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Sebelius' War Lands Her in Court (12176)

Belmont Abbey College enters David-and-Goliath fight against the feds over mandate to cover contraceptives.

11/10/2011 Comments (69)
Kris Connor/Getty Images

Kathleen Sebelius during a vist to the Breast Care Center at the Inova Alexandria Hospital at Mark Center on Oct. 3 in Alexandria, Va.

– Kris Connor/Getty Images

Early last month, President Obama bragged to a St. Louis crowd about the recent Health and Human Services’ regulations that will require thousands of religious employers to pay for contraception, sterilization and drugs that probably cause abortions. The crowd cheered the president’s contraceptive mandate. He joined their revelry, shouting, “Darn Tootin’!” to the crowd’s delight.

The same week, HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius addressed a NARAL Pro-Choice America fundraiser. She told the raucous crowd that “we are in a war” and boasted of the regulation that forces religious objectors to choose between violating their religion and kicking their employees off of health insurance.

Yesterday, Nov. 9, Secretary Sebelius’ war against religious objectors landed her someplace she and the administration can expect to receive less applause: federal court.

The plaintiff is Belmont Abbey College, a small Catholic college in Belmont, N.C. The college was founded in 1876 by a congregation of Benedictine monks, who built the campus with bricks they formed by hand from the red clay of the North Carolina soil. They still sponsor and run the college to this day. True to its Catholic identity, the college does not provide contraceptives, sterilization or abortions for its students or employees.

The federal government was well aware of Belmont Abbey’s religious objections. In fact, President Obama’s Equal Employment Opportunity Commission has been investigating the Catholic college for more than two years for its refusal to pay for contraceptives and abortions. Nor are the monks of Belmont Abbey alone in the fact that their religion forbids them from buying these services. Tens of thousands of other religious individuals and organizations filed written comments with HHS, asking the administration to refrain from forcing them to violate their beliefs.

But Secretary Sebelius is at war. Rather than provide the type of complete and universal protection for religious freedom required by the Constitution and federal law, Secretary Sebelius offered the stingiest religious-exemption clause in federal history.

The clause only protects churches and religious orders, only protects them if their purpose is the inculcation of the faith, and only if they serve and hire people primarily of their own faith. Want to run a school with your church? You lose the exemption. Want to serve soup to Jewish, Muslim or atheist homeless people as well as Christian ones? You lose the exemption. Want to allow a diverse group of students to attend your college? Fine, but you have to pay for drugs that cause abortions now.

Because Belmont Abbey College is not a church, and because it serves and employs people of all faiths, it probably does not qualify to have its religious beliefs protected. The new regulations also force the monks and other religious objectors to pay for speech with which they disagree. These employers and schools now have to pay for their employees and students to receive “counseling and education” about contraceptives and sterilization. So the monks at Belmont Abbey can preach against contraception and sterilization all they like on Sunday morning. But on Monday, Secretary Sebelius will make them pay someone else to send the exact opposite message.

None of this is remotely permissible under the Constitution or federal law. The Founders explicitly protected the free exercise of religion in the First Amendment. That right extends to all of us, and the government has no power to limit it only to those who teach the faith for a living or only to those who limit their charity and employment opportunities to people of the same faith. Federal statutes rightly forbid the government from imposing these kinds of burdens on our free exercise of religion. The First Amendment protects all of us from being forced to speak the government’s message instead of our own.

Secretary Sebelius and the administration left the monks of Belmont Abbey with no choice but to sue — they could either allow the administration to run roughshod over their religious beliefs, kick all of their students and employees off of health insurance in the middle of a terrible economy or bring their claims to federal court. So the small Catholic college from North Carolina just brought its slingshot to Washington, D.C.

Secretary Sebelius wanted a war. Apparently, now she’ll have one in federal court. Darn tootin’.

Mark L. Rienzi is professor of constitutional law at The Catholic University of America and an attorney with The Becket Fund for Religious Liberty, which represents Belmont Abbey College.

 

 

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Hope it lands her in jail…

I will be praying for them in this battle.  God bless them for taking it on.  Sebelius should be ashamed of herself.

Yay for Belmont!

We are at war and God Almighty is our shield.
Stand up all you cowards and wake up this sleeping giant.

I think that every single Catholic orginization should take them to court. Every Diocese, Catholic Charities, Catholic Grade Scool, High SChool, and The sleeping giant needs to wake and be courageous. This has to stop here or we will become like Nazi Germany or Communist China.

