beyond description - the power to elect a Pope, or the rank of “Servant to the servants of God” - NOTHING.
“The greatest among you is to be the servant,” Jesus said, and he demonstrated it.
I appreciate the offices of priest and bishop, but I’m no less a Christian than they, have no less a place than they, and have the same vocation to holiness as they. Who in blazes would ever think about a term like “rank” in the embrace of love that is the Church?
Mother Teresa while alive illustrates the immense amount of influence and status (even despite her detractors) that a mother superior general can have within the church. Certainly in many ways she had more defacto influence than some bishops.
Hail Full of Grace…
Mike Yetter wrote: “You could have been honest and state that women have no standing in the Church.”
Yep, that’s right there in the Nicene Creed: women need not apply. Or maybe it was Didache?
Mr. Yetter, I think you are confusing your opinion with the truth. The Catholic Church is topsy-turvy as Jesus said in Matthew 20:16. It will always be topsy-turvy. As to having the truth, I try not to confuse myself for God.
So if you are female and you’re right with God, you have the most authority in the church. But being in that position you will be deeply aware of the distance remaining to go and likely think as St Teresa de Avila, Doctor of the Church, did, “Always think of yourself as everyone’s servant; look for Christ Our Lord in everyone and you will then have respect and reverence for them all.” Or you may hear the words that St Catherine of Siena, who excoriated Pope Gregory XI to do the right thing and he did so humbly, did, “I am God and you are not.” Not surprisingly, it’s the same for males.
Mr Yetter, If you haven’t already, I suggest you read starting with Luke 9:46.
President Obama thinks is Sister Carol “Habitless” Keehan.
The church is about spiritual power, not political or legal power. The most powerful people in the history of the church were powerful because of their spiritual superiority due to God’s gifts (mostly spiritual) and instructions given to them by Jesus himself, or, often by His Blessed Mother. Many of these saints were women, and I cannot think of any great saint that did not suffer tremendously, including Jesus and Mary. We do not need to establish laws, we need to uphold the teachings of Christ.
Yes, rank means nothing in the Church - it is service that counts. But insofar as an Abbot of a monastery is comparable in authority to a bishop of a diocese, would not an Abbess of a convent be equivalent to a bishop, as well. Just wondering.
You can’t be the highest ranking anything in the Church if you are not IN the Church. KS is clearly not in communion with the Magisterium, and so is not in the Church. She needs to either come home via the Sacrament of Reconciliation and Penance (including reparation) or be excommunicated for the scandal she has caused.
The comments about rank and service (service outranking rank!) are “spot on”. The challenge becomes those who are the servants of servants, being sinful, “abuse their authority”. Their attitudes, their actions have lead to the modern “revolt” by women, who have been neglected, abused, etc. I’m sure some will object w/ the statement here, but that is the reality. Yes, there are good and holy “leaders” in the Church, but more prevalent is the “good old boys” club. Many practices, customs, traditions (not teaching or actual liturgical law) continue that marginalize women and promote this tension. And then on the other side of the equation there are demands for ordination, since that seems to them to be the only way to effectively bring about change.
Michelle Moran, from England, is the Chairwoman of the Catholic Charismatic Renewal (to be more precise, of the ICCRS, coordination-service in the Vatican). The Catholic Charismatic Renewal is 20 million to 80 million strong, the biggest Catholic reality, bigger than Legion of Mary, Knight of Colombus, Opus Dei, etc… There is no bishop in the Church with 20 million people. Maria Foce, leader of Focolari movement, is a strong leader, but Focolari are “only” 1 million strong (perhap 4 million if you count friends).
Asking who the highest ranking human woman is, sounds like the serpent in the garden, playing to our need for vanity. It’s all about the power and prestige and speaking for others, and everyone talking about you.
