A reader writes:
I was finally received into the Church a month ago after several years of investigating and fence-sitting. I read a ton, I love the sacraments, and it has been tremendous. But every now and then something happens that resurrects all my doubts and makes things seem off again.
The problem is this: I have two Catholic friends who are absolutely overjoyed to have me and think I am the ultimate weapon against their Protestant friends (I have a more “Louis Bouyer” attitude towards my prior spiritual homes). They’ve latched onto me and feel they need to initiate me into all the “Catholic things.” One in particular has been passionately assailing me with a nonstop barrage of conversations about Eucharistic miracles, Marian apparitions, Padre Pio, holy cards, Shroud of Turin, Medjugorje, miraculous medals, special prayers to particular saints that have supposedly been proven to be effective, etc., etc. These things all clearly form an integral part (if not the primary substance) of his faith and he is very eager for me to read and talk about them. It seems to me sometimes that they are less concerned with the real problems of sin, confession and penance, grace, etc. than the latest Catholic miracle.
The problem is that these are hurting, not helping my faith. It seems like whenever I investigate things he tells me about, all I can see is hoax, fraud, and unsubstantiated rumor. I don’t know how to explain to him that what he sends me is just not very convincing and actually makes me more skeptical. I was raised in a very Charismatic Protestant background and developed a strong distaste for anything that smacks of turning faith into superstition, stories of supernatural events, and the profitable popularity of those around whom such stories revolve. I was drawn to the steady and quiet piety of many Catholics I knew - who weren’t blown by the wind of every new fad, but kept their lives grounded in the mass.
Now that I am a Catholic, how many of these things am I really obligated to believe in? Obviously some are speculative or even condemned by the Church (medjugorje…), but some seem to be tightly wound up with Church practice and teaching. I just heard a priest preach a homily on wearing the Miraculous Medal. Try as I might to read explanations and justifications, I still can’t see the Miraculous Medal-wearing thing as anything other than dangerous superstition and corruption of the Gospel. How do I respond to my friends? And how do I learn to appreciate those Catholics whose piety revolves around concerns whose value I just can’t see?
Dear reader:
First off, welcome! May you find in the Church a spiritual home and a place to grow in grace! May God guide you by the Holy Spirit and hook you up with some sound spiritual guidance from mature folk who can help you pass through the storms and squalls of doubt that are a normal part of the Catholic life.
As to your friends, they no doubt mean well, but I suspect you are right to resist their eagerness. Of course, they hope to evangelize, but it can often turn out that gung ho Catholics (particularly the young single males who tend to comprise the cadre of zealous apologetic subculture folks) can forget about persons in their zeal to win arguments. I write about this subculture here. It’s well-meaning and can do real good. But it can also do real damage if it forgets you are a human being and starts treating you like a scalp or a notch in the belt. If you are feeling ambivalent (“I should be willing to help witness and I must be a bad and selfish person for not playing ball with my friends. But I feel uncomfortable too.”), ask yourself this: Are your friends treating you like a human being who is the only thing in creation God has willed for your own sake? Or are they treating you like a means to an end? If the latter, tell them so. It does not matter one iota what that end is. No human being should be treated like a means to some greater end. There is no greater end than the glory of a human being fully alive in Christ. When they stop treating you as a friend and a fellow human being and start seeing you as a resource to be exploited for some other end, they are making a mistake that is damaging to you and them.
Regarding private revelation, the good news is that the Church binds you to none of it. You can use that as a shield against the pressure and expectation some Catholics (not all or even most, thank God) try to put on you to sign off on their particular fave rave private revelation. The great thing about the Church is that it’s full of all kinds and is, well, catholic. If some private revelation does not help you, feel free to drop it. Don’t own the pressure friends may put on you, but also don’t feel like you have to fight back. Practice a certain detachment, nodding your head politely as you might if you were a tourist in a foreign country when one of the locals regales you with the legend of a local saint.
That’s not, by the way, to say that all claims of private revelation are fictional, mythic, or otherwise untrue. For example, I think that a dispassionate look at the evidence for, say, the apparations at Fatima reveals a very solid factual case to be made that Mary did, in fact, appear there. I contrarily think a dispassionate look at the evidence (or rather lack of evidence, not to mention counter-evidence) against the claim of Medugorje make it highly unlikely Our Lady appeared there. But even with well-established cases like Fatima or Lourdes, the Church *still* doesn’t bind our conscience. If it helps your devotion to Christ, then great. If not, or if it gives you trouble, just stick with the public revelation and it will be fine.