I hope the courts are as sympathetic to this point of view…

excommunicate the apostates

This fruit cake is suppose to be “catholic”, yet her bishop or the USCCB have done nothing to excommunicate her (& the rest of the so-called “catholic” politicians) & as a result they will have to answer to Jesus, but, meanwhile we now have something worse than Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, etc. & it is called OBAMANISIM. Wake up people & get back to God & His Church & PRAY, PRAY, PRAY as our Blessed Mother keeps telling us.  +JMJ+

If the Church and so-called Catholic hospitals and universites/college/schools had been more open about NFP and the like, and promoted it (within reason…you aren’t gonna to talk about NFP to a 7 year old in 2nd grade I hope!), then we might not be where we are today. 

You don’t go into an authentic Jewish deli expecting shaved ham on a bagel.  But who cares with all the other tasty options!  Similarly, NFP (temp only, STM, Creighton model,and the like) suffer an image problem they should not be having due to ignorance among clergy and medical professionals, including ones who belong to the Catholic Medical Association and who ought to know better.

I wish Belmont well, but they shouldn’t have to be fighting this fight.  I believe their fight will be made that much more difficult because of the widespread desent about Humanae Vitae and the fact that studies show the majority of sexual active Catholics are using a birth prevention method contrary to Church teaching.  The majority of Catholic ob/gyn likely do sterilizations and contraception, and the same for family physcians.  If I were a judge, that is what I would see.

This is a battle we ought all to be engaged in. Belmont will undoubtedly need financial assistance to fight this was as well as prayer assistance. Does anyone know how we can contribute to their legal battle?

This is not a news article.  It is an editorial written by a lawyer representing the plaintiff in this lawsuit.  Everything he says should be taken with a very large grain of salt.

Let the state unleash its dogs… death and imprisonment before I commit a willful mortal sin!

This is not a legitimate news article.    It is a one-sided editorial written by one of the lawyers representing the plaintiff in this case.  It should be taken with a very large grain of salt.

God Bless my Alma Mater! I have never been so proud to be a Crusader!

Lets pray for all who oppose and those who choose to go with the thoughs of the administration and Sebellius.

Wow, check out the photo of Ms. Sebelius in the article. Her eyes are looking up to the left. Could she have heard the voice of the Lord. The same voice that asked Cain, “where is your brother Abel?” Cain killed one. Sebelius is looking to kill many more and has already done so through her culture of death philosophy and position in government.

I see cracks in the ice.. could it be a spring time of faith?!

I will be praying and paying to support the efforts to defend the 1st Ammendment and our Catholic beliefs.  God Bless Belmont Abbey College! Do not give up this fight, you have the support of millions of Christians and good Americans who defend the constitution.

I am a single man and I don’t want to pay for contraceptives when I can’t use them. I can’t afford health care either. I can’t pay the fine for not having health care. I guess federal prison for me.

Go Belmont, I stand with you, and may God bless you ten thousand times over for your courage!

Good for Belmont Abbey.  Take em on!  And the Catholic bishops in Ameerica had better, and like now, take aggressive action legally, politically and good jaw boning to get the governments out of Catholic soceties…schools, hopsitals, etc. Speak up, bishops, or forever hold your beanies without brains.  Speak the hell up and start a sunami that the politicians in government will forever be scared and scarred.  Speak with energy, shout and die shouting against facism of the US government.
Speak up, not to the choir, but to all citizens as to what it means to be Catholic. Speak the hell up! Fight and do not back off.  Speak and fight!

“This is not a legitimate news article.”

Like, duh! It is his opinion, also known as an opinion piece. Which the rest of us figured out by reading the entire thing.

Too bad some of the Catholic Charities agencies forced out of adoptions didn’t take this route.  Bravo to the courage of Belmont Abbey and The Beckett Fund for Religious Liberty.  There are lines in our personal lives, in our business lives, in our spiritual lives, and in our civic lives that no one may cross.  That includes the President of the United States.

This is the same HHS secretary that as the governor of the state of Kansas protected and coddled the abortionist George Tiller and would place NO LIMITS of any kind on his abortion practice and vetoed any limits of any kind upon the culture of death.  I am not suprised at all that she is now openly supporting an attack upon the very institution she claims to be so very important to her…the Catholic Church and the institutions that try to remain true to the Church in teaching and practice.  So much for being a Catholic witness.

Hooray, and God bless them and strengthen them in the fight for religious liberty that is outrageously under attack.  We are praying for them and cheering them on!

