Great article and graphics !
China now has a huge shortage of Women due to their enforced abortions with one child per couple.  Where are the Chinese future women going to come from? - Another war?
Formerly known as (fake) Global Warming and now known as Climate Change - many of the organizations and groups who promote these unproven ideas are population control freaks, and (unborn) baby killers.  Their God is the Earth.

Thanks for posting this, Mark.  Sure wish the rest of the western world would pay attention!  I find it particularly troublesome when Christians take the “overpopulation” viewpoint.  Do they really think God would create a world that we could outgrow?  The “fill the earth” command didn’t include an expiration date!

The one really wonderful thing about these folks is they won’t be around much longer.  Since they refuse to have children, they can’t pass their evil ideology on.  You reap what you sow or don’t sow…

If the parents of these leaders of such movement as Population Bomb etc had believed that they needed to “curb the population”, these leaders would not have been born.  That’s an idea they should think about.  I only have 3 beautiful children who have produced 2 beautiful grandsons for me.  How many x.?  children am I responsible for?

Rita, that’s why they try to indoctrinate our children through the public school system, so they can pass on their evil ideology. We as a society have been in a fight with these people for the minds of our children for decades now.  We need to find a way to exercise the suprimacy of our parental rights.

The problem is we all shall reap what they sow. Not enough people to pay into tax funded programs like Social Security means one of two things. Either we all have to pay more money into it or they have to get rid of it because there isn’t enough money coming in to support it. I think the hatred of children is also behind all the laws and such that limit a child’s freedom. We used to go outside on our own to play at age 3 and 4 etc. Now such a child found out of doors by themself is picked up by authorities and parents are charged and all such nonsense. It’s under the guise of child safety but it isn’t true. The world has never been safe but by being given freedom and room to grow and explore on their own children learned how to be aware of their surroundings and have a healthy respect for what could happen. They learned independence and obeying limits etc. They also weren’t as obese because they were constantly moving and not waiting for an adult to have time to supervise them. Kids need freedom and that has been taken away so adults don’t have to behave themselves or take responsibility for public speech etc. Sorry to ramble but this has been a pet peeve for some time.

Wishing for the dead of another human being to save anything is not the most honorable thing to do, just think of a hero in a movie, for example Superman, wishing for the dead of the New Yorkers, so that they stop being in danger, that´s never going to happen in a movie because the movie makers know what the people is going to say about their movie, but if you apply that way of thinking to the villain of the movie, things make perfect sense and common sense is reflected on the box office. What takes me by surprise is that in real life people don´t see things as clear as in a movie, and that´s very sad.

I’m showing these three videos to my freshmen Bio classes - and mentioning the fact that my six adult children are tax-paying citizens who are married and giving the country more children, i.e., producers(taxpayers).  It’s something to think about.
I also talk about “global warming”, aka “climate change” and the increased photosynthesis possible, thanks to the increased CO2 in the atmosphere.

I’m childfree because I’m a rational thinker and there’s nothing you can do about it.  I don’t believe in “global warming” and I could give a hoot about overpopulation, either.  To have spawn so they can pay more taxes is a horrible and selfish thought.  See you in hell…

I’m childfree because I don’t want kids, plain and simple.  I don’t know or care too much about global warming or overpopulation.  I would think that people with children would be more concerned about the environment since their children are the ones to inherit the earth?
And those of you who look down upon the childfree.  How are you going to respond when one of your offspring come to you one day and tell you that they are never going to give you grandchildren?  Just because we childfree are not reproducing does’t mean that we will all die off and put and end to this “evil ideology”.  After all, my parents weren’t childfree!

The Catholic church doesn’t rule the world so it should only worry about it’s own members with it’s ordained, cattle like mentality. 

But look how the Catholic church treats it’s own children?  Sexual molestation scandals, one right after the other.  The highest in power do a lot of covering up in order to keep this sex-based, money obsessed organization in power. 

In the end times, the Roman Catholic church will fall.  Looks like it’s on it’s way.

Then why does the Catholic church require that priests and nuns be childfree?  If childfree are evil, I guess priests and nuns fall into that category as well.

Yes!  I guess Mother Theresa was evil then, since she had no kids!

Oh yes Jennifer…I’m not naive.  It’s an important battle and one my own daughter thinks she may fight by homeschooling her children.  After 50 million abortions in America we have desensitived people to the beauty and value of human life.  We’ve also created a huge problem with Social Security because of all those missing Americans who were robbed of their right to life, not to mention the millions of Americans who never came into existance because of contraception.  The Catholic church stands alone but stalwart on these issues because it is about the future of the human race.  But remember, demographics rule.  And, selfishness is at the heart of the anti-child sentiments out there because we know that choosing to have children requires sacrifice.

The world is filled with narcissistic, cruel, and stupid people. I would never bring spawn into this crazy world. Teenage girls are sluts before the age of 12, boys the same. Have fun raising your precious childrun in this sick world. I want to leave nothing behind for evil people to make their lives miserable. Most of humanity are filthy blobs of flesh and cruel and evil. So evil is humans, because that is what you and everyone else one this cesspool of a planet we live on are.

Christ wants us to love each other regardless of the choices we make in life. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone…

It isn’t about love it’s about truth and reality.  I can love you, but I would not be ture to myself if I didn’t speak the truth to you.  No one is holding a gun to anyone’s head and telling them they HAVE to have children…  We are recognizing what the reality of not choosing life is and will be.  There are consequences to every action and decision we make.  You are free to choose…  God always gives us free will, but he also reveals to us the truth…and their can’t be more than one truth.  My heart goes out to anyone who is struggling to understand the anti-life culture we live in.  May God show you his love AND his truth.

How can anyone argue that the world isnt seriously overpopulated? Open land is rapidly disappearing, and we can only feed everyone by a dangerous use of fertilzer that is ruining the earth and poisoning our water tables.

It says something that the more educated you are, the least likely you are to have too many kids.

No, Rick, I think that in the current cultural climate, the more “educated” one is, the more ideologically indoctrinated.

Thank you for holding a personal view which is totally opposed to my own “world” view. In the grand scheme of things it matters not whether humans are here or someplace else in the Universe.  Perhaps I am the “evil” twin (or vice versa) of someone else in a parallel universe???  2B quite honest I care not about good & evil as “I love my neighbour”... something I’m sure you understand. However from my reading of the same scriptures, Jesus hated families but I have retrospectfully forgiven him for his distorted thinking on the subject.

The good thing about technology today is that we can have near instant access to just about any information we want.  There is a drawback in communication, however, when the information is skewed and no response is possible to correct or clarify what is presented as truth, but is in fact, half truths and propaganda.

Mentioning Californians for Population Stabilization as an archetype of “evil” is what fair minded people would call, “a cheap shot.” 

I suggest people peruse our website and make up their own mind.

Our concerns aren’t Malthusian, but are very important to future generations of Americans.

California’s population is going to hit 39 million this year.  At the current rate of increase we will have 60 million people here in 40 years, by 2050.  And all of that increase is driven by immigration; legal and, mostly, illegal and the children they have. 

Being from the rain soaked Pacific Northwest, Washington State, Mr. Shea doesn’t understand or doesn’t care about the water problems California has.  Basically, there isn’t going to be any more water, just periods of less water.  And how, exactly, does adding 20 million more people to California improve the standard of living for those already living here?

The United States population is currently 310 million. By 2050 there will be half a billion people living in our country, at the current rate of increase, mostly due do to the influx of legal and illegal immigrants and the children they have. 

And how, exactly, will the addition of almost 200 million more people in less than half a century make America a better place to live?

And we know where that extra 200 million will be living.  They will be living where people are living, now. 

It is all very convenient to say that Malthus and Ehrlich were wrong…and they were.  But the story doesn’t end there.  There can be a lot of human misery endured before we all starve to death, if that ever happened.

Look at the mega-cities in the world today.  Actually, mega-cities is antiquated term now, demographers are now referring to “mega-regions.”  Yes, people are not starving to death in great numbers, and that is good.  But can one argue that the quality of life in those cities will improve as millions more are added every year at a rate of 200,000 per day?  The world population is approaching 7 billion.  What is the quality of life today, what will it be in the future?

Whether or not we are overpopulated depends on your point of view, doesn’t it?

If you are a business wanting more and more cheap laborers, who then become your new customers starting with that first paycheck, or any organization looking to build it’s congregation, you are not likely to care about the effect that a growing population has on the society overall.

One thing seems certain, we are not facing extinction.  America is facing 500 million people in 40 years at the current rate of increase.

“Hatred of life,” Mr. Shea?  Please.

Oh, BTW, even though you think our concerns about the country’s population growth are not valid, what’s your ideal number for the population of the United States?

Think about it.

Rick Oltman
National Media Director
Californians for Population Stabilization

Anyone who hates someone for being CF is completely ignorant, same as hating people who are homosexual or of a different ethnicity to your own. It just goes to show that yet again the religious obsessives out there can’t accept what goes on in the real world.

I’m CF and I don’t care what anyone thinks of me. Why would I want to bring a child into this messed up world with the molestations and violence. And yes, I am referring partly to the Catholic religion because not being funny here but how many priests have abused children?

The world is extremely overpopulated and quite frankly, why should we have to pay for anyone else’s kids when we don’t want any. Get off your backsides and pay for your own kids!

I don’t hate families or children. Only people who discriminate. So if you have an ignorant point of view, jog on!

Why do you assume it’s an ignorant point of view?  I feel discriminated against.  Here in the cattle barn you’re the ones coming across as fundamentalist fanatics who care little about facts.  You just really hate people which was the point of the article.  Evil, in this context means those who hate all humanity and would like to see it destroyed.  Which archetype of evil does that resemble…hmm? (I’ll give you a hint, he’s horny—but not in a good way).