It has very little to do with the overall respect for women. If we look at that in a political sense, then George Bush led the way with putting women into power, and not only that, but African Americans as well…him that was such a “racist”...of course, then my comments will be relegated to the “doesn’t count, Uncle Tom” pile, since the people in power weren’t of the liberal variety.
As to the comment of the highest ranking woman…every single momma who has had to put up with dirty diapers, snotty noses that transformed into snotty attitudes, joy at every miles sotne her children achieved, sorrow at every setback they suffered. My mother has had a more direct impact on my life, than any “woman in power”. My mother is in Heaven now, along with my other Momma, Mary…whose son has had much more of an impact than any Sebillius, Obama, or Sanger ever did…or ever will…
I think the highest ranking female in the Church militant is the pregnant woman who loves God with all her heart mind, soul, and strength, and who seeks to know the will and do it with her whole heart and her whole life, unswervingly and unhesitatingly. For that woman Jesus would move mountains when she asks Him to in faith. If we understood this, oh, if only we understood this! Then if only we had the patience to see it done and to cooperate as God works it out!
If you want to know which supposedly Catholic woman has the most secular influence in today’s world? Who knows? I am sure we can come up with a laundry list of ladies who might fit the profile for various reasons, but the fact remains that this is a question where the reasoning of man is at odds with the reasoning of God. And perhaps that is the question we should really want the answer to- why do we ask this in this way, and why do we not see it from God’s perspective?
One could presume that we have abandoned JESUS’ teaching that CHURCH LEADERS, as HE advised the apostles at the Last Supper, should not Lord it over the people like secular rulers. So much for that with the “princes of the Church” for cardinals, and all except the pope have purely secular titles- Eminence and Excellency, your Grace and my Lord, and living in palaces as they were called in the Old Country, and many of their residences in the New World were like that. “My Lord” for honoured clergy is more of that outdated nonsense.
A big push for women’s ordination is seen as a POWER levelling move. Not a desire for service. The male clericalism and medieval nonsense needs to be dropped, filed away to see what the real needs are for the 21st-22nd century Church.
Every human being comes through a woman! Every woman has the opportunity to change the world through her children. We also can run for office, run companies and/or serve the world. We have more options than men but we don’t demand respect by the secular world.
We have been marginalized for decades by the “feminist movement” who tried to bring us down to the equality of men. We aren’t equal we are different. We could be more but there needs to be a new “feminist movement” that makes it clear that men that are bad or know no better can use us for sex and then have us move on with our hearts crushed. I work with these women trying to come into the church but are living with men that have no idea ever to marry them. We have power as so many woman Saints have showed us. Be ourselves, insist on a level of power then pray for our children, act and teach the truth, and become a Saint. The real power is how we insist on those around us to behave.
It’s time that women raise up and insist on respect for being the tabernacles of life! Men can’t do this! They can be priests and bishops but there is no equal!
I believe it is correct to say that an Abbess holds the most authoritative position available to Catholic women.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01007e.htm
I used to be in the military and most of you liberals have this all wrong. Given that the authority over the priest is a bishop and the authority over the bishop is the pope, then the chain of command in the Church is only three positions deep. If you can’t have a female pope, bishop or priest, then you think you don’t have a place in a church. If only men can be priests and only priests can be bishops and popes, then it’s by a very simple fact for the way things are: Jesus wanted a male priesthood.
Keep in mind, the church is not a democracy. I kinda like the idea that women aren’t compelled to serve in combat; I’d like to think there’s still gentleness in the world.
Why, don’t you know? It’s Mary Jo Tully. The laywoman Chancellor of the Archdiocese of Portland in Oregon. Her chosen user-name for email is “ArchPrincess”. She has been quoted as saying, “I tell priests and bishops what to do.” A Chancellor whose a woman? And not even a religious? And NOT a priest? Hey, we’re “progressive” out here and proud of it.
The Church only has two ranks. Us and God. Priests, bishops and even the Pope are part of the Us. They just happen to hold different jobs then the rest of us.