1 Samuel 17 says that David went to the Wadi and pick up 5 smooth stones, but we all know he only needed one. Belmont Abbey is that one smooth stone.

Where do I send a contribution!

Sabelius could appear on - for instance on - Dancing With The Stars, how about that or an auction, the reward for which would be a date with Kathleen.

@Doris Ranke
Thank you for your support.  Financial support can be sent to the Chancellor’s Fund.  http://alumni.belmontabbeycollege.edu/ChancellorFund

Thank goodness for the courageous people at Belmont Abbey College. Catholicism has far too many “butterflies and flowers” clergy and religious: it is time the Obama Administration is called on the carpet for the religious persecution it is promulgating!!!

(I just left a position working with people who have no other access to medical care rather than be fired for refusing to do abortions or perscribe abortifacients, and it hurts.)

God bless Belmont Abbey!

Re Richard Carroll’s comment that “This is not a news article.” So what!  It could be a writing on the wall in your bathroom! Truth is truth, facts are facts, regardless.  Come to think of it, the “writing on the wall” is quite apt if you know your Bible:  Doom and gloom for the Babylonian Empire.

Deborah

The real scandal is the failure of the Bishops to excommunicate Ms. Sebelius.

It is a sad day when Catholics force this upon everyone. Our ex-governor supports something that goes directly against the teachings of the church, the same church she is part of (when did she become lost)? I can only hope that the good Lord has more mercy on her than she has shown to the unborn.

Are we on a roll?  First Archbishop Dolan and now Belmont Abbey.  Maybe the Catholic Church still has a spine.  Very simply when we decide to use the Constitution on our behalf instead of being a rug when it is used against us, we will begin to be the power God desires His Church to be.  We are in the mess we are in because the Church has allowed itself to walked on and has not risen to truly represent its Founder and the people who believe.  Would St. Paul have accomplished his mission by being a milktoast?  It is time to support each other and get our leaders to take a stand.  Thank you Belmont Abbey.

Obama and Sebelius will have to answer to this on judgement day.  So sorry for them!

We pray for all that their eyes may be opened to God’s will and commandments. The President and government do not realize how they are endangering their eternal souls. May God have mercy on them and on the whole world - they are our brothers and sisters.

It’s so sad that it’s Catholics in public office who are at war with the Church - Sebelius was a colleague and friend of George Tiller the baby killer, who terminated the lives of human babies up until the 9th month; Pelosi rabidly and aggressively promotes abortion as does Joe Biden and they are paid well by NARAL and Planned Parenthood and yet..and yet they are considered Catholics in good standing and therefore permitted to continue to receive Holy Communion. Why won’t the Bishops stand strong together and let these Catholic politicians who PUBLICLY promote the slaughter of human babies in the wombs of their mothers know that they are NOT Catholics in good standing and should not receive Holy Communion until they publicly repudiate their advocation of abortion? Not only is this causing great scandal and sadness among Catholics but it is also denying these politicians the possibility of conversion. Since they know they are permitted to receive Communion, they believe that they are indeed Catholics in good standing and take their battle to destroy human life further - Biden did so in Africa.  And, because the Bishops allow this to continue, millions of human babies continue to be slaughtered. This is madness!!! Would Hitler have been able to continue to receive Communion by these standards? If a person was for molesting children and involved in molesting children and publicly supported the molestation of children, would he/she be allowed to receive Communion? Isn’t killing worse than molesting? Honestly, I just don’t understand…

JMJ Are finances going to be a player in this?  Can a Gov. agency drag its feet and drain the College of its money to fight the war.  Belmont might have to file through another Gov. agency to be able to afford this.  Pit one Gov. agency against another.+