Is bad the only way you know if it’s “real”?  Or are you cherry picking events to reflect your very sad personal/world view?  Today I saw a lot of bad stuff on the news and indeed,that is the “real world” but I am also aware that thousands of acts of goodness took place simultaneously. That is also the “real world.” 

And you know Lynz, maybe you’re right, you shouldn’t have to pay for someone else’s kids but to take this reasoning to its logical conclusion, someone else’s kids should’nt have to support your aged butt in retirement.  Nor should someone’s else’s kid who got raised up and put through medical school be expected to tend to your aches and pains.

“The world is filled with narcissistic, cruel, and stupid people.”  “Most of humanity are filthy blobs of flesh and cruel and evil.”  Have you ever truly loved or been loved?  You shouldn’t say, “Whatever” to that question. It’s of supreme importance.

Mia - - - “Global warming” has already been proven to be a hoax, that is why the taxing money grabbers and baby killers (pro-abortionists) have changed the name to “Climate Change”, hoping people wouldn’t notice.
Lynz - - - No true Catholic “hates” any human being.  Although we may detest their actions.  Why are you being dishonest?
Rick - - - a significant percentage of the population in CA are ILLEGAL aliens. Liberals electerd Obama, Boxer, etc.  It is up to liberals to have their own politicians enforce existing immigration laws and protect our borders.
Stephanie - - - The Catholic Church isn’t trying to “rule the world”.  Catholics want to be able to practice their own Religion without interferance from the Government, crazy Judges who illegally re-write laws, and wacko indivduals who sue Catholic organizations for descrimination if Catholics do not wish to support and adhere to wacko pagan lifestyles.

Mia, I’m sorry your Son is making his living off the taxpayer in this way.
The USA already has a “Clean Air Act” and “Clean Water Act” that Obama needs to enforce.  We don’t need more laws in the US.
In addition, each State has also enacted specific laws that address their own issues affected by their own industry and topography.
On the internet search “Global Warming Unmasked: The Hidden Agenda” by RealCatholicTV.
Once on the site there is a Video, and also access to written documentation which you will find interesting reading including many Scientists who disagree with your Son.
Also the majority of those pushing the Global Warming agenda are also pushing population control including abortion.

Just so it’s clear, the Department of Education reported that an estimated 6 to 10 percent of all students in public schools would be victims of abuse before graduation.

Where’s the outrage (Lynz, Stephanie, and others) over abuse in public schools?  Many of these teachers are protected by the NEA and continue to teach.  Talk about “Sexual molestation scandals, one right after the other.  The highest in power do a lot of covering up in order to keep this sex-based, money obsessed organization in power. “

Just sayin’.

You are right DW.  My daughter was the victim of rape at the hands of a teacher.  Compared to the way our case was handled by the public schools, the Catholic Church looks pretty good, especially when you take into account the Church abuse scandals took place years ago and ours happened in 2004.  My daughter didn’t get an apology, or any kind of settlement.  People accused her of being mentally disturbed or asking for it, she was banned from the school, we had our house vandalized. The teacher got community support and suspended WITH pay and the school planned to take him back pending an innocent verdict which was why we HAD to offer a plea deal.  He was facing over 100 years in prison, but got away with losing his license, therapy and registering as a sex offender.  Mind you this was a predator with a past, other victims came forward.  And he’s still out there loose (last I checked he worked in a strip mall right next to a little girl’s boutique).  From experience I can tell you that people don’t react well to this kind of crime.  They carry a “just world” philosophy (bad things only happen to bad people)and they don’t like to be wrong about the people they’ve trusted.  Anyway, the thing is, I’m a teacher.  I still believe in schools even after everything that’s happened.  I’m still a Catholic even after everything that’s happened.  I understand this issue very well.

You’re all deluded and ridiculous.  Look to your own Nazi sympathizing child molester protector pope if you want a real archetype of evil…

You always know you’ve won an argument when your opponent implodes in a flaming tantrum of death. 

You know Robin, grown-ups have a super cool thing called an intellectual debate.  You should try it some time.  It’s way better than sticking out your tongue and name-calling cause you look all sophisticated and stuff instead of all deluded and ridiculous.

Wow, you right wing religious people are INSANE.

This is why I don’t believe in religion, it is the root of all evil. It causes you to hate people who don’t agree with you.

Guess what? Some people just don’t WANT kids. Period. End of Story. There is no evil at work. But, I guess you Catholics consider anyone who doesn’t agree with you to be evil, don’t you? That’s right, you don’t even believe in birth control! No wonder you are so angry to those who choose to not have kids-because you don’t have the freedom to make that choice for yourself! Your cult-er-religion won’t allow it!

Climate Change, or Global Warming, whatever you want to call it, is REAL. It’s actually scientifically proven to be so, it’s not just whimsical notion someone made up. But obviously, believing that would cause you to go against your fundamental beliefs as psychos-er-Catholics.

In a free America, people are given the right to choose to have or not have kids. Why does it bother you so much that I don’t want to spend my life listening to screaming children, wiping s**t off their a****, and sticky jam of their hands? There are plenty of unemployed, underpaid people having 8, 9, and 10 kids. The human race is in no danger of dying out because I choose to be childfree. And there is no “movement” at work here. We childfree mind our own business-so mind yours! We’re not trying to convert anyone (at least, I’m not).

You people need to get a life, and stop worrying about what other people do with theirs. As one poster said “After all, my parents weren’t childfree!” People will always continue to make the choice to not have kids. In fact, as it becomes less taboo to not have kids, perhaps more people will be brave enough to make the decision. It’s not a necessary part of life. You can be good, kind, and give back to the planet, and your community without having kids. Actually, not having kids gives me more time to volunteer my time to do just that.

Daphne-
The point of this argument is not about “hating” those who don’t have children.  It is pointing out that hatred for humanity and seeing it as the root of all problems (i.e. “the environment”) is evil, or wrong.  We love all the people who are adamantly child-free, but we admonish the sin of hatred for life.  Be clear when you use the term believe.  As a Catholic, I do “believe” in birth control, as in, I believe it exists. I just don’t use it.
SC-
I am so sorry to hear about your daughter.  I will pray for her, and you.

One cannot win by argument on this issue. Those who believe in God and scriptures have one conception. Those who believe all these but are afraid of future on account of more children have another conception. Those who believe in God and His wisdom and believing in reasonableness have another conception. God wants the generation to proceed and so He asked us to multiply. When morality, reasonableness and God’s wisdom are sincerely relied upon, life may be pleasant The Catholic teaching is to the effect that children are the gift of God and that the couples should be responsible parents.

DW,
Semantics? Really? Is that really the only argument you have? As far as my use of the word “believe”-you knew exactly what I meant, so get over yourself.

It’s people like you, who don’t use birth control, who are bringing too many people into this planet.

I love life. I want our species to live for generations to come. Unfortunately, we are using up our resources unnecessarily. We need to stop and take a breath. We need to find alternate sources of energy, perhaps wait until the world is in a more politically calm place-and then consider bringing more life onto the planet.

At this point in time-we could all die tomorrow. It’s only a matter of time before someone “pushes the button”. And I for one am not going to bring a baby into a world where he/she likely won’t live to see adulthood.

Unfortunately, the religious radicals of the world will be the end of us.

-Daph

Daphne-
Please cite data that shows we are “using up our resources unnecessarily”. The US alone has much coal, oil, and natural gas.  We are just not allowed to go get it.
As for your loving life, do you mean you love life for all or just yourself?  I have news for you: you need humanity to replace itself in order to enjoy the life you are living right now.  Most industrialized countries are nowhere near replacement.
Furthermore, if humanity waited for no wars and the “perfect time” to have children then you wouldn’t exist, because there has never been and never will be a “perfect time”.

DW,
I love how you all use the argument “if your parents felt the way you do, then you wouldn’t exist”. Guess what? if I didn’t exist, I WOULDN’T CARE, because I wouldn’t be here to do so!

We are in NO danger of becoming extinct as a race. I just think people need to stop having dozens of kids that they can’t afford because they “can”. It’s selfish and we ARE running out resources.

The “perfect” time will never exist, that was your word, not mine. However if people stop hating those who don’t share the same beliefs, there will be a BETTER time.

But you’re right, that will probably never happen because people like you will never stop hating those who don’t believe what you believe.

So, maybe it is best if we die out and start over. Maybe a more loving people can come out of the hate in this world.

Religion=hate.I want no part of it.

Peace Out.

DW:  Thank you so much!  It’s been a long hard road to recovery and I very much appreciate your support.

Daphne:  If religion is the root of all hatred and evil and if you aren’t religious, then why are you spewing so much hate?  Against people you don’t agree with?  Against children, whom you describe as s#*t/jam-covered screamers?  That doesn’t sound very kumbiyaa to me.  I can’t imagine you’d get down in the trenches to do some altruism, especially if it takes away from fun time or involves s**t. 

Truly, no one is calling you evil.  In fact, given your attitude, it’s best to leave the childbearing to others.  But we really take issue with the anti-life doctrines.  If you feel convicted it’s coming from your own soul.  I remember feeling exactly the same way when I was an atheist(which really IS a religion by the way).  Atheism or materialism, by its nature is anti-life because if nothing has any meaning, if we’re just blobs of protein, if the sun is eventually going to swallow it all, and life is SO hard, then why live at all?  And why propagate life?  And why value it?  Atheism cheapens everything it touches.  It does not make you a better person or make the world a better place, you just become more and more petty, selfish, hard of heart and spiritually dead. 

When your religion lets you down, and it will, we’ll be here, just like we have been for the past two thousand years.