As to what you should do about your friend’s enthusiasm, I think Paul’s counsel in Romans 14 is the soundest. The Catholic summary of that counsel is “In essential things, unity; in doubtful things, liberty; in all things, charity. If some private revelation helps your brother stay close to Christ thank God for it. Doesn’t mean you have to feel something about that devotion. If something seems dubious, find out if it is, in fact, dubious or if it merely feels that way because of your personal psychological history. As a general rule, if the Church approves a private revelation, that’s good reason to suppose there’s something in it, but even then you have to remember that you are not looking at the same thing as doctrinal development or public revelation. So, for instance, St. Catherine of Siena gives us spiritually fruitful insights in her Dialogues with God the Father—but she also delivers herself of the opinion that God the Father personally told her that Mary was not immaculately conceived. Sorry, Kate, but that was just your Dominican team spirit siding with St. Thomas, who was as wrong as you were. That doesn’t mean Catherine’s mysticism is worthless. It means that Catherine was human and private revelation requires discernment subject to the Church.
You are right to be wary of miracle chasing. God does, in fact, still do wonders in our time, of course. But there is, as you rightly intuit, something unhealthy in the mentality that is constantly looking for signs and wonders or (worse) substituting the latest visionary or folk hero for the teaching of the Church. Avoid that like poison. But at the same time, have pity on those who are trapped in that addiction to the latest vision, or prophetic fad. Such folk are found in the Catholic communion just as in Protestantism (since the Church is “Here comes everybody”). And though I’ve never met one who believes Mary is another God, I’ve met plenty who think she is another Pope. You are under no obligation to comply. Instead, pray for such folk that they gain a more mature faith. The need for signs and wonders is a mark of a weak faith. Weak faith needs to be strengthened, not shunned, feared, or ridiculed.
Finally, with respect to common devotions like the Miraculous Medal, such things take time to process for Protestant converts like us. We have our antennae out for magical fetishes and good luck charms, and forget that what is at work here is, of course, sacramentality, not magic. The Miraculous Medal is, in a minor key, what the sacraments are in major keys: grace mediated to us through some physical token. It’s no more superstitious than a wedding ring. Rather, like a wedding ring, it’s a sign of one’s love for our Lady and of her love for you.
Hope that helps!
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Could this be a case for Lorenzo Scupoli?
“Doubtless they are powerful means for becoming truly perfect and pious, and, when employed with discretion, are of singular efficacy for supporting our nature, ever averse to good and prone to evil; for repelling the attacks and escaping the snares of our common enemy, for obtaining from the Father of mercies those succours so necessary for the righteous, especially beginners.
“But the case is far different with those who ignorantly place their devotion in exterior works, which frequently are the cause of their perdition, and of worse consequence than manifest crimes, not that they are in themselves pernicious, but only from a wrong application. Their attachment to such works is so great, that they utterly neglect to watch the secret motions of their hearts, but, giving them full scope, leave them exposed to their own corruption and the wiles of the devil.
“Now what God expects at our hands before all things is a serious application to the subduing our passions; and this is more properly doing our duty, than if, with unbridled appetites, we should do him greater service.
“... nothing can be more noble, nor approach nearer to the divine nature, than to pardon those who injure us, and return good for evil; humble knowledge of ourselves surpasses the sublimest sciences; greater praise is due to him who curbs his passions on the most trivial occasions, than to him who takes the strongest cities, defeats whole armies, or even works miracles and raises the dead.”
Wow, great response Mark!
Excellent response. It’s nice to see this addressed. I am a “revert,” not a convert, but like this questioner I am extremely wary of anything miraculous. After years of thinking about it, I’ve concluded that part of it is my own very secular background combined with some unfortunate experiences with Born Again friends and their claims, and part of it is just my personality. While I still have a visceral, wary reaction toward much of the supernatural or miraculous, I have mostly come to take a “live and let live” approach. Some people are naturally attracted to such devotional things and others are not; God graciously provides for both. I try to keep an open mind to these things if they are sanctioned or allowed by the Church. I have, indeed, developed an appreciation for many devotional practices, even when I don’t share them, and I have developed some myself. Others (like the bleeding hosts and things that just strike me as too far out for me) I just chalk up to, “that’s not me.” And the weirder ones I have learned to look on with affection as part of our wild, wacky church, where there is something for everyone! We are not a Church with one, pristine, pure way to holiness that has nothing earthy or absurd about it. God became a man; there’s nothing pristine about that! Look around. Some people are tacky, sentimental, and earthy. The sort of things they love can be holy, just as the things that tasteful, cerebral people love can be holy. Christ made the whole world holy! Now that I have been Catholic for a while, I have come to appreciate and love that more and more.