Back in the 80s Belmont Abbey College also found itself in court fighting litigation about the religious status of the College and they won.  But the situation was exactly the opposite of what we have now.  Back then the college wanted to be designated as a non-religious institution in order to get federal funding for things such as scholarships.  And the courts granted BAC that status.  Now 30 years later they are arguing exactly the opposite, so which way is it?
Furthermore the college leases land to stores like Wal Mart and Rite Aid which also provide contraceptives and the like.  So at least some part of the revenue generated from those leases is funded by the sale of these services which are against Church teaching.
What is never mentioned in this article is that the original complaint filed by several faculty members with the EEOC is that those professors were past the point of needing to use birth control/ abortion.  I suppose a 45 year old could get pregnant, but probably not.  The question I think was that many women take birth control pills for some sort of hormone therapy, which the church allows.  You read these articles and it appears that at BAC has hussies lined up out the door at Planed Parenthood, to get their umpteenth abortion.  But that is not the case.
And as far as the monks preaching about the evils of contraception/abortion, in my 4 years as a student there I can count on one hand the number of times those issues were mentioned.
Sadly I see this as yet another attempt by the school’s administration to thrust itself in the limelight to put BAC on the map so people will flock to it for its uber-Catholicity.  As a publicity stunt it will probably work.  But really it’s a cheat, as more money is pumped into these various legal David v. Goliath battles and not into developing academic programmes.  So students arrive to BAC the last true Catholic college left, fighting the good fight only to realize that if you can throw or kick a ball, you can pretty much get away with anything; and that if you are a faithful Catholic trying to grow in holiness, your spiritual needs will be met only if you buy into to this neo-con/charismatic brand of Catholicism espoused by the schools administration.

JMJ

“her bishop….done nothing to excommunicate her…”

Heads up: her bishop has forbidden her from receiving the Eucharist until she publicly denounces ‘pro-choice’, etc., and goes to Confession, a.k.a., a form of excommunication. So, JMJ…ya need to research your subjects before making huge mistakes.

Sibelius wins the CINO Award - Catholic In Name Only.  And with people as Nancy Pelosi in the running; that’s saying something.

Thank you for the link, I just donated to the college.  God save us from this Obamanation!

If the Catholics don’t like it, they can stop accepting federal funds.  If not, they have to accept federal guidelines.

“This day I call heaven and earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live ...”

Well you at least have to give Mzzz Sebelius credit where credit is due ... just like Moses at least SHE knows and recognizes that we are in an all out Kulture war ... AND give her credit at least she is not sitting on the sidelines ... SHE has chosen which side of the line SHE stands on ... SHE stands up for Death.

Now the ball is squarely in the USCCB Bishops Court where Canon 915 allegedly protects, among other things, the right in justice of the Faithful not to be misled by the bad example of another’s seriously wrong public behavior if that grave wrong goes uncorrected by Church Leaders.

She is also in trouble over the Planned Parenthood documents that were shredded.  I am very glad that people are fighting back.

May God have mercy on Sebelius’ soul.  She calls herself a Catholic so she is so much more responsibile for her ongoing immoral Anti-Catholic stance.  She was a horrible governor who pushed and embraced the pro-abortion agenda and she is even worse as the Secretary of Health and Human Services.

Kathleen Sebelius will have to answer to God for her actions.  I just wish she’d stop being such a hypocrite by calling herself a Catholic when she holds Catholicism in such contempt.  She’s an embarassment.

I pray this is a shot heard around the world.

Richard:
So what to your objection? It is a fact, period. Why did the Founding Fathers put this in the FIrst Amendment and it is a far-reaching amendment. Congress can make no law regarding freedom of religion — and that includes not giving them the authority to decide what is “religious” enough! Or are you ALL for being forced to pay for abortions against our will by force of law? Aren’t these the same kinds of folks that say “personally-opposed but ” — a charade of an argument when you look at what they do with the death penalty and govt. funding of abortion (it is their view of “morality”) and then impose their morality?  Ask yourself why this bullying tactic isn’t front-page news by the Lamestream press? You know it would be had this been the other way around in ANY situation, such as forcing atheists to pay for building churches. And you KNOW this; don’t pretend you don’t! And Rosie: that’s OUR money, too. NOT the government’s money. Just a little fact there.

Folks, direct your anger at Sibelius this way: every time you include her in your prayers (at Mass or elsewhere) send her a letter stating so. We must continue to harp at these people so they can never say they didn’t know what the truth was. Please please just pray for her conversion and work to see that her evil plans are stopped.

“Be careful, lest you be fighting against God” the word a famous rabbi advised the Sanhedrin trying ti silence St. Peter and apostles.

Let us all pray for Belmont and for the soul of Sibelius.

I believe in each womans right to have her health insurance cover her medical needs. I used birth control pills because my income could support only 2 children. The birth rate among Roman Catholic families of Euro-American derivation has fallen.  Perhaps this is because these women have doctors who prescribe such meds to treat acne or hormonal “problems”.  My tax dollars support programs that provide food and medical care to RC families with the number of children above their income.  And last government officials are for the entire population not one religion. Please turn to the New Testament and the teachings of Jesus and the Disciples.