” Mia, I’m sorry your Son is making his living off the taxpayer in this way.
The USA already has a “Clean Air Act” and “Clean Water Act” that Obama needs to enforce.  We don’t need more laws in the US.
In addition, each State has also enacted specific laws that address their own issues affected by their own industry and topography.
On the internet search “Global Warming Unmasked: The Hidden Agenda” by RealCatholicTV.
Once on the site there is a Video, and also access to written documentation which you will find interesting reading including many Scientists who disagree with your Son.
Also the majority of those pushing the Global Warming agenda are also pushing population control including abortion. “
My post stands.
I did NOT write the existing US “CLEAN AIR ACT” or the “CLEAN WATER ACT”, nor produce “GLOBAL WARMING UNMASKED” by RealCatholicTV, plus all their written documentation including statements by many Scientists.
I have a PhD in Physics.  My Son has a PhD in Chemistry.  My education, and my Son’s education has nothing to do with the BUNK of Global Warming.
But both of us can detect false theories that do not have credible proof in documented studies.
I’ve noticed your mode of operation is merely to call people names or attack them rather than produce facts to support your positions.

James George - I never attacked the US Military.  If your Mother suggested that I did, she lied to you.  Check out all the above links for the facts.
I merely stated that “global warming” has never been proven, and your Mother jumped down my throat - attacking me.
Global Warming was the only topic until your Mother tried to make it into something else.
Please provide any scientific domentation that you have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that “global warming” is a threat to be taken seriously. I will be glad to review it, and pass it on to other scientists.
Just give us a link to a pdf file.  That will be sufficient.

James George - links to EXCEL files will also be fine for tables, and other absolute proofs you may have to prove global warming is a danger should be provided in addition to pdf files.
Thank you in advance.

I also would like to see proof beyond any shadow of a doubt that scientifically proves “Global Warming” is a threat - and not merely a normal cycle.
No one has been able to produce required documentation to date.
Obama does need to enforce the existing “Clean Air Act” and “Clean Water Act”.  These laws can be searched and found on the internet.

I would like to see proof beyond any shadow of a doubt that some “God” exists and not merely a figment of imagination passed on from generation to generation just like all religions are.. all i get is a book that humans wrote.

FC:

I would like to see proof beyond any shadow of a doubt that you exist.

The article makes many mistakes& assumptions that simply are not true.
I was made in the 70’s, my views are not. I actually know of the “population bomb” idea and it is not my point. Not every childfree person is focused on not being a selfish ar$e by subjecting others to their genes. My focus& most others is, a lack of DESIRE to have/ raise children. I love kids/ my nephews, but still have ZERO desire to have my own. What is wrong with a quiet, peaceful home? Free of feces/disease?!?
Besides that, I’m old, what reason could I possibly have to want a child?????

Oh yeah.. how exactly do I “hate” kids?!? That reminds me of my High School footaball coach, “When you assume, you make an a$$ out of you& me!”
I LOVE my nephew& kids in general.. I just have no desire to have any!!
I thank G_D in do not share/ am not a Catholic!!

Mark Shea…I suggest you direct your efforts at making the world a better place for the children who were brought into this world and now suffer the consequences of not having a stable home environment or parents; the foster care system for example. There are plenty of children worldwide that are in need of homes/parents. To suggests that people who are childfree hold some sort of “hate for humanity” is ludicrous. Perhaps those of us that choose to be childfree take the time to make the world better for these children…is that hateful? evil? I don’t judge you for having 4 children, which can be also be flipped in a way that suggests that you have created a burden to society. It’s all about perspective. Besides your internet research, I wonder what makes you a credible source to write about this topic.

Wow. Who knew that being childfree would cause a bunch of superstitious nuts who never grew out of having an imaginary friend to label us as evil? Best news I’ve had all day. :-)

The true face of evil can be found in societies which don’t care at all for the planet

I am a child-free, atheist woman. I am bound for medical school and I can pretty much guarantee that I volunteer more than anyone on this board.

That’s a good point up there- what about the priests and nuns who give up having children to live a life of service? That’s exactly what I’m doing (one of many reasons). Where is the difference?

To live a life of “Better have kids, just in case God will judge me for that and not the good I’ve done for mankind” seems kind of pointless and misguided.

I have a beautiful niece I love very much. Her father is virtually worthless. Should he have more kids? Shouldn’t I just selflessly take on a more active role in her life? My husband and I do.

Maybe everyone who is so gung-ho about raising more babies to be productive members of society should adopt or foster. Many of these kids are burdens on the tax-payer. Why not step up? Really make a difference in the world now.

I don’t understand what business is it of anyone else whether my husband and I choose not to have kids.  We just don’t want them, it’s that simple.  I am not saying others shouldn’t have kids - have at it if you want, it’s not my business. This is another case of religious folks trying to force their ideals onto others!

exactly Jen….it’s no one’s business. How would people with children feel if we gave our opinions on how many children they should have?..... “you should have more children…what? you only have 2? you must not care about life..have more right away to save yourself from a fiery hell!” geez….

If you think that we should keep breeding at the rate we are, I vote we have A LOT less medical intervention. People used to have 6 kids for a reason- Half of them would die. There is no reason in this day and age for people to breed like that. Adopt, foster, love children that no one else does. People not improving the world by breeding and going on welfare. And for those that can support children, share that love. Stop worrying about something that makes NO difference in your life. Make a difference if you want to, but please don’t try and ‘convince’ me your having 5 kids is bettering this world- it’s not.

The “people with attitudes like you shouldn’t reproduce anyway” argument is so ignorant and I’m tired of hearing it.  Suggesting that those who chose not to have children for whatever reason are “evil” or “wrong” is absolutely the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.  Those of us who chose this lifestyle don’t hurt anyone, we use less resources (schools, buses, food, doctors and the list just goes on and on) we mind our own business, we volunteer our time and money to good causes ( I know I do and so do my CF friends, the parents never do) we work, we pay taxes and we’re all and all good people.  Those who feel that I’m evil or wrong can kiss it.  I usually find that those who hate me specifically for my choice are just jealous.

The country’s population is 310 million today.  By 2050 there will be half a billion people living in America at the current rate of increase (fueled almost entirely by immigration, legal immigration and the children they have here).

In your child’s lifetime (for those of you who have children) 200 million more people will be added to our country’s population.

Does anybody like what the future will look like in America with 500 million people living here?

Concerns about those concerned about population growth is what started this discussion.

Just asking.

And people wonder why the Catholic church is failing. Evil, eh? What kind of “evil” has been perpetrated by the Catholic Church.

Jesus must have been evil too, since he was childfree. The Dalai-Lama and Mother Theresa too. According to that “author”, Goebbels and Andrea Yates were good people.

I’m a childfree Catholic but I believe in global warming, I believe in birth control, AND I think the writer of this article is an ignorant nut job. Not all Catholics are brainwashed sheep. We ARE allowed to form our own consciences.

Dear Mr. Shea, if you’re so into people having tons and tons of kids, here’s an idea. I just heard on the news that “Octomom” is applying for welfare in California so her 14 ill-gotten offspring will be sucking money out of taxpayers’ wallets. Why don’t you, Mr. Shea, and some of your other nut job, offspring-obsessed friends go on out there and write her a big check so she can keep supporting her brood? Put your money where your mouth is. You love big families and tons of kids? Start supporting the kids being spewed out by people who have no means or intention of paying for them.

Do not judge, lest you too be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged and with the measure you use, it will be measured to
you. [Matthew 7:1 & 2.] Follow Christ’s example and treat others with compassion and respect. You don’t have to like or agree with anyone else’s choices, but do remember that we are all brothers and sisters in Christ.

No one’s talking about an individual’s choice.  If you think child free is the way for you to go, nobody has a problem with it.  I believe the point of Mr. Shea’s article is the MOVEMENT toward a cultural intolerance of children and humanity in general (substitute the word “Jew” or “African American” for “child” in some of these writings and see how it sounds).  So, if you are not a child-hater, you can disregard the article.  If you are a child-hater, and you work hard to propagate that view, then yes, you should face the fact that you are dabbling in evil. But since many of you seem to be irreligious, why do you care if someone’s calling you evil anyway?  That concept shouldn’t exist in your world view.

BTW, the tone of the “child-free and lovin’ it” responses are really appalling.  Are you aware how petty you sound? (I would say childish, but that would be an insult to little people everywhere).

Well, assuming a world pop of 6,697,254,041:

IF we gave everyone in the world 1/4 acre of land (total including house) it would require a land mass about 10x the size of Texas or 2,616,114 sq miles. (Texas being 268,581 sq miles) Which is of course actually a relatively small amount of land area (about 21% of the earth’s surface). This is ONLY living land of course.

Assuming each person on the planet needs 0.5 hectares of land for agriculture per year we would need an additional 8,304,595,010.84 sq miles of planetary surface to feed all these people (seeing as the earth’s surface is only 57,500,000 sq miles) we would need approximately 145 earths JUST to feed them.

“...It is realistic to suppose that the absolute minimum of arable land to support one person is a mere 0.07 of a hectare–and this assumes a largely vegetarian diet, no land degradation or water shortages, virtually no post-harvest waste, and farmers who know precisely when and how to plant, fertilize, irrigate, etc. [FAO, 1993]”

Now if we went with a bare minimum of 0.07 hectare per person we need approximately 1,810,077 sq miles of agricultural land which equates to roughly 1/3 the earth’s surface, and may be doable… This would of course not offer much variety in crops, a very bare minimum quantity of food to each person, and doesn’t take into account how much of the earth’s surface is inhospitable and definitely not fit for agriculture. Desert’s alone represent 19,166,666 sq miles of the earth’s surface (approximately 1/3)

And we don’t have room for businesses, shopping, streets, parking lots, airports, theaters, amusement parks… etc you get the picture.

Of course these are numbers I just quickly Google searched and pounded into a calculator so my they COULD be wrong. But I think the principle explains itself.