Mark, thanks for this excellent response! I’ve been Catholic a little over 5 years and some of this stuff still makes me uncomfortable.
Our associate pastor is an exemplary priest - deeply spiritual, kind, intuitive, and full of great advice on avoiding sin and temptation. But he’s also deeply devoted to Medjugorje. The same is also true of another priest I’ve met. I’ve read the evidence (or lack thereof) regarding Medjugorje’s authenticity, and I’m just as unconvinced as you, but there’s no denying the spiritual fruits evident in the lives of these fine priests. So I’m not quite sure how to process the evidence that contradicts the claims of its supporters and the good I’ve seen in the lives of priests I love and admire.
And it’s stuff like this that keeps so many of my friends from embracing the fullness of the faith.
The need for signs and wonders is not a mark of a weak faith, but a mark of a true humanity. Someone who is desprately seeking Christ, someone who wants to be in awe of the Mystery. I do agree that that does not mean the Virgin Mary must appear to me before I believe, but I am truly free when I can look at the most simple of things with amazement and joy because I understand that to be a sign of Someone Greater! I understand that it is a miracle that there is a tree standing in my backyard! Who created it?! The world and everything in it is a sign of a Greater Love, of the Infinite! Without this wonder there can be no faith, otherwise faith is just an idea. Reality presents itself as a sign, and I respond to that!
If you really want to get into studying the faith, read Dr. Scott Haun’s books and listen to his tapes, they are excellent teaching tools to learn. the rest will fill in as needed, if the time comes.
I think you can find the books and tapes on:
http://www.ewtn.com/series/shows/signsOfLife/signsOfLife.htm
This gentleman goes deeper into the theology then anyone I know and is truly knowledgeable.
I hope you enjoy him.
It seems to me that claiming something that is a “private revelation” does not really help. The church certainly believes these revelations are true since it gives their official approval. This means they are true and binding. How can something that the church approves be dismissed?
Dear Mark, I agree with the overall thrust of this piece, but there are a couple of things that concern me. Firstly, the Sacraments actually impart grace, whereas the sacramentals help dispose us to the grace imparted (make it more fruitful) see: CCC 1670. So, the minor key/major key isn’t the best analogy. Secondly, one should never use an irreverent or flippant manner when referring to Canonized Saints, especially Doctors of the Church, like St. Catherine of Sienna. Saint Catherine shouldn’t be subject to “Sorry, Kate, but that was just your Dominican team spirit siding with St. Thomas, who was as wrong as you were.” Which is merely conjecture on your (and others) part, as primary source citations to this claim about St. Catherine are wanting. In fact, this claim is contested (see Benedict XIV: On Heroic Virtue) precisely because primary sources are wanting. You state that St. Catherine claimed God the Father told her, but the original ‘claim’ stated that the Blessed Virgin told her. When there are no primary sources and good defenses against the secondary and tertiary sources it is best to proceed with caution and not put words into someone’s mouth. All of that being said, St’s do err and are subject misunderstanding what God has revealed to them: St. Ignatius was convinced that he was supposed to set up shop in Jerusalem…later he realized that that was not God’s will but his own desire and eventually Rome became his home.
“Private revelation” is the Church’s term. That the Church says something is worthy of belief does not make it binding on us as though it were public revelation.
CCC 67 Throughout the ages, there have been so-called “private” revelations, some of which have been recognized by the authority of the Church. They do not belong, however, to the deposit of faith. It is not their role to improve or complete Christ’s definitive Revelation, but to help live more fully by it in a certain period of history. Guided by the Magisterium of the Church, the sensus fidelium knows how to discern and welcome in these revelations whatever constitutes an authentic call of Christ or his saints to the Church.
Christian faith cannot accept “revelations” that claim to surpass or correct the Revelation of which Christ is the fulfillment, as is the case in certain non-Christian religions and also in certain recent sects which base themselves on such “revelations”.
I am a recent convert to the Church from Mormonism. Because of my background (Mormonism) I am kind of uncomfortable with miracles and apparitions. Would I like to believe? Yes. But, whether they are true or not isn’t important to my faith. My faith is in our Lord and God Jesus Christ. Everything esle just becomes icing on the cake.