Every man is outranked by a woman (though she may not be living), either his mother or his wife. And her authority is Sacramental.
Well, not all abbots are equal in rank to bishops. It depends on the historical privileges of a monastery—ie, if it’s old enough.
But yes, some abbots are equal in rank to bishops, and have the right to use croziers, mitres, bishop gloves, etc. And some historic monasteries of women have similar rights for their abbesses, although usually nowadays they have someone else carry the crozier, gloves, etc. ahead of them.
A related instance was at Kildare, where there was a big ol’ archbishopy see going on, just because Brigit’s huge monastery used to be there. This is why there are legends about Brigit and being a bishop, and why she sometimes carries a crozier in stained glass pictures.
But of course, in Ireland in the hardcore monastic period, most of the big monasteries were crawling with bishops (up to twenty sometimes), and the abbot was the real power in the land. That was eventually changed, but you can still trace a lot of major Irish archbishop titles to abbeys. For example, the archbishop of “Cashel and Emly”. Cashel was the old royal fortress town that was handed over to the Irish church in medieval times, but Emly was a monastery that went way way back.
The first commenter has it right. You have to have a name; if Tim Tebow is not the best football player, someone is; if President Obama isn’t the worst president, someone is; if X isn’t the highest-paid actor, someone is. These are implicitly comparative terms which imply a hierarchy. *Someone* is the best football player, and no argument or theory can controvert the claim that Tebow is the best: You can’t beat someone with no-one. Similarly, *someone* is the highest-ranking Catholic woman, and if Sebelius isn’t her, then someone else is. Anything else is a dodge. And since Sebelius is a faux catholic at best (why our bishops have yet to excommunicate her escapes me), it should be an easy job.
All the arguments about women ruling their nation through their influence over their husbands and sons, and the arguments about women having a different but equal role in the world from men, were dragged out and used to justify denying women the right to vote, the right to practice a profession and the right to exercise secular authority over men. They failed to convince.
I guess the women who remain in the Catholic church are OK with never having any ecclesiastical power or authority. I guess they believe that it’s only a coincidence that an institution that evolved in patriarchal cultures over 2000 years asserts that God mandates a male-only power structure in his church. What would have been TRULY miraculous would have been an institution that placed men and women equally in positions of power and authority. Instead the church hierarchy just mirrors all the other male-dominated institutions that have existed during its history.
It will be interesting to see how long the church can keep women invested while maintaining its archaic discrimination against them.
Simon,
I share your angst, but I think Sebelius has excommunicated herself, and that will grow more and more apparent with each passing day.
David, whether she has or not, the bishops need to publicly act against her. Their lethargy—their refusal, even now, to match their actions to their rhetoric—is an independent source of scandal. Public scandal is always, in the last analysis, collaboration between activist heretics and passivist bishops, and Sebelius’ actions demand public response.
Simon,
You’re right.
Thanks.
“I believe it is correct to say that an Abbess holds the most authoritative position available to Catholic women.”
How about saint? In which case, there are a number of living candidates since the 1997 death of Mother Teresa.
The unnamed woman who is the pope’s righthand ... man ... is Ingrid Stampa. She’s also a gifted musician and a scholar.
http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Catholic/2005/05/The-Popes-Right-Hand-Woman.aspx
cowalker writes “It will be interesting to see how long the church can keep women invested while maintaining its archaic discrimination against them.”
Does 2,000 years count? Does watching denominations diminish after allowing women priests count? Maybe, cowalker, you should start with the data instead of your opinion.
Mike Melendez on Thursday, Feb 23, 2012 3:49 PM (EST):
“cowalker writes ‘It will be interesting to see how long the church can keep women invested while maintaining its archaic discrimination against them.’
“Does 2,000 years count? Does watching denominations diminish after allowing women priests count? Maybe, cowalker, you should start with the data instead of your opinion.”