That was kind of fun - thanks for the interesting post! I love it when people make outrageous claims then don’t bother to back them with facts. In five minutes I managed to lend serious doubt to that statement. It brightened my day. :)

OK, Deandra,
Your post was just laughable: “I’m a childfree Catholic but [1] I believe in global warming, [2] I believe in birth control, AND [3] I think the writer of this article is an ignorant nut job. Not all Catholics are brainwashed sheep. We ARE [4] allowed to form our own consciences.”
[1] And you say you’re not brainwashed!
[2] I would argue this negates your being Catholic.
[3] I would *love* to see you debate Mr. Shea.
[4] You may have more work to do (See [2])

Where to start? Firstly, there seem to be a lot of “ad hominem” attacks from both sides of the issue. So the first problem I see is the difficulty we have in civily discussing the questions brought up in the article, i.e. 1. Is the world nor or will it currently be “overpopulated” to the point of not being able to support adequately human life? Or 2. Is the world heading toward depopulation and will that cause other social ills and problems.
My thoughts: I believe that parts of the world, especially Europe are heading toward depopulation of the native peoples (Spaniards, Italians, Germans, Dutch etc.) while immigrants who do tend to have larger families are trending toward becoming a majority in the not to distant future. (50 - 100 years). In the US, immigrations is fueling growth, since we are barely above the replacement birth rate level. I have observed that even immigrants tend to adopt the contraceptive mentality and seem to have no more than 2 children as they become more integrated. In Latin America too, we are seeing a new trend toward smaller families, especially in the mega-cities where most of them live. Parts of Africa still tends to have larger families although population growth is slowed by war, famine and disease. In the middle east populations are growing with their typical steady pace. Muslims just passed the billion person mark in recent years.
The picture I see is one of a shrinking human population except for certain parts of the globe.
In my study of agricultural I have learned that we have truly found efficient earth friendly ways to grow bountiful crops and that most regions of the world could use these means if they were taught and those that could not should be able to import food by trading in other natural commodities.
In conclusion, I would say if we all tried to help each other and respect each other, we could probably help care for the earth and all her children with intelligence and compassion, while respecting those who both choose to have children and those who choose not to do so.
We are expecting our 7th and we can think of nothing more precious than a child and nothing more solemn than the privilege of trying to raise them up in peace and love. I work hard and pay my taxes. I enjoy life and I respect anc care for the earth. And yes, I am a practicing Catholic, who while ashamed and horrified by the sins of some of our clergy and neglect of some of our leaders, seek to find a way to forgive and to offer my heart to the victims.

God told us to go forth and multiply and fill the earth - or something similar. We’ve done that. Now it’s time to slow down before we destroy God’s creation. It’s not that the childfree hate children, we hate what grown ups are doing to the planet. And children have a tendency of growing up. We want them to grow up healthy, happy and fulfilled. Only, that when the children of today are our age, their lives will be very different to that of ours. I am childfree for your children’s sake as well as my own sake. The less children I have, the more you can have. Too bad I can’t have negative numbers of children, if I could, I would.

“I did (and saw) things that would make you curl up into a fetal ball and wet yourself.”

Dude, you were a military weatherman.  Seriously…

Babies: expensive, smell bad.

I’ve been childfree since I was 8.  I am now 37.  I’ve never read either of those books you claim caused all this.  I do not want children ever.  Never have.  I would be a terrible parent and suggesting I ignore my basic nature to conform to some societal script is, frankly, irresponsible and short-sighted.

You are a ridiculous person, with a ridiculous stance, that completely lacks any basis in reality whatsoever. 

You Catholics can reproduce until Jesus comes back (don’t hold your breath, guys).  Enjoy crappy diapers, ungrateful spawn and lack of money.  Me and my CF husband will be sleeping in, going on great trips and saving loads of money so we can have a great retirement. We’ll be volunteering with the elderly and homeless and helping out at the local animal shelter. I’ll be sure and wave as I drive by the state funded home your grown kids stick you in when they can’t deal with you AND their litter of children they’d been raised to believe they had to have.

Good luck with that!

Sincerely,
A Willfully Barren Woman

Show me an overpopulated culture that encourages children, and I’ll show you Easter Island, then Haiti, then Mexico, then a mouse cage two months after only one male and one female were placed in it.

The Catholic position on human reproduction is 2000-year-old, anachronistic, religous dogma.  It reflects a long-vanished world with lots of untapped resources and real estate.  That the Catholic cult is still brainwashing its young children with this procreation-is-good-under-all-circumstances nonsense, only encourages the religion’s shrinking influence in the modern, overpopulated, under-resourced modern world.

One can only hope that people will be rational, even when cults/religions aren’t.

Like radical environmentalism isn’t a cult?  How can you get more Jim Jones than the “Voluntary Human Extinction Movement”?  Again, you set yourselves up as models of rationalism and yet you seem unable to debate rationally.  Where is all this emotion coming from?  Are you angry that we won’t be joining you in your voluntary human extinction?  Does it make you want to commit INvoluntary human extinction?  You are not rational.  Not by a long shot.

“But the hatred of life is at the core of the agenda.”

It’s close minded views such as this one that push people away from the catholic “faith”. I, having grown up in a catholic house hold, have been subject to the totalitarian mind set of this religion… “believe what we teach or burn in hell” ..is their marching song. Now it seems we humans need to bread in order to “be saved” in the eyes of a religion that has embezzled most of it’s traditions from older faith sets. I guess it shouldn’t surprise me the catholic church demands population.. whom else would fill their coffers were it not for the blind sheep of it’s congregation?

I was linked to this “blog” through a Child Free By Choice website where people of all races and creeds gather together and discuss the joys of being child free.

You don’t know this faith very well Erin.  Nowhere does it say that anyone has to “bread [I believe you meant breed] in order to be saved,” nor “believe what we teach or burn in hell.”  You were either poorly catechized or wanted to believe that in order to reject the faith.  I was raised without faith and lived for many years as an atheist, and atheism very much borrows from older faith sets, such as materialism, epicureanism and utilitarianism.  I have to admit, I’m very disappointed in today’s atheists.  I would never have said some of the things they say or use the arguments they use, I would have found them embarrassing.  It’s embarrassing to pretend that science can disprove divine existence, such a thing is beyond the realm of science and so making fun of a belief system is unfounded.  Lots of things sound fanciful, such as the germ theory of disease (which scientists rejected mightily) or the existence of “invisible” purple light (ultraviolet light).  Those things are true, however.  It’s also embarrassing to say that religion is the cause of all bloodshed and evil.  The 20th century gave us many fine examples of grotesque slaughter in the name of god-less utopias.  The defense I used for my atheism is still a good one I think:  I just didn’t care.  About the existence of any deity.  Or the practice of any religious system.  Period. 

I figured a link from one of the websites led here, since many posters are hostile toward a religion they don’t understand.  In fairness, I didn’t know too much about the Child Free movement so I checked out the sites.  Childlessness is a controversial decision so I can understand why people would seek like-minded support, but to me, there was much complaining about children and not much joy being discussed.  In fact there seemed to be a universal lack of joy there.

Just a quick word of thanks to the various representatives of the Child and Humanity Hatred community who posted here.  Some of you approached sanity briefly with the excuses about caring for the environment, etc.  But an awful lot of you demonstrated, far beyond my poor power to do so, that you are animated by a deep and irrational hatred of God, humanity, children, life and joy.  Which was, you know, my point.

So, Mark, you neglected to tell us what the ideal population would be for the United States.

Be rational, but don’t dodge the question or our concern.

Wow. The fruit-loops really fell out of the box on this one. Mark, I may be wrong, but I believe your point was NOT that everyone that chooses not to have children, individually, independently, and for their own reasons,  is evil. I think the point WAS that others who, in the name of environmentalism or population control, try to limit how many children I or anyone else chooses to have, is evil.

Not sure how all the Catholic bashing got started ... oh, right, yes I am. I forgot that in the secular, atheistic, post-Christian world, every race, religion, culture, etc., etc., is OK, EXCEPT for the Catholic Church. My bad.

Wow, just wow. there’s so much wrong with this I don’t know where to start. Although thanks Mark, your 3rd paragraph does make a good argument for the childfree movement. But there’s a few things to set straight: Women who don’t choose to have children are not inherently “evil” or life-hating in fact many making this choice are life-loving, in doing their piece to improve the chances of those who come after us, neices, nephews, and all the other (God-created, if that’s your bag) life on this planet, and yes Mark, that includes your precious spawn. It is implied that the Childfree are lining up weekly at abortion centres around the world? again, you couldn’t be more wrong, those who have chosen to be childfree generally do so after THINKING about the matter. We are educated, and in control of our reproductive choices, choosing contraception rather than spitting out unwanted offspring without the means to raise them, like dumb animals, or running off for secret vacumings/scrapings.
As for Trace,y who said: “Do they really think God would create a world that we could outgrow?  The “fill the earth” command didn’t include an expiration date!” Perhaps you should use your eyes and common sense to make decisions, rather than a poorly translated 1500-year old scribbling. If you simply can’t then perhaps you could look at it this way: God works in mysterious ways, do you think that the increasing inclination amongst His creatures to not reproduce is his way of ensuing we DON’T outgrow the world?. There are many many other WRONG comments here, but I simply don’t have the time to rebut them all, you see I have a life to enjoy. Cheerio!

I was just wondering where I could get one the “child-free” list-serv that apparently exists so the child-free, who seem to have a lot of time on their hands (perhaps because they’re not raising children?) can troll the internet for articles to criticize? This is an organization I want in on! :0

I was raised a Catholic. I am now an atheist. I have never wanted children. I consider myself childfree, not childless. I love my life and have plenty of joy, thankyouverymuch. (Yep, a joyous atheist!) I really do not hate kids, I have simply made the conscious decision to not have children.

You believe in God or Allah or a higher power? That’s nice, good for you. I may not understand this point of view, but I respect that you have made this choice for yourself. Please respect my decision to not have faith and don’t preach to me.

You believe in the quiverfull movement and want as many children as God gives you? That’s nice, good for you. I may not understand this point of view, but I respect that you have made this choice for yourself. Please respect my decision to not have children and do not berate me for it.