I agree Mark. I am also a former Protestant (Baptist) and at first I had trouble too. It has not yet been a full five years since my reversion. Accepting Catholic doctrine was the easy part. Catholic culture is a lot harder especially when, at least in my experience, many more of my Protestant friends are more interested in holiness and a dedication to the Scriptures than most of my Catholic friends. But there are some of the miracles and such that over time, I have had to learn to accept, like your example above of Fatima, the incorruptible saints, the Eucharistic miracle of Lanciano, and the miraculous conversion of 9 million Aztecs to Catholicism because of Our Lady of Guadalupe.
It took a while, but I’ve finally gotten to the point where I can truly say that even if I don’t fully understand, and it makes no sense in my head, I trust the Church as a whole and that makes everything easier.
Plus I have had more victory over sin in my life in my 5 years as a Catholic that I eve had in 27 years as a Baptist (and I really tried). I attribute this to my daily wearing of the Miraculous Medal and several times evey day rededicating myself to Our Dear Mother.
Fr. RP:
No flippancy or irreverence intended to St. Catherine, any more than when devotees of St. Maximilan Kolbe call him St. Max. Just friendly familial love for a great Dominican. Thanks for the correction on the details.
Miracles are the chief means that prove the truth of Christianity, which is an unabashedly supernatural religion. So if you have a psychological resistance to the miraculous beyond the prudent skepticism one must have when confronted with any supernatural claim, I would seriously reflect on that. Personally, I do not understand the bias. I evaluate claims of miracles as critically as I can, and if the evidence and support is there, then I accept the claim. No doubt, there are credulous Catholics out there, but what is more concerning to me is the simple refusal of many Catholics to even entertain many of these modern miracles. That the Church does not bind private revelation with the assent of Divine and Catholic Faith is not really an “out” for such a Catholic. The Church does not bind the assent of faith on a lot of things, but that does not mean you are not irrational or imprudent for not assenting to those truths. So with private revelation. The laws of evidence and rational discourse no longer cease to exist, and if a credible case can be mounted for these miraculous claims, then a rational person ought to accept them.
I think that miracles and apparitions are gifts from God which are meant only to point people towards God and a greater love of the sacraments and his holy church. I have often seen people turn back to God or be inspired to go deeper into there faith due in part to the graces given through modern miracles, including myself. I also have never heard anything contrary to the faith at Medjugorje. I have only seen good fruits: people turning back to God and the Church. I know these devotions are not for everyone and not necessary to be a good Catholic, but to me they are additional proof that God loves us and that he desperately wants the world to turn back to Him. As a cradle Catholic, these things are second nature to me and so I completely understand that new converts might not be comfortable with these type of miracles/devotions. No one should feel obligated to believe in these devotions, but people also should not be looked down on as a crazy Catholic if they do.
@Gary:
Welcome Gary! You make an extremely important point here regarding private revelation. Is it true that Morman’s believe their religion and faith are based on the private revelations of Joseph Smith, Jr? Based on your experience with Mormanism, I think it would be very helpful if you were more specific as to why you’re uncomfortable with miracles and apparitions.
“Posted by Gary O on Wednesday, Mar 21, 2012 12:33 PM (EST):I am a recent convert to the Church from Mormonism. Because of my background (Mormonism) I am kind of uncomfortable with miracles and apparitions. Would I like to believe? Yes. But, whether they are true or not isn’t important to my faith. My faith is in our Lord and God Jesus Christ. Everything esle just becomes icing on the cake.”
I am living proof that wearing a miraculous medal isn’t a 100% safeguard against commiting sins, but, nonetheless, I wear my miraculous medal. I saw a Cardinal on EWTN, now deceased, say, “Win an argument; lose a soul.” That can make it difficult as non-Catholics often come at us with arguments, essays, bible-quotes, ridicule, etc. Articulate response, Mr. Shea.
Your welcome Mark. My point with the ‘flippant or irreverent’ comment is based in the fact that you address St. Catherine in the present about something she supposedly said in the past with the intention of informing her of her own interior motives: She enjoys the Beatific Vision and is in the immediate presence of the Immaculate Conception and needs no one on earth to point her in the right direction.
Great response. The miracle chasing and over enthusiasm for private revelation is largely why I left the catholic church and chose Judaism. I now pray to One G-d.
Larry,
Why Judaism?under12
forget under12. That was for the image code. Sorry about that.
@Dismas The Mormon Church is very anti-Catholic. They are starting to move away from this, though, because inspite all of their non-Christian doctrine they are spending a lot of money (PR firms)trying to appear traditionally Christian. When I was growing up Mormon I heard all the time, “we don’t do this or that like the Catholics do”. If you look at Mormonism there are no icons or statues in their buildings, No crosses, no Crucifixes, and no Blessed Mary. They do have a pagan angel Moroni on top of all of their temples, though. I went into one of their chapels for a funeral recently and the only thing on any wall was a clock. Not even a picture of our Savior.