In media speeches, the president of the US and his administrative heads speak softer and like to appear like they have good intentions for the country.  But, in more private speeches, around people of their own ilk, they take the mask off and show just how grotesquely ugly their hearts really are.  I’m praying for religious freedom in this country and the success of Belmont Abbey, bishops please support them.

There is no such thing as the RC Church, there is just the Church and it’s Universal (Catholic).

You don’t “have” to use contraceptives or abortifacients. NFP is 99 percent effective. My wife and I have 4 children all 2 years apart.

It is David and Goliath all over again.  I am so proud of Belmont and the monks of Belmont.  It is amazing that it took a small college to stand up to the “administration of death”, and sad to think that the larger and wealthier catholic universities stand on the sidelines and watching.  I ask for those students, alumni, professors and administrators of these silent universities to stand behind Belmont by asking your university to join in this fight and if they will not, form an coalition to raise monies from your university supporters to give to Belmont’s legal defense.  I know I will as an individual and I will approach my parish to seek for their support.  We are the “militant church”, do not stand in “Silence” anymore, speak now while we have the right and freedom to do so.  Even though this is an article written by the attorney of Belmont, it is a voice seeking justice and freedom, for the press will not even bring it up or give it importance as is their practice regarding their support to this administration.  God Bless Belmont Abbey.  Pray for our Bishops that the Holy Spirit inspire them and give them strength to stand for “Veritas”

Kudos to the Becket Fund for taking on this case for BAC.  For those who may not know, the Becket Fund is a NON-profit law firm started by a catholic attorney for the express purpose of fighting religious liberty cases.  They operate out of Washington, D.C.
Incidentally, the Becket Fund was named for Thomas Becket(1118-70 AD), a friend of King Henry II, who served as Chancellor of England and oversaw the laws of the kingdom. But as Archbishop of Canterbury, he steadfastly refused to allow the King to interfere in the affairs of the Church and was martyred by the King’s knights for defending the principles of religious liberty .
Donate at (cut and paste to browser) http://www.becketfundcommunity.org/SupportUs

When we elect fools to high office, and I am speaking of fools in the Biblical sense, see Psalm 14 vs 1, as in those who act as if God does not exist, or at least that God’s laws do not apply to themselves.) We see the consequences of what happen when the American people vote stupidly.

There is a problem in the pulpit when Catholicism 101 is no longer being taught there due to reported concensus of the people in the pews and opinion polls (unknown origin) are quoted and make our clergy decide to not “Rock the boat” by bringing up anything controvercial from the pulpit.

Read “Fatherless, to understand the decline in American culture in the last 50 years.  Pope Paul the VI predicted every bit of this in Humanae Vitae and it has all come to pass exactly as he said it would.  Schools stealing our children’s innocense by telling them, not the facts of life and love but the how to without getting pregnant.  In the hands of children these things don’t work (often not for adults either) and offer no protection from STD’s. I question the motivation of those forcing this “Sex Education” on our chilren. Children having children.  Disregard for legal Marriage.  Disrespect for and USING OF women while still making them think they are “Liberated”.  There are more unhappy women now, abandoned by lovers, and husbands who have been taught by the contraceptive society that they don’t need to take responsibility for their behavior or the children they conceive. Children abused and even killed by Mom’s boyfriend. There are two main victims in abortion.  The Mother and her child not to mention sometimes the Father and the adoptive couple who need to go to Russia and China and anywhere but the USA to find a baby.

Oh Yes.  Contraception has done us a world of good.

If the issue is really the administration’s desire to protect women’s long-term health, as HHS Secretary Sebelius claims, why then do the HHS dictates not only mandate that U.S. universities provide access to birth control pills, which according to the Institute of Medicine have become essential’ to women’s long-term health, but also all *other* forms of contraceptives which do nothing for women’s health?

Sebelius answered when she, a self-professed Catholic, spoke at a NARAL rally last year: “We’re at war”. Such rhetoric is not only bombastic and unnecessary, but self-defeating in that it gave opponents of the administration the fodder they needed: an excellent sound bite.

I was raised Roman Catholic (I am Eastern Orthodox) and I just don’t understand why the administration feels the need to do this, from a *practical* perspective. If students at Catholic universities want to dodge their administrations’ Church-inspired policies on birth control, they can easily do so on their own time with their own funds. They can go to any of the Planned Parenthood clinics operating in many poorer areas and scoop up free condoms, or, God forbid, schedule a free abortion. Or they can do what Fordham law student Bridgette Dunlap did, and organise an off-campus clinic outside their university’s jurisdiction.