Women didn’t see any alternative to male domination until very recently in history. Do you realize that women in America have had the right to vote for less than one hundred years? They won that right the year my father was born—and he is still living! It was my generation that saw many barriers based on gender fall. I think many Catholic women expected to see the church progress toward allowing women to become priests. No matter how much the older, more conservative men in the church hierarchy have said things will never change, I think many Catholic women still expect to be included someday. If they are not, I think they will turn to different other religions. Or maybe they will just wander away from the church and consider themselves “spiritual.”
http://cara.georgetown.edu/CARAServices/requestedchurchstats.html
http://cara.georgetown.edu/CARAServices/FRStats/Winter2008.pdf
I’d say that maintaining discrimination is not keeping Catholics in the church. Women who have rarely experienced gender discrimination personally are beginning to raise families. Will they want their daughters baptized into a church that keeps women out of positions of power and authority? We will see.
Amusing how women crave being a ‘priest’ as an imagined power role. Priest means OBEDIENCE. Back when I was a kid in the fifties there were women religious who ran international orders, entire hospitals, vast missionary works, famous Catholic women scholars, professors and more. The NewChurch isn’t producing those women any more.
Mike Yetter: you could be honest and admit you’re trolling.
cowalker: Sometimes failure to convince is neither the fault of the argument nor its proponent. To answer your question, I don’t care about not being a priest. I’m not jealous. Of what, anyway? Why are you more bothered than I am? I’ll speak for myself, thanks.
At our seminary here in Denver, many of the new priests are taught by nuns, who are doctors and professors. Certainly in the educational activities of the church, women, lay and religious, hold very influential positions.
The blessed Virgin Mary will always be the highest rankong woman in the Church because that’s how God set things up!!! I’m with you Jo…..we continue to think as men and don’t even try to see things from God’s view. The gopsel reading this past Tuesday was from Mark 9:30-37, and Jesus makes it clear who is the greatest…...the one who desires to be last, and that, I believe, is why Blessed Teresa of Calcutta has made such an impact on the world. In a few years people will be asking, Kathleen who?
Mr Hollis: You also need to check the data. That 98% figure that is bandied about is of a fraction of all Catholic women with considerable limits pointing them to contraceptives. That you inflate this into being in favor of the HHS mandate in question says more about your willingness to be deceived. Unfortunately, I suspect you believe the connections you hear in your personal echo chamber.
Not sure who the highest ranking female ecclesiastical authority in the Church is right now, but at the end of the day, it is holiness (the degree of sanctifying grace, charity, and virtue) that really counts in the eyes of God when it comes to our true worth and rank as men and women.
I wouldn’t be surprised if at this moment in time the holiest living woman would be some old lady, single mother, or cloistered nun, whom the world looks down upon outwardly as worthless, but in reality has done more to influence the Church than many others who on the outside may appear to be greatly influential, but in the eyes of God do not excel in true holiness.
The Catholic Church finds it’s strength in all of it’s members. The Church hierarchy is not the sole possessor of power, influence, and greatness.
Who Is the Highest Ranking Human Female in the Church Triumphant?
Answer: Mary, the immaculate mother of Christ, Queen of Heaven.
Who Is the Highest Ranking Human Female in the Church Militant?
Answer: Your own Mother… God commands you to honor her as He honored His.
Mother of God—Mary…
No one is forcing anything down anyone’s throat, unless it is the dictatorial nature of the church. Having been born Catholic and seeing how it has abused its power in the past and even changed the nature is sin, I have been struggling with its unhearing and unfeeling manner in its dictates.
No one is denying any religious freedom as I can see. Each and every woman has the complete freedom to NOT use birth control.
Religious freedom is not for the institutional hierarchy, it’s for the individual’s practice and beliefs. And they are certainly protected.
It’s so simple a child can see it: if woman can abstain from sex to prevent pregnancy, and birth control is not necessary health care, why can’t dysfunctional males? They are not sick either.