Mormons do belive that Joseph Smith received almost daily revelation. He claims God and Jesus appeared to him and told him all churches were an abomination including the Catholic Church which Smith called “the !@#$% of babylon”. Mormons believe that the head of the Mormon Church is a prophet, seer, and revelator although it has been nearly a hundred years since any revelation has been added to their canon.
The reason I said that that I was uncomfortable with miracles and apparitions is because being Mormon and anti-Catholic we really believed they were just hoaxes. kind of silly. But, I’ve grown to really love the Catholic Church. I go to Mass now every day except Saturday. My lifes intention now is to know, love, and serve God and live Eternally with Him. I’m sorry that I got of of the subject, but you asked. God Bless!!
Gary,
Thanks for your response. You affirmed the point I was trying to make about how easily we can be deceived by unapproved private revelation.
“Mormons do belive that Joseph Smith received almost daily revelation. He claims God and Jesus appeared to him and told him all churches were an abomination including the Catholic Church which Smith called “the !@#$% of babylon”.”
According to About.com there are approximately 14.1 Mormons throughout the world as of 2010 and growing.
http://lds.about.com/od/mormons/a/church_membership.htm
“As of December 31, 2010 there were over 14.1 million members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints worldwide. Through the prophet, Joseph Smith, Jr., The Church of Jesus Christ was organized with only 6 members on April 6, 1830 in Fayette, New York.1 In a little over 175 years Church membership has grown exponentially.”
Dismas,
What does the growth of the Mormon church prove besides that it has grown?
@John It really proves nothing except how good Mormons are at marketing.
When I was in RCIA I spent nine months in classes, seven weeks AFTER baptism. At the end of my journey, the last several weeks, my very capable instructor kept telling us that if we felt like we had not completly accepted Jesus in our hearts and lives that we should wait and continue next year. The Mormons give you six lessons and challenge you to be baptised. Sometimes if they feel like you are ready before six weeks they go ahead and dunk you. The statistic is that after five years 50 percent of converts have become inactive or left the church
I can understand this questioner’s feelings when it comes to those who put too much of their energy into apparitions and the like. At the same time, he or she might start to notice that the best Catholics you ever meet (orthodox, charitable, serve the poor, pray all the time) wear the Miraculous Medal and so on - After I came in the Church, it wasn’t long before I noticed that the most fervent lovers of our Lord were also the most devoted to Mary…devoted in a HEALTHY, APPROVED way, not a compulsive, apparition-chasing way…. Meanwhile, those who are supporting abortion and all kinds of evil…well, it just so happens they are the same ones who tend to despise the rosary and the Miraculous Medal. That tells you a lot.
Also, read the story of Alphonsus Ratisbonne. It might open your mind to the power of sacramentals like the Miraculous Medal. I mean, the man was converted on the spot and became on fire for Christ and then a priest!
Theology of Revelation
Theology of Revelation: http://catholicity.wikia.com/wiki/Theology_of_Revelation
@John -
I’m trying to prove how susceptible to error we can be when we assent to any revelation unapproved by the Magisterium of our Church:
“It is this Magisterium’s task to preserve God’s people from deviations and defections and to guarantee them the objective possibility of professing the true faith without error…. To fulfill this service, Christ endowed the Church’s shepherds with the charism of infallibility in matters of faith and morals.” (Catechism, 890)
Dismas,
Thanks for your response. It follows then that when the church approves of someone’s “private revelation such as the Miraculous Medal that Catholics are obligated to wear it and embrace it. Catholics are bound to this. Agreed?
John,
Both private revelation and popular piety are non-obligary. Only Divine Revelation and the Liturgy are obligary.
Private revelation:
- Verbum Domini, 14 (“It is a help which is proffered, but its use is not obligatory.”).
Popular piety:
- Directory on Popular Piety and the Liturgy, 11 (“No such obligation, however, has obtained with regard to pious exercises, notwithstanding their worthiness or their widespread diffusion.”).
- Catechism of the Catholic Church, 1674 (“the veneration of relics, visits to sanctuaries, pilgrimages, processions, the stations of the cross, religious dances, the rosary, medals, etc.”).