I wish we, as a human race, would stop bashing each other and just let one another live our own lives as we see fit. Get over your egos and let other people have their own opinions. How DARE you think that your lifestyle choices are correct for anyone else but yourself? Some people believe in God. Some people don’t. Some people believe in global warming. Some don’t. Some people will choose to not have children. Some people will have more children than what is needed to replace themselves. Who is to say what is the right decision? Certainly not me. Certainly not you either.

I wish we would RESPECT each other a little more and DEMEAN each other a little less. After all, shouldn’t we be treating each other as we would like to be treated ourselves?

Oh, but that doesn’t sell ads on websites or bring in donation money. Isn’t that what this inflammatory “story” is all about?

I think there is a lot of confusion of terms here. “Child-free” is sometimes being used as an equivalent of “childless”, when the two terms are not synonymus. Indeed, some of the childless are the polar opposite of the ” child-free “. I have married friends who suffered years of infertility, punctuated by miscarriages. They finally managed to adopt - not an infant, but a pair of sisters aged 5 and 8. It was expensive and time-consuming - but, in their eyes, more than worth every penny and every minute.  Now they are no longer childless, but they were never “child-free”.

Wow…this article saddens me. I am a woman. Raised in the Catholic church, went to Catholic schools and am still friends with the nuns who taught me years ago. I have been a practicing Catholic for 35 years and counting. I married a wonderful man in a beautiful Catholic wedding, attended pre-Cana and try to be a good wife to my fantastic husband. I try to treat others as I wish to be treated. I try to love my neighbor as myself, to be a good friend, to not judge, to turn the other cheek, be a good listener, a good daughter and a caring sister. I have 4 God-children that I love dearly. I love babies and think that they are adorable. I’ve changed many a diaper, soothed many a crying infant, attending school events and cheered on the kids in my life that I care for and love. I also help the kids know Jesus and know who He is and that he is there for them.
I have helped my pregnant friends clean their houses and cook their dinners when they did not feel well. I have been there for them through births and post-natal care when many of their friends who have children were too busy to help because these women had their own children to take care of at home.
I, however, do not have children because I do not feel that it is my calling to be a parent. I also have a few medical issues that would make pregnancy and birth dangerous for me and for a baby. Not necessarily impossible, but dangerous so it had to be considered and my husband and I decided it was a risk not to be taken. It is painful to read that my own religion and brothers and sisters of mine in Catholicism would think me to be a “child hater” or “a hater of life” or to be out and out “evil” simply because I do not have my own children. Because I do not have children of my own, I am able to more readily be there for my friends and family who need me because my schedule is a little more flexible since I do not have little ones of my own. What part of any of this about me sounds evil or selfish?
Like I said, this article saddens and stuns me. But I will continue to keep doing what I have been doing knowing that God has a plan for me too. But being a parent is quite possibly not part of his plan for me.

To Jules-Thank you! I just can`t believe this either. I am also a practicing Catholic who is a teacher AND childfree. I get to serve God`s children 8 hours a day, 180 days a year. I am already helping to take care of the next generation. I understand why humanity needs to reproduce, but what`s so special about my genes? As long as there are orphans, I don`t need to make any kids, and if I`m not willing to go through adoption, then I don`t really want to raise a human being. I just want a doll that looks like me.

On the subject of overpopulation:

From the CIA World Factbook
(http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/xx.html#Geo)

Earth’s land area = 148.94 million sq km
Arable land     = 10.58%
            = 15.76 million sq km
Population       = 6.3 billion (6,302 million)
              (July 2003 est.)
            = 6302/15.76 people per sq km
            = 400     people per sq km

A square kilometer = 247 acres (http://www.ex.ac.uk/trol/scol/ccarea.htm)

Therefore there were 400/247 = 1.62 people per acre

Somebody want to check my math?

Without checking I will take your word for the math.  However, one of the videos claims that everybody could live in an area the size of Texas.  Well, ok, maybe.  But the fact is that people will live where they are living, now.  And with 500 million living in America the areas where people are living will become more overcrowded, with more demand on the infrastructure, services, taxpayers, water aquifer, etc.  And with the major component of population growth in America coming from beyond our borders, we can actually do something about quelling the increase without any draconian solutions, whatever they may be.
Again I ask, what population number is acceptable to you?

No. I did the math and the Texas calculation does not add up correctly. In addition, the comment with the calculation above does not factor into account land necessary to produce food for each said human. I believe that it takes far more than a single acre of land to feed 1.62 human beings. (Not to mention, if you put a homestead on that acre it is even less space.) If anyone is willing to try for a year, I bet you’re in for a surprise. Do not forget, that does not include any of the land we use to produce and maintain power (mining, power plants, etc.). Or the land needed to make cotton for clothing, timber for building a home, area to clean the sewage that 1.62 people contaminate on a daily basis, or land for other creatures we depend on for life to thrive. (Bees to pollinate plants need substantial space per colony. Forget about livestock on 1 acre because that’s another mouth to feed.) Humans are very poor stewards of an environment that we lovingly thrust upon our children. It is a simple math problem in that the modern person is using far more energy than the planet can sustain. We rely on fossil fuels to maintain our lifestyle, which is essentially using energy already stored in the earth that once belonged to the sun. Simple math: all energy ever derived from the sun= stored in organic hydrocarbons (alive or dead)+ heat. Solar and geothermal power are currently insufficient to support the modern lifestyle without fossil fuel adjunct and, hence, we are living on energy borrowed from the past. Energy that will no longer be available for the future. The “populate the world” philosophy supported by many religions was developed in a period of time when energy consumption was significantly less than today, agricultural output was far less, lifespans were shorter, and mortality rates were higher. Achieving a stable or growing population was a far greater challenge to medieval civilizations than it is for our own. This is no longer the case in the modern world and this philosophy is antiquated. If you want to bring excessive numbers of children into the world, I suggest you live in Southeast Asia for a period of time to breath in the impact of population density. To think of this problem in simple terms is a mistake. We are in a delicate balance with our planet. To tip the scales in such a way where we don’t fully appreciate the consequences is to burden our beloved children in ways we cannot anticipate with suffering we will not live to see. Certainly, this type of thoughtlessness and irresponsibility for the future is not what Jesus would aspire to.

On the subject of overpopulation:

Note that the calculation was based on the amount of arable land - the kind that will grow crops. It’s also the place where people live and therefore partly covered with houses (and their totally nonproductive lawns), cities, roads, railroads, electric transmission lines, pipelines, sports stadia, amusement parks, et. bloody cetera. Non-arable land can be used for mineral extraction (mines and oil wells) or hydroelectric production (cf. Hoover dam) or other things.

In my (probably jaundiced view) this planet reached its apogee when the first Apollo lander touched down and it started to decline when the last ascent stage lifted off. The current downward trend will continue until the latter part of this century when the tipping point will be reached. The decline will be much more rapid after that. I don’t think that the Collapse will entirely depopulate the planet but I wouldn’t be surprised if the final population is in the range of one to two billion. In short the future for this planet is a large-scale example of Rapa Nui.

I’m an apathetic agnostic (“I don’t know and neither do you, but it doesn’t really matter much to me.”) but I kinda hope that there’s a way for me to see if I’m right.

Unlike the “pro-earthers” who see “nature” as their only “nurturer” - I am ESPECIALLY BLESSED that my GOD is Himself a LIMITLESS REALITY.  I have always wondered why secularists would “kill” God, then try to take up HIS mantle of responsibility.  Man is man(made) and like ALL things made, his MAKER will be responsible for his upkeep, care, and fulfillment.  Are we not infinitely more important than these birds of the field?

If I didn’t think the world was doomed before than I certainly do now.  The Catholics willfully stick their heads in the sand and plan for G-d to save them.  (a) God helps those that help themselves, b) did praying to G-d work for any of the religions the Catholic Church joyously destroyed?)

Everyone else is too busy wasting their energy fighting with religious wack jobs to get anything done. 

Believers of the Catholic FAITH would do themselves a favor to pull their heads out of the sand and realize that the CHURCH is corrupt, evil, and reviled. The faith can survive with the structure.

Many people in churches these days do not have children, or never plan to have them. They are not a marginalized minority. They are becoming the majority. They organize adults-only events, then wonder why the parents don’t show up. They specifically exclude children from church potlucks and picnics. Many act disgusted at the mere sight of an infant. My advice to parents is, leave these churches and find a more family friendly place.

And from my experience, people who choose to be childless are very self-absorbed and self-focused. I no longer have many childfree friends, because all they do is talk about themselves and their needs all day long.

P.S.  Perhaps Mr. Shea has spare bedrooms, couches, porches, cellars, garages, yard tents, etc. to take in illegal Mexican Catholics and their uninsured kids?  Such families obeyed Mr. Shea’s pope and ran out of farmland, factory jobs and accessible medical care in their own country and fled here by necessity.  If Mr. Shea, condemns them for leaching off our resources, then he is an anti-choice hypocrite whose fetal “chickens” have come home to roost on his property!

This is insane. Those who choose to have no kids are not evil.

By the way, the Population Research Institute (the organization behind the videos) has only a 2 star rating at Charity Navigator: http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=10080 The CEO makes more than $100,000 per year!

And when I came back to the National Catholic Register website, the first thing that popped up was their Welcome Message (http://www.ncregister.com/message/) asking for donations.

Money money money. If there’s anything evil here, it’s the greed exhibited by these groups.

You call people who do not want children “selfish.” How about looking at the people who amass their fortunes by selling faith and a spot in heaven. There are no refunds for non-delivery of promised goods after death.

And if I sound grumpy, it’s because I was up late last night helping my friend’s 14-year-old daughter with her algebra homework. Because, you know, I’m childfree and I hate kids.