“I guess the women who remain in the Catholic church are OK with never having any ecclesiastical power or authority.”
Pretty much, yeah. I’d rather let the men do the work.
You’d really have to ask God for that answer and I doubt he’d choose Kathleen Sibelius. More likely than not someone most of us are totally unaware of at present. Sort of like Sister Faustina.
The earthly woman that comes to my mind is Mother Angelica, the cloistered Sister, who despite many obstacles, founded EWTN and an order of nuns and priests. The Catholic influence that has been brought to the world by her miraculous mission is immeasurable! Now physical illness prevents her from active involvement but one can only imagine the prayers emmanating from her sick bed continue to bring about miracles.
@ Susan Adam: I don’t know how the HHS mandate got into THIS discussion but even IF this blog were about that you have many misconceptions about
that issue. In short, no one’s choice of birth control is being challenged. In fact birth control per se is NOT the issue at all. It is strictly about who is going to pay for the woman who does choose to contracept artificially. Should an employer for whom artificial birth control and abortifacients and sterilization goes against his faith be
required to PAY for these things for all his employees? Why should he
be required to support something that he is morally against? Obviously if the stats are right that the vast majority are using contracepting there
is no problem of supply and demand. This is not a “war on women” that the Obama Administration portrays hoping to garner women’s votes in an election year…but a war on First Amendment rights guaranteed to all.
If we go by Jesus’s criteria of the greatest among our brethren is the one who is servant of all, then many woman in history served the greater humanity in the Church with the Blessed Virgin Mary topping the list. I don’t know who it would be right now, but a few years back Mother Theresa served the poorest of the poor on earth. She’s pretty great.
Though I guess that does not directly apply to the question of greatest “ranking” female. But there were many great great women in Church history.
I propose a small twist in the question: “Who is the most influential or consequential female in the Church?”
I might nominate Nancy Pelosi, but as was commented above about Kathleen Sebelius, I believe she has excommunicated herself.
Instead, I nominate Mother Angelica of EWTN. She conceived and grew the widest evangelical voice on the planet, spreading the Gospel through the airwaves, available in almost every country in the world. If that’s not influence, and effective service and awesome responsibility, I don’t know what is.
The word “rank” is the word for those military men. The fact is that Saints aren’t highly “ranked” in the world. People only notice them if they give and give with amazing grace. Like Mother Teresa.
It’s this idea that we, women, need to fall for the military government male way of thinking to be equal is the problem. We don’t. We know that raising our children, doing honorable work and the seeing the beauty in the world is much more like God than being “ranked.”
Your answer is woefully inadequate, which is not at all what one would expect from the much-respected National Catholic Register. In the first place, your response misses a valuable P.R. opportunity for the Church to name some of those many women who hold significant positions in various Vatican offices. Of American women, for example, Sister Sharon Holland, IHM, is very well known and very highly respected. Until her recent retirement, as her Congregation’s website indicates, since 1988, Sister Holland served at the Vatican where she “ministered in the Congregation for Religious and Secular Institutes; as a professor and canon law consultant; and with the Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life (CICL), where she served as office head for ordinary governance for three years.” Many others come to mind: I think of American Felician, Carmelite and Dominican women, for example, at work in the Vatican’s Secretary of State Department. Secondly, by giving such an evasive and theoretical answer to such an obviously sincere and literal question, your answer seems somewhat disrespectful to the questioner. You can make amends and serve the Church by doing a good job of investigative reporting and producing an informative piece on the corps of women serving in significant Vatican positions.
A Jewish virgin-mother named Mary, also known by her Greek title, Theotokos. She is fully human and quite alive. One place where she can be contacted is in the fifth decade of the Glorious Mysteries where we contemplate her coronation as Queen of Heaven and Earth. There are many doorways to her office. It turns out the Catholic Church is the one institution where there really are no glass ceilings for women.
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