Nick,
Why would it not be obligatory if its true? How is it possible for the leaders of your church to give someone the right to dismiss something that it claims is true and is from Jesus or Mary? Consider this: “The Blessed Virgin herself designed the Medal of the Immaculate Conception—popularly known as the Miraculous Medal!” http://www.amm.org/aboutus/medal.asp
John
For the Catholic Church’s teaching on Revelation, please refer to my comment on Wednesday, Mar 21, 2012 5:33 PM (EST). That link will take you to the appropriate article, which references Church documents, Church officials, and other Catholic resources.
I also recommend you contact your city’s local Catholic Bishop or the local Catholic Episcopal Conference, who have Divine Assistance and Divine Authority, as Vicars and Legates of Jesus Christ, in teaching the Catholic Faith: http://www.catholic-hierarchy.org
Nick,
Who carries greater authority? Jesus and Mary or church leaders?
@John -
No John,not agreed. Approved private revelation does not belong to the deposit of faith that must be adhered to in order to gain salvation. It just means that approved private revelation is not harmful to faith and morals and, properly applied, may even be helpful in gaining salvation.
Mark Shea has already posted what the Magisterium of our Church has specifically to say regarding private revelation:
CCC 67 Throughout the ages, there have been so-called “private” revelations, some of which have been recognized by the authority of the Church. They do not belong, however, to the deposit of faith. It is not their role to improve or complete Christ’s definitive Revelation, but to help live more fully by it in a certain period of history. Guided by the Magisterium of the Church, the sensus fidelium knows how to discern and welcome in these revelations whatever constitutes an authentic call of Christ or his saints to the Church.
Christian faith cannot accept “revelations” that claim to surpass or correct the Revelation of which Christ is the fulfillment, as is the case in certain non-Christian religions and also in certain recent sects which base themselves on such “revelations”.
Private revelation has been a part of my 63 years as a Catholic Convert. A private revelation led to my conversion. A visit to the Golden Cathedral (St. Josephs Church) in Panama City, Panama was the first time I entered a Catholic Church. God revealed His presence to me with overwhelming awe. I was speechless, and it almost took my breath away. He revealed his presence to me again when I entered the enclosure at Lourdes. In 1958 when our SAC B-47 crew was on reflex in Saragossa, Spain, I visited the city on liberty. I was rather aimlessly walking through the streets. At one corner I heard a distinct voice say turn right, and I was led to Our Lady of The Pillar Church. When I entered the church a familiar presence was revealed again. I learned later that it was the first church in the world dedicated to Mary by St. James in 40 A.D. It was bombed in the Spanish Civil war, but the bombs did not explode. They were still imbedded in the pillars of the church. Tradition has it that an angel stands at the door of this church to protect it until the end of the world. Its namesake pillar was fashioned by Mary’s angels when they transported her to be at the dedication of the church. I did nothing to earn such recognition, but no superlative can describe how grateful I am for these experiences.
About thirty years ago I received The Mystical City of God, a private revelation to Ven. Mother Mary of Agreda as a Christmas gift. Reading the 2700 pages in this four-volume document was a stimulating experience. I believe Almighty God when he specifies in the document: “I do not intend that thy descriptions and declarations of the life of the Blessed Virgin shall be mere opinions or contemplations, but reliable truth.” All former Protestants with traditional distrust of Mary owe it to their new faith to read this document. During the Coronation of Mary as Queen of Heaven, Almighty God said: “We wish for nothing to be conceded to man that does not pass through her hands.” The surest path to salvation is to offer everything to God through her hands as well. If you want to gain the maximum benefit from your faith, say the Rosary, the Chaplet of Mercy, and the Chaplet of St. Michael every day.
Dismas,
Where in your catechism does it say that a Catholic can reject or dismiss a private revelation that has been approved by the church? Mark says “If some private revelation does not help you, feel free to drop it.” I don’t see any thing in the catechism that gives a Catholic the right to do so. Your quote at CCC 67 does not make this claim either. Agreed?
John: When the catechism says that something does not belong to the deposit of faith, that means it is not binding on a Catholic to believe it. You sound as though you are not Catholic. Am I right? If so, you might want to read up on how the Church treats private revelation rather than simply tell Catholics how they are to treat it. Go here for information.
Mr. Shea,
Thankyou for your well written article. As always, it helps and confirms the faith of myself and hopefully others. God bless.
@—John on Wednesday, Mar 21, 2012 3:07 PM (EST):
All I will say is read about it. Much of what Jesus tught was already being taught. Well, except praying to all these private revelations instead of G-d, and that G-d required a human sacrifice for the forgiveness of sin.