It’s impressive that for nearly 100 comments, none of the brilliant rationalists and geniuses who have been yammering on here have gotten a freaking clue that the point of this article was not “Catholic Inquisitors need to enforce that each woman has 10 children (or indeed *any* children)” but rather that people who praise AIDS epidemics and who want global laws to forbid childbirth are, in fact, evil.  The legion of child free trolls who have shown up here demonstrate not the slightest reading comprehension of the article I quoted.  Demonstrating that “legion” is indeed an apt description.  To a person, the child free people take an article chronicling aggressive hostility to the very existence of human beings and manage to turn it into a wading pool of narcissism and self-pity, as though somebody is just about to force them to have a kid—when the reality is that their own troops are (as the article demonstrates) all about forcing people not to have kids (as in China, their model state).  Get a clue, Brights.  You ain’t that Bright—and your philosophy of state-enforced barrenness is ugly as the hell from whence it comes.

Mr. Shea, if your re-interpretation of your own article is that “people who praise AIDS epidemics and who want global laws to forbid childbirth are, in fact, evil” why did you include Californians for Population Stabilization as an example?  CAPS’ concern is about population growth in America that will lead to half a billion people living here by 2050, all of it immigration driven.

Please explain to us dolts what you really meant.

Maybe the title of the article would be more accurate as, “The Militant Environmentally Childfree Movement, Archetype of Evil.” Because evidently when sweeping generalizations are used, people can get a little bit touchy. Kind of like if I wrote something about the abuses of some Catholic priests and titled it, “Catholics Are All Evil Pedophiles.”

Oh wait, non-scandalous headlines would not bring in the page impressions needed to sell adverts (or presumably, keep you on salary).

But then you might have to actually, you know, write some original content on the subject rather than simply quoting liberally from a Weekly Standard article and then slapping on some fallacious YouTube clips. It’s easier to just insult people and then insult them again.

Nope.  It was title correctly.  What people choose to do with their lives is none of my business and I never remotely said or implied it was, despite all the bleating narcissists from the Child free Troll Brigade who showed up here to vomit out their bigotry.  If you don’t want to have a kid, nobody’s forcing you too.  So enough with the dramatics.  However, when you start a *movement* to evangelize against children and you couple it with the hatred of their parents and of the faith of other people which reeks and scalds off the screen here, you are no longer acting as a private citizen.  You are now acting as an enemy of human life.  When you remain quiet while your freakish comrades praise AIDS epidemics and advocate laws against those of us with children, you ally yourselves with, well, archetypes of evil.

When you fondly boast that your act of collective suicide is the wave of the future while proclaiming yourselves “rational”, I can only add that evil makes those who embrace it particularly stupid.  The god Darwin does not offer a very hopeful prognosis for those portions of the population who advocate their own extinction.  So the argument is rather silly.  Those of us who like babies and have them will continue on.  You guys can remain on the sideline making excuses for AIDS celebrants and tyrant wannabes till you croak and leave no heirs.  Knock yourselves out.

All I can say is thanks Mr. Shea for the best laugh I’ve had all week.  Your article is a joke, taken to the next level by your defense and definite re-defining.  Your last comment strongly resembles a child’s tantrum and I can only assume its because no one, outside of other blind Catholic sheeple, is buying your inflammatory generalizations and open hate of those that don’t follow the Catholic creed. 

NEWSFLASH: No one takes Catholics seriously, except Catholics. The Church has sacrificed all outside respect by its foolish adherence to outdated dogma. 

You are a fool.  But hey, keep broadcasting it, cause I could use the free entertainment.

The Catholic church isn’t interested in the future of the human race. It is interested in the future of the Catholic church.

Hey Childfree people -
If you’re right, then who cares?  Just ignore the stupid “sheeple” and their articles.  Why take it so personally?  These Catholics are just outdated and nobody of any intelligence really takes them seriously, right?
Why are you here?
“The lady doth protest too much, methinks”
And to those who think of babies as : “expensive, smell bad”, the same could be said about you.

And when YOU remain quiet while your LEADERS OF FAITH cover up decades of abuse and advocate against condoms which SAVE LIVES by protecting people from AIDS, you ally yourself with archetypes of evil as well. “I can only add that evil makes those who embrace it particularly stupid.” So true.

By the way, these “comrades” of the childfree movement… let’s dig a little deeper, shall we?

- Earth First! = a radical ENVIRONMENTAL advocacy group = NOT CHILDFREE
- the environmental radical wacko Dave Foreman is as much a mouthpiece for the childfree movement as David Koresh was for Christians = NOT CHILDFREE

- Californians for Population Stabilization (CAPS) = an organization founded in 1986 and working to preserve California’s future through the stabilization of our state’s human population. Since nearly all of California’s runaway population growth comes from immigration, CAPS focuses largely on this issue. = NOT CHILDFREE

- Diane Francis (Financial Post) = a journalist, author, and editor-at-large, and mother to Eric and Julie = NOT CHILDFREE

- Madelyn Cain = author, mother to one daughter = NOT CHILDFREE

- RE: the 2009 study at Oregon State University warned that children are terrible contributors to global warming = OMG SCIENCE! NOT SCIENCE!!!

- The Dalai Lama = spiritual leader, proponent of “practice other non-violent methods of birth control.” [Source: http://www.dalailama.com/messages/environment/tibets-environment] = not sure of his childfree status, but I’ll take him!

Froth at the mouth much, Mr. Shea? Or does this only happen when you’re faced with facts that reveal that you are wrong? You can educate yourself or you can continue to sling insults.

Kasia:

The trick to pulling off a really effective tu quoque is knowing what you are talking about.  I have, in fact, not remained quiet about the grotesque crimes of abuse and the cover-up by some of our bishops.  A little Googling would have shown you that.

So, the point remains that, much as you’d like to turn this into an exercise of narcissism and the bogus claim that somebody is telling you how to order your private life, the fact remains that the point of the article was that child-hating zealots want are rejoicing over the death of innocent human beings and are allied with nutjobs who would dearly love to pass planetary laws to impose their tyrannical views on others.  Until you can stop gazing on your self-pitying face in the mirror and stop making everything about You (which is rather the point of a Childfree *Movement* as distinct from a private decision), you won’t convince anybody but your fellow narcissists that there isn’t something crazy and evil at the heart of what you are attempting to impose on others.

Mark-
I find it interesting that you had no response to the rebuttal of each of the supposed “childfree comrades” that were mentioned in the Weekly Standard article. (These people DO NOT represent the members of the childfree movement one iota.) But, if you accepted this then you’d have no basis for your little article.
I have tried very hard to refrain from attacking you personally, Mark. It’s really too bad that you can’t defend your viewpoints without the same amount of respect and decorum. This says a lot about one’s character.

I have tried very hard to refrain from attacking you personally, Mark.

Bwahahahahaha!  Right.  You take the whole thing as a personal attack on yourself when it is manifestly not about what you might choose privately, but what Movement advocates urge publicly.  Then instead of dealing with that you immediately declare me a mercenary and an apologist for pedophiles.  Sorry, but if that’s “trying very hard” then you are weaker than Monty Burns.

If you want to make a *good* impression, next time try saying something like, “I admit those quotes are pretty repellent, but let me assure you I want nothing to do with people who wish to impose their childfree ideology on others by draconian force.”  This makes more friends than joining arms with a gang of foaming hatemongers and bigots like, oh, the vast majority of your fellow narcissists who responded on this thread.

OK Mark. I admit those quotes are pretty repellent, but let me assure you I want nothing to do with people who wish to impose their childfree ideology
on others by draconian force.
And I still attest that these “comrades” of the childfree movement DO NOT *represent* the childfree movement. They represent a radical environmental advocacy group, an anti-immigration group, a journalist, an author and a scientific study - NONE of whom self-identify as childfree. Please explain why you label these radical fringe viewpoints as proponents or mouthpieces of the childfree movement? They are not.

Great!  Excellent!  Thank you.

But now here’s the thing to note: in nearly 100 comments, you are the *first* person to so much as notice and condemn these repellent comments, and only after extended efforts to persuade you to do so.  The overwhelming response from the bigots and narcissists of the Child Free community has been, in sundry ways, to pity themselves and make it All About Them, to pour forth bile on babies, on parents, and (naturellement) on Catholics (the last acceptable prejudice in the US).  You yourself indulged this as your first, reflexive, response.

So: why on earth should any normal person—seeing such narcissistic *blindness* to the quotes in the article, coupled with the self-absorption, bigotry and bile of the childfree respondents here—ever take serious the claim that the movement is not characterized by narcissism, self-involvement, bigotry, and a deep-seated hatred of children, parents, religious believers in general and Catholics in particular?  No, not every single childless person is characterized by this.  I have friends and relatives who have opted for various very good reasons not to have kids.  ‘Sup to them.  But when this passes from being a private choice to a Movement bent on evangelizing against, ‘ow do your friends put it?, “spawn” and hatred of babies?  Yeah, it’s evil and the scalding malice of your childfree chums here proves it in spades.  Clean up your own house before you start telling everybody else how many kids they can have in theirs.  It’s a damned ugly subculture.

Mark- Point made. But I really think that had you expounded more on this viewpoint in your *original* article, we wouldn’t have needed 100+ comments to get to this point in the conversation.
.
I don’t agree with your tactics nor the conclusions that you make, but I do agree that people on comment threads can get supremely nasty. The anonymity of the web brings out the worst in people. It sucks when someone who is acting like a jerk happens to share the same label as oneself - whether that label is Catholic, or childfree. Generalizations are made based on the actions of those people who behave badly and that’s not fair to the rest of the group. I think everyone has some house-cleaning to do.

Thank you for that.  And may I commend you as the first of the Child Free commenters on this thread to use your intellect instead of merely worshipping it.