Why force religious universities to fund and support measures they oppose? Why force a university to provide birth control when their religious beliefs oppose it? The only logical answer: because HHS and the administration have no respect for religious liberty unless it suits their agenda

The administration’s intentions are clear: to claim to be advancing women’s health interests against an obstructionist, backwards institution, while offering a skimpy exception which only covers those institutions which only serve to catechize and serve those of the same faith. In other words, even a Catholic high school which instructs pupils in catechism, but has one or two non-Catholic students (or more) would not be exempt. The administration seeks to compel the Church to change its position, or, to force it to obstruct its own teachings. This is clearly unconstitutional.

Mr. Obama is giving directives to an “unelected agency” controlled by an “unelected woman Ms Sibelius” of HHS. 

Ms. Sibelius is correct.  This is a war that we are in———this is a war to save America and to save the separation of Church and State.

This war started with R V Wade in 1973——-recently Obama Celebrated R V Wade on January 22, 2012 with his statement ‘celebrating’  R V Wade.

What Mr. Obama did not state was that he was celebrating approximately 54 million, yes 54,000,000 American girls and boys, subsequent to the enactment of that ruling, having been destroyed. 

Now, Ms Sibelius and Mr. Obama have escalated their personal wishes, their war,  into federal mandates to control the Catholic Hospitals and if allowed to continue into all of the excellent work that the Catholic Church does to help people.

In case anyone wonders, no I am not a Catholic I am a Presbyterian who supports life and did so as an elected Virginia Delegate in 1984 supporting President Reagan at the Dallas Convention and the people of Virginia. 

Kudos to Belmont Abbey College I will pray for you in battling the forces that would destroy more Americans.

What’s next? Forcing the Amish to purchase GM Vehicles? Or maybe a one child per couple policy. Biden already supports that!

Your “faith” is just and only that.  I favor critical review before acting.  I will continue to fight against my own superstitions and ignorance.  History clearly indicates that reason not religion has brought us the relatively easy life most American now enjoy.  If you ever had and still have the ability, review your faith based decisions with the same critical analysis that you would any other of lifes’ decisions.  Stay at it and you may find yourself moving out of the Dark Ages.

Larry:
Who were you responding to? Yourself? “History clearly ....” Really? Like the “reason” of Communism, etc., that has destroyed lives in the millions? It is you that needs to “review” your decisions, on whatever bases you have. Why do you think this country was established: freedom OF religion. And if you claim that, for example, the Constitution doesn’t mention God, it didn’t gave to; the Declaration of Independence, the TRUE Founding Document of this nation, did. Without that document, there is no Constitution because there is no nation.

richard carroll on Friday, Nov 11th said:

“This is not a news article.  It is an editorial written by a lawyer representing the plaintiff in this lawsuit.  Everything he says should be taken with a very large grain of salt.”

I’ll have to agree… (We all know, only government lawyers tell the truth. :))

Communism?  How did you get there and what provoked you to go?  If you wish to patronize your emotions rather than your intellect, OK!  That’s you.  But, I’m not comfortable with such, see previous comments.

One of the most motivating issues pressing the founders of our country to leave England and come to the American Colonies was to be free of the Church of England. The Church of England was then and continues to be to the only State supported offical Church of Britian.  These men had a good close up look at religious dogma and intolerance.

These men in the main were more Deist than Theist.  There is little to no evidence that George Washington ever took Communion.  Check out Paine, Madison and Jefferson.  The Declaration of Independence is just that a Declaration to England and the world of a new stand alone nation.  The Constitution of The U.S. is the document that formed our government and thus our nation.  Is this the document you would have settled on had you wished to form a Christian National.  Is this the document you would have left to future generations to guide them in the promotion of your new Christian Nation?  Of course not and you know it.

Again let logic, reason and critical thought guide your actions, not ignorance, superstitution and fear.

Memo for Jean Sibelius: The Romans, the Nazis, and the Soviets also went to “war” with the Church.

Guess who won?

Larry:
Because Communism is presented as “reasonable” to many on the Left. Their only claim as to its failure is that “the right people weren’t in charge.” How many in this country — especially the elites and others like Walter Duranty — defended what Stalin did in the Ukraine, for instance, in the name of “reason”? That is not emotion on my part but on theirs.
As I wrote before, which you obviously intentionally ignored, was that God was mentioned in our TRUE founding document, the Declaration. It set out reasons as to WHY the Fathers were breaking away from England and on what principles they were doing so. The Constitution was written with that in mind. Without the Declaration, there is no nation.

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