Larry,
Jesus came to fulfill what the OT predicted and lived out perfectly the Law of God. Jesus taught that He alone was the way to God and no one can come to the Father but through Him. Do you think Jesus was lying when He said this?
Larry,
LOL, were you really ever a Christian? God REQUIRED a human sacrifice for the forgiveness of sin? That is not part of Catholic theology, as far as I am aware. It was the way God freely chose to show both His infinite love and the horror of sin, but He could have chosen another method for the forgiveness of sin.
No one prays to a “private revelation”. I have a hard time believing that someone would really leave Christianity because some people are too devoted to private revelations? You haven’t found any Jews with whom you disagree on anything?
The very best advice that I’ve ever read on this topic can be found in Father Benedict Groeschel’s “A Still, Small Voice”, published by Ignatius Press. The inquirer should buy it as a gift for his well-meaning but annoying friends. It is a small, easily-readable book, and really clears a lot of things up. And always remember the words of St. John of the Cross: “Where signs and wonders abound, there is little faith.” As a convert, the inquirer can be an instrument in bringing these people to a deeper faith. The signs and wonders are often for those with no faith, to aid in bringing them to it…and to emphasize important aspects of the faith that have been already revealed. EVERYTHING has already been revealed in Christ.
@—Dave
Jews argue or discuss all the time just like christians do. I’m way to much a newbie to join in.
Only a fool would summarily reject private revelation or miracles that have been approbated or approved by the Catholic Church. Were they not possibly or even probably needed by some people for salvation, why do you suppose they occur? And why would anyone reject divine intervention? They are God’s or Mary’s way of warning the world that if His and her Son’s mercy is rejected, his justice will be incurred. God will not be mocked forever.
The surest way to lose salvation is to malign the Mother of God in any way. Caveat emptor.
Where would Christianity be if Jesus hadn’t walked on water, raised Lazurus from the dead or restored a blind mans’ sight. Christians would be left with the “ministry” of Jesus Christ consisting of not much more than turn the other cheek and love thy enemy - proclamations that Baptists, Evangelicals, Protestants and not a few Catholics have trouble getting fully behind - Christianities “red headed step child” if you will.
The reality is without signs, wonders and miracles Christianity would have a had a tough time getting off the ground and don;t forget the private revelation to a poor peasant Indian in Mexico by the Virgin Mary converted millions to the Catholic faith
Ryan,
That is not true. The teachings of Jesus are the most influential teachings of all time. The have influenced more people for good than any other teachings in the history of mankind.
I tend to agree with Ryan. Miracles were needed to confirm Jesus’ words and mission, and miracles continue to confirm the Church’s words and mission.
Certainly, that does not mean that all, or even the majority, of claimed miracles are valid, but they do happen, quite often. Saints usually cannot be canonized without a couple of miracles to their credit. Again, that serves as Heaven’s confirmation of that saints life and mission.
Proving a saint performed a miracle is problematic. There is no way to prove such a thing and its all based on speculations.
@ John
“Proving a saint performed a miracle is problematic. There is no way to prove such a thing and its all based on speculations.”
That would include private revelations and miracles as well. Let’s not forget both happen to people of all faiths.
The people here in the commbox telling us that only a fool would ignore private revelation or even claiming that private revelation IS binding, well, I think we can surmise (with some degree of certainty) that it’s the Fatima crowd making those claims. I may be wrong about that, but it seems the only Catholics who flip out in such a pharisaical manner about private revelations are the Fatima crowd - and usually they’re all caught up in the controversy about whether or not the 3rd secret was revealed. My advice is to stay clear of that crowd.
As to holy cards, which the letter writer mentioned and no one here has addressed, I cannot imagine any reason why someone would lump them in with miraculous medals and revelations, etc. To me, they’re like carrying a photo of someone you love in your wallet or purse. And note that holy cards don’t just picture saints - many depict Christ and Mary. They are nice reminders to hang on bulletin boards, etc.
to the fellas that called into question about the validity of confirmed miracles that are necessary to become a saint really has no business being a Catholic - I don;t get it. The Catholic Church investigates medical miracles to a degree that you would find mind boggling if you bothered to read up on it. Do some homework read Miracle detective by randall sullivan.
Randall Sullivan’s the expert, yep, he’s the one. Everything he says is unquestionable.
This lady is right to be worried about add ons. If she keeps reading the bible she will find lots more to shake her faith in the CC
Confirmation so soon, Charlotte?
The catholic church SAYS lot of great swelling words….why cant it DO something about its offending priests?
Great response Mark, though I disagree with your take on Medjugorje.