Thanks Mark. I’m always up for a fair debate. It’s all part of the learning process. I suspect that people reacted so vehemently to this article because of the sweeping generalization in the title (and they possibly didn’t even bother to ready the text). As you wrote in your comment above, “No, not every single childless person is characterized by this.” And although I’m sure there are many childfree people out there who are narcissistic or just don’t like kids, how many really want to mandate sterilization and kill babies? I mean really. I’m childfree, and I’m not an evil baby killer. You’re Catholic, and I can reasonably assume that you’re not a child molester. But unfortunately the evils of the fringe, whose stories get into the press, tarnish the image of the rest of the group. Making sweeping generalizations doesn’t help matters. Let’s both take away some good lessons from this productive conversation.

Interesting. Am I a hatemonger and bigot? I’m not quite clear if I’m allied with murderers and tyrants simply because -I- don’t want any kids. Thankfully we have the great and wonderful Mark Shea to clear up any doubts. I figure I will be allied with the insane killers simply because I choose not to add another baby to the world.

On second thought, it looks like Mark has finally recognized that no, not all childfree people are evil. Too bad the hate-mongering headline article does not put forth this view. “The Catholic religion; culture of child molesters”. Or how about “Jewish people; they all stab babies”. “Black people; spear throwing cow rapists.” Try to be more professional Mark, okay?

So I am somehow evil because I don’t want to have a child!?!  The fact is this is a crazy world so why would I want to subject a child to that?  I think there are people that are threatened by those of us who are not afraid to buck tradition and live childfree!  The only reason I had ever thought about having kids is because I was taught that as a woman that is what I should do.  You should never have chidren for any other reason then you really want to be a parent…never ever!  I have been called selfish but the way I see it, it is far more selfish to have a child I never really wanted and short changing that child in the process!

There’s an important mistake in the text. Childfree people, and that doesn’t mean only women, but men as well, are not against life, or baby-haters. Many of them, as a matter of fact, like kids. They simply don’t want to have their own.

Overpopulation isn’t a myth, but a reality we are living, and which gets evidenced in our mega-cities and the amounts of waste produced by mankind, not to mention social conditions. I wonder if the people happily embarking into parenthood consider the chances of their kids to get a job, a place to live, air to breath, peaceful, stable conditions to live in. Or perhaps they choose to be parents simply thinking that they have so much love to give and they really want to hold a baby in their arms. Well, thinking about that and not about the conditions the child must face once he or she grows into adulthood… isn’t that more selfish than deciding not to have kids because the world is already too rotten, too bad, narco-dominated situations like that of Juarez spreading across the globe like fire on powder, and thus being able to make sure our kids would have a better future to live in?

I cannot bring a child to a world kidnapped by terrorism. I can’t bring a child to a world were we are already loosing our jobs and the economy gives no sign of improving. I can’t bring a child to a world where school bullying must be accepted as part of life, not to a world where children carry guns and drugs to the school class and at any minute shoot their classmates. Not to a world where now children themselves are criminals who rob, beat and terrorize their fellows. Not to a world where people don’t care, because sadly, no matter how big the parents’ love is, the world is out there to get them.

I can, but if you do, would you share with us the secret to not care about the harm the world could do to children? Not to care about kids being raped, tortured or murdered in broad daylight?

... read the comments and I’m flabbergasted. “Believe in global warming”? What’s there to believe in? Climate is changing brutally, snowed peaks are melting… and you choose not to believe in it? Then how do you explain these? God is redesigning the place?

As for China, the lack of girls isn’t because of the one child law, it’s because they don’t really like girls, so they either hide them or kill them at birth and continue trying until they get a boy. It happened before and it still happens now. It’s an entirely different matter.

Pronatalism is obviosly the work of Satan in his quest to destroy the planet and induce human suffereng by the billions, with the help of his Vatican minions.

IF

Mark Shea is a bigot, if anyone who wants children is a Neanderthal, if anyone questioning the childfree movement is a hateful, irrational imbecile,

THEN

why all the comments by the childfreers?

I mean, I usually refrain from commenting on, say, a post by a neo-Nazi who argues for the extermination of all Jews, or a person absolutely convinced that the earth is flat. There’s no real point in responding. I usually avoid and and even laugh at blog posts which are so bigoted, hateful, and irrational. Yet, for some mysterious reason, all the childfreers feel compelled to go on and on defending themselves, how their choice is supremely rational, and that all who would dare to question it are bigoted, hateful, and irrational (even though this was not the point of Mark’s article).

Doesn’t seem very rational to me.

Love virginity and one another as God loves us. Let us place ourselves in God’s hands with a strong belief in God’s Divine Providence and Divine Mercy. With Chastity and Virginity our children will do God’s will in bringing forth children, spiritual and physical and the world will again become harmonious and there will be peace on earth.
What if God wanted overpopulation to spin the earth out of orbit to avoid being smashed by the chastizing comet? Just a silly thought. Then the only people left would be the astronauts on Mir, the Russian-American space station.

I’m in utter disbelief of this article. I am CF and on the pill, and will stay that way. If my pill fails, I’m aborting. Don’t like my views and my choices? Too bad. I’m not going to bring children into a world where ppl think this way.

I’m still in awe of the ignorance and finger pointing of the article and the comments, but I guess I can’t expect anything less from ppl who live their life by a book of fairy tales.

For all those bible thumpers, here are a few verses:
1 Timothy 5:8
“But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” So, everyone who has kids they can’t care for is worse than an unbeliever.

Leviticus 19:9-10

“When you reap the harvest of your land, you shall not reap your field right up to its edge, neither shall you gather the gleanings after your harvest. And you shall not strip your vineyard bare, neither shall you gather the fallen grapes of your vineyard. You shall leave them for the poor and for the sojourner: I am the Lord your God.” So, by overpopulating the earth, it is akin to reaping right to the edge and stripping the vineyard bare.

Psalm 127:3-5

“Behold, children are a heritage from the Lord, the fruit of the womb a reward. Like arrows in the hand of a warrior are the children of one’s youth. Blessed is the man who fills his quiver with them! He shall not be put to shame when he speaks with his enemies in the gate.” Nowhere in this verse does it say that NOT having children is a sin. It just says that children should be seen as a blessing. That is all. If some of us choose not to be blessed in this way, I am pretty sure the Judeo-Christian God is okay with that.

This is hilarious.  There has been no growth in the number of people that don’t want to have children, it’s just that people used to allow themselves to be forced into having children where today’s society believe that children should really be wanted.

Women used to end relationships because they knew if they got married they’ve be pressured into having children, so they stayed single from then on.  Today both men and women are (thankfully) willing to admit to having been born not wanting children and so they can still marry someone for life knowing that there will be no pressure to have kids.

That this publication equates not wanting to have to children to hating children says more about the author than about childfree people, indeed it shows an incredible level of ignorance.

God made me without any desire to have children.  I know many other people that God made that way.  Maybe it is God’s way of controlling population levels.  God did ask us to look after the Earth, that is a big command given to us, yet the number of children people are selfishly having is undoubtedly destroying the earth.  At least us childfree people get to obey God’s word and help make the earth a better and safer place for the children that are still being born.

I would love to be able to say that because of childfree people now having the strength to speak out EVERY child born today is a wanted child.  However, that would be a lie since half the children born in the developed world today are ‘mistakes’.

The ‘Church’ would do well to take its criticism where it really belongs and ask why so many people (including some Christians) take bringing children into the world so flippantly and with such disregard.  Instead it just wants to criticise those that are true to how their God made them, give long-term and serious consideration to what it takes to bring up children, and accept that God doesn’t mean for them to have any.  We’re the mature ones.

Mark Shea, I find it odd that you consider those who oppose your narrowminded view as having a “hatred of life”.

How disgusting that you feel entitled to make such a statement about people you don’t know.  And how incredibly unChristian.

Has it occured to you that people who are concerned about population levels are so concerned because they know that the quality of life for those who are alive is going to be made worse the higher the population gets?  Has it occured to you that they want the population level stabilised so that everyone who is alive can have a better quality of life, so there won’t be any starvation, so that crime levels will drop etc?

I doubt any of this has occured to you.  You see, overpopulation DOES harm people.  It harms the very children that all you parents claim to love so much, it leaves them a worse world than you yourself grew up in.  Maybe you don’t care because you’ll be long gone, but some of us do care, and some of us wish to IMPROVE this world and leave a better place for your children.

You forget that curbing population growth by entirely natural methods (by people choosing to have fewer children) doesn’t actually harm ANYONE!!!!!  You talk as if your opponents want to go out and kill people, in reality, NOBODY gets hurt even one little bit.

Overpopulation on the other hand is already causing long, drawn-out and particularly nasty deaths for millions of people all around the world.  The more the population increases the more people are going to suffer and the harder their suffering will be.

How Christian of you to wish this upon your fellow man!  Not.

Sam Schmitt, people are completely entitled to defend themselves by comments from the Church (and similarly narrowminded people) who think they have the sole say on what is ‘natural’.

I don’t need to defend my decision to anyone because I haven’t made a decision, I was BORN not wanting children.  I have never experienced any inkling whatsoever to have children, and when I see people with children I am utterly bemused as to why they would want children.  Yet I work with and enjoy the company of children, I just have no desire to have any myself.

And yes, I was born that way, our GOD made me that way (as he has done many others).  It’s not about defending a way of life, it’s about getting through to the bigotted idiots that it’s not a ‘way of life’ it’s just how God made us.  Unfortunately the whole point of bigots is they think the way they were made is natural and anything different is ‘unnatural’.  They couldn’t be more wrong.  It will take the Catholic Church probably about 100 years still, but someday they will realise that God creates people, some of whom want children, some of whom don’t.  No biggy really.

I do not care about your bedroom, family size, bathroom, kitchen, car, doctor, etc. I expect people to give me the same respect. I realize that there are many nasty comments made online because of the anonymity, but some don’t realize that the childfree have been putting up with nasty comments in real life for many years.

We childfree seem to be making many headlines in the past few years. I consider that to be a good thing, even with the nastiness and ignorance of some. At least young people might realize that there is a valid choice besides having children, as so many never consider anything other than getting married and having kids. So I’ll take the bad with the good.