I would like to sound a slightly discordant note to the tone of a number of ideas that are floating around in the discussion here, and the discordant note is from Pope Benedict XVI, who in his work prior to becoming Pope was very much involved in the study of “private revelations.” In the document entitled, The Message of Fatima, there is a section entitled “Theological Commentary.” It is here that the future Pope states an important aspect of the Church’s teaching on Tradition in relation to private revelation. He does this first and foremost by putting it in the context of the Council document Dei Verbum, No. 8. There we read (please note in particular what I have italicized): “For there is a growth in the understanding of the realities and the words which have been handed down. This happens through the contemplation and study made by believers, who treasure these things in their hearts, (cf. Lk 2:19, 51), through the intimate understanding of the spiritual things that they experience, and through the preaching of those who have received through Episcopal succession the sure gift of truth” In the same section, the Council further clarifies: “This tradition which comes from the apostles develops in the Church with the help of the Holy Spirit …. For as the centuries succeed on another, the Church constantly moves forward toward the fullness of divine truth until the words of God reach their complete fulfillment in her …. Thus God, who spoke of old uninterruptedly converses with the Bride of the beloved Son; and the Holy Spirit, through whom the living voice of the Gospel resounds in the Church, and through her, in the world, leads into all truth those who believe and makes the word of Christ dwell abundantly in them (cf. Col 3:16).” What is perhaps most striking is that the present Pope then went on to add the statement that “In this context it now becomes possible to understand rightly the concept of ‘private revelation’ which refers to all the visions and revelations which have taken place since the completion of the New Testament.” He adds that Jesus was referring also to private revelations when he said: “I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own authority … He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you” (Jn 16:12-14). The importance that the present Pope gave to private revelation would probably still be a surprise to many who interpret Tradition as merely regarding the statements of the magisterium and the consensus of Catholic thought over the ages. The idea that private revelation should be viewed in the context of Tradition has, however, in fact been the praxis of the Church, as is evident in the liturgical year. Thus, to name just a few, there is a feast of Our Lady of Lourdes, there is the solemn celebration of the Feast of the Sacred Heart, and most recently there has been the introduction of the Feast of Divine Mercy, which is part of the devotion which was spread by St. Faustina Kawalska. The Pope has expanded on the correct idea of Tradition in his talks on April 26, 2006 and May 3, 2006. To conclude (to be brief), people who are dismissive of private revelation as being something of little importance are certainly not in harmony with the views of the Pope, who has much more to say about it than I can mention here.
@James—————“people who are dismissive of private revelation as being something of little importance are certainly not in harmony with the views of the Pope.” Yet after it’s all been said and done. At the end of the day us tone deaf catholics or otherwise, are still in harmony with the teachings of the church in that it may be helpful to some it is not binding on us all. Personally I believe in private revelation. It has happened to my wife. How do I know it’s true? What was told her came true and and continues to be true to this day 26 years later. Consistantly. It certaintly does not encourage me to go out and buy into all the others who speak for Jesus/Mary daily in their press releases. Nor to the ones who go to heaven daily. The bad ones spoil it for most of the others, except the ones that happen to me.
Just wondering, and that is probably worth a individual discussion don’t you check with the people people quote through Facebook previous to posting its comments listed here? I have been completely friends having John about FB as well as saw the actual thread there, but My spouse and i wouldn’t have considered those people comments fair game for the public without choice. I is less inclined to write to any friend’s FACEBOOK OR TWITTER wall plainly thought an associate of a friend would move something semi-private in a public opinion. I’m trying to reserve the snarkiness regarding friends it will incite rage inside general society of Westport!
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The reason Mary or Jesus appear recently
(this century, which has more recorded apparitions than any other)
is to warn us to convert or face consequences.
It’s obvious that our generation is vastly more in need of repentance
than any prior: death culture, “watered down CCE”,
lack of respect for the Eucharist
(women on pill who receive, when the pill is AN ABORTIFACIENT,
immodest dress, for the most obvious grievances)
Fatima foretold of punishment from God in the form of war.
The many different apparitions these days have similar threads.
Some include: world war III, monetatary crash, world govt, US communism,
US revolution, the Warning, the Miracle, and the Chastisement.
Also, how to prepare for these by prayer, conversion, holy medals and water, food preparation, and signs to watch for.
The only reason some apparitions are not approved
is that the bishops DO NOT EVEN INVESTIGATE them.
If the world is on the verge of Apocolypse,
according to heaven,
it’s a grave omission to keep such info from the population on earth.
Let’s pray for them.
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