I still remember finding a childfree forum online back in ‘95 or so, back when everything was in black and white and there were no ads, I rejoiced that there were so many others who felt like me. We were truly a fun community with very few radicals or nasty posters.

There are choices in life. Childfree-ness is a valid one, so I suppose I will thank you for whatever publicity we get. “There is no such thing as bad publicity.”

I’ll own up to reviving this article - I only found it today and posted a link to it, along with your link to the Weekly Standard article, in a couple of groups. Evil? No. Some are, but there are jerks everywhere of every ilk.

For an analysis of the “Population is a Myth” video series, see: http://vhemt.org/pop101.htm

I’m part of the child-free movement.  If our way of life is posion answer these questions:  If you had medical issues a child could develop if you had one, would you take that into consideration?  I’ve had so many problems with other peoples kids I don’t need any of my own.  What really bothers alot of us, is we’ve come into contact with people who have kids, tell people like us, they sometimes wish they had never had kids.  Or they because of their experiences don’t blame us for not wanting kids.  A woman I used to work with:  A single mom 3 kids once said to me if she could do her life over again, she’d never have them in the first place.  That statement, influenced my choice not to have kids.

What utter drivel! This, and innumerable other hypocritical nonsense, is why I left Catholicism. To assume that there is a “God-given” right to smother the world in Homo Sapiens with NO regard for the rest of the Web of Life is supremely arrogant, ignorant and just plain selfish. I have devoted my life to ending this insanity. Babies = Ecocide. Open your eyes and accept the truth.

Here is the question?  Will life get any better when we have more people?  Will it be an easier to educate, reduce crime, reduce pollution, allow the rest of life some space to live in?  Can human population growth go on forever?  Would you like to have 8 billion people living here?  9 billion?  12 billion?  What will be left when there are 12 billion people living on this planet?  Without fertilizers it is not actually possibly for this planet to produce enough food for more than 4 billion people to live here and we are seconds away from reaching 7 billion.  Children are beautiful and they can be a joy to have in our lives.  Life should be created with some plan for the future though.  Exponential population growth is not much of a plan unless you want this planet to be less livable for all of life.  And what will come of all those children when the streams they want to swim in is polluted, the air they breathe reduces their lifespan, and the soil is unfit to grow their food in?  By supporting growth in the population you are actually sentencing the future children and rest of life to a dirtier, less viable home.  To have the less educated, small minded part of the population producing the most children we are making the human species less intelligent and dooming our species.  Please do some research before you make children and plan for their lives and your own.  Make it the best lives for them and yourself.  Don’t make children just because you can.

Mr. Shea - I am someone who chose not to have children. I want to see if I understand truly what you were saying, less all the hyperbole in the comments. Are you saying that you feel concerned that above and beyond people who make personal choices not to have kids, that you are concerned about something that seems larger than that? Something that seems to be ANTI child movement or spirit, as opposed to individual choices about children? Just trying to clarify my understanding, not screech a be reactive.

Hm… a lot of anger and name calling going around on this message board. And a lot of assumptions. I notice that the videos never mentioned the contribution to global warming or the depletion natural resources (other than food), but there is much dissent on these subjects, too much to go into them in a brief post. I also notice that the videos never said “God comands thee to go have more children! NOW! NOW!” but many people are assuming that this is being said from a religious standpoint. In reality, the videos more or less say “Don’t let the fear of overpopulation stop you from having children.” Fine… a valid point, as we have yet to experience a global and catastrophic effect from having 7 billion people on this planet. (We also have yet to experience the second coming… are we still waiting on that, too?) The video also makes no mention of childfree people being evil or selfish. Hm… so why are so many people jumping to this conclusion? I am happily childfree… does that make me more selfish that someone who keeps having children without the means or inclination to care for them, leaving them neglected or in foster care? Does that mean that I am evil and hate life, even more so than a parent who abuses their child, or than the criminal who preys on the vunerable? When it boils down to it, my choice not to have children is based on my experiences, my beliefs and my knowledge of my own Self…. my strengths, my flaws, my fears. And, mainly, I am childfree because I recognise that I am not READY to be a parent… I doubt that I ever will be. So many societal problems today stem from the fact that so many parents are either financially or emotionally unready for children, because so many ‘adults’ still act like children with their self-centeredness and sense of entitlement, that so many parents are ill-equiped to teach their children the basics of morality, politeness and respect for others. Today’s society is fracturing… morally, environmentally, economically. Is having more children going to fix that or make matters worse? People’s energy and effort would be better spent in trying to improve the world around them instead of worrying about whether someone does or does not want children.

“Do they really think God would create a world that we could outgrow?  The “fill the earth” command didn’t include an expiration date!”

Admittedly in my Bible God doesn’t say “fill the earth”, but the fact that you have used the word ‘fill’ makes the reverse of the point you were trying to make.  If something can be ‘filled’ then it is finite and there are consequences when you continue to try and fill it once it is already full!

Also, didn’t your God command you to look after the Earth?  Mine did.  Have you even considered that your God built mankind with the brains to actually realise when he was consuming more than he could produce, when he was having to build houses on land that wasn’t meant for building on (flood plains etc)?  Do you really need everything to be spelled out to you by your God?  I seem to be capable of reading his teachings and understanding that non of them exist in isolation from the others!

As for those who think the childfree will ‘die out’, there will always be childfree people, some of them will be your children. I hope you treat them with a lot more respect than you offer us.  Thing is, in the old days childfree people were forced into having children (by society), and so today we have many women with children they never wanted to have, many women who truly wish they had stood true to themselves and stayed childfree.  That is so incredbily sad, and I find it disgusting that some of you would rather THIS happened than that people who knew themselves to be childfree were just allowed to get on with their own lives.  Anyone who wishes unwanted children to be brought into the world needs to rethink their alleged Christianity.

“God wants the generation to proceed and so He asked us to multiply.”

I wonder if the authors of these types of comments are fluent in Aramaic?  Or, at the very, least fluent in Hebrew?  I’m going to guess that the majority of people who make such comments are not even novices in either of these languages.  They are relying on translations made by others with their own opinions and their own agendas.

That is why, with a text like the Bible, it is always important to read the WHOLE and put everything in context of the time when it was written. 

You cannot continue to multiply the human race AND look after the earth (as God commanded).  And so you have to apply common sense.

Maybe what God wanted was quality over quantity?  Maybe any command to multiply was for believers rather than physical beings?

BUT, and this is the MOST important point.  The great population explosion didn’t occur in Biblical times, it didn’t occur in Medeival times, it occured only when MONEY was suddenly in great supply (the Industrial Revolution).  Even taking infant mortality into account, and especially taking the advent of modern methods of contraception into account, it is the greater availability of money that caused the population explosion, not adherance to God’s command.

Were it purely about following God’s command then population growth would have remained at a fairly steady rate.  It’s not very Christian that the availability of money is what caused it to explode now is it?

Just as an aside:

I know a large number of childfree people, all of whom knew they didn’t want children before they were even old enough to read.  They were childfree BEFORE they were able to read the books mentioned (and I don’t know anyone who HAS read them anyway!)  They were childfree BEFORE they were aware of the complexities of raising a child.  They were born childfree, God made them that way.  Hallelujah for a God that enjoys diversity and loves us all equally :-)

Yes, even you judgemental ones!

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Mr. Shea, you are greatly misinformed about the Childfree movement.

First of all, you assume that being Childfree means a dislike or even hatred of children.  You could not be more wrong.  While most dislike the bad behaviour of children—or, more specifically, bad parenting—many are teachers, counselors, guides, mentors, volunteers, pediatricians, and so on.  Many enjoy being aunts, uncles, cousins, and productive members of the community and the family.  They simply do not wish for children of their own.

Second of all, you assume that environmental concerns, particularly about over-population, are at the core of the decision to remain Childfree.  This is true for a very small amount of cases.  Far more individuals choosing this route do so because: they have no desire to have children(It’s that simple.  No biological clock, no parenting urge, nada.); they have medical conditions they do not wish to pass on to their offspring.

If I, as a Childfree person, ever changed my mind—something I’ve yet to do in my 30 years of life—I would adopt.  The Childfree do not understand why people continue to have children of their own that they often cannot feed and clothe, at the expense of others and the welfare of those children; they do not understand why thousands of (often taxpayer) dollars are invested in artificial treatments; and why the Childfree are labeled as selfish in not wanting to reproduce when wannabe-parents refuse to turn their backs on the millions of children in need of loving homes in order to make copies of themselves instead.

Furthermore, many of us are concerned with the erosion of education, meaningful employment, community values, effective parenting, and the general political and social state of the world.

May I also remind you that Mother Theresa and Jesus were Childfree?

Edit: “wannabe-parents ontinue to turn their backs”.  Wish I could edit my post.

I dont leave plenty of comments on a great deal of blogs each week but i felt i had to here. A hard-hitting post.

<a >gravura</a>

I was born in 1950. Let me tell you that the country was much nicer with fewer people. Everything was more beautiful. God gave us the ability to figure this out… it takes common sense to figure that something’s wrong if there are millions starving to death in over populated regions. Sure if we were perfectly organized everyone would get their fair share of food and land. But WE DON’T DO THAT. Most people are screaming to even have health care for everyone being too expensive.

What really takes me to the fair is our generation’s claim to be morally superior: more loving and caring than all who ever came before us. “It’s all for the children’s sake,” we rationalize, as we persist in social policies and lifestyles that are killing our marriages and families.  In our quest for a secularized (God-denying) utopia, we have created such a toxic cultural environment that we now need government agencies to protect children from their own parents.  Too bad the bureaucrats can’t act to protect them in the womb.

Frost Concept: Man is the glory of God. Woman is the glory of man. God is existence and since man exiss, it is proof that God exists. If man does not exist, You would not be here.