Our Roman Catholic Diocese offers the Tridentine Mass to anyone who wishes to attend it every Sunday at 12:30PM - in our Cathedral Chapel.  If a particular parish would have enough people who wanted it, I’m sure our Bishop would also approve it for that parish, as well.

Isn’t it amazing that while Rome castigates the Society of Pius X for clinging to tradition, the German hierarchy continually tries to foist heresy, not only upon themselves, but the whole Church, and Rome does nothing.

I don’t know what to “think” about Pope Francis…. But one thing I do know is that we must PRAY for the Pope and for JESUS’ Church—that He promised to be “with—until the end of time.”

Pope Francis and Priests association total silence in May on Homosexual so called marriage vote in Ireland and Francis appointment of Radcliffe apostate homosexual so called priest leaves one with the impression that Francis like Marx, Kasper have little if any clue as to the teachings of the Catholic faith on marriage or communion for that matter.

Margaret, before I [posted my “Comment,” I Googled: “List of Popes” and New Advent brought up the entire list of 266 valid Popes, as well as the “anti-Popes.”  The word “anti-Pope was (is used) but I do think many, if not most of the “anti-popes” were also “heretical.”  The definition of “heretic” is “One who obstinately denies a truth which must be believed with divine and Catholic faith.” (At the least, that’s what an anti-Pope does with regard to the election of the Successor of “Peter.”  For example:  The 204th Pope Innocent VII (1404-06) was opposed by the anti-Popes, Pedro de Luna (“Benedict XIII”) (1394-1417) and Baldassare Cossa (“John XXIII”)(1400-1415).  Catholics believe Jesus established the Papacy when He said: “You are Peter and on this rock I will build my Church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against her.”  After Peter died the Apostles elected the next Pope, Linus, and so on, the succession has continued—despite a comparatively few “anti-popes.” 

Theresa H., Could you please name the popes who have been heretical? We have had morally bad popes for sure, but heretical? I don’t remember any from my readings in church history. Thank you.

Who said: “The Church will become very small”?  Over the centuries, we have even had heretical Popes.  At this moment in the Church all is NOT “bright,” but Jesus will never fail in HIS PROMISE TO BE WITH HIS CHURCH:  “Lo, I am with you all days—even to the end of time….”

I was once told the church thinks in terms of centuries,not months or days in dealing with error. This may have made sense at one time,but with the wide spread use of mass media, heresy can spread worldwide in a matter of hours. This is like an aggressive disease that needs to be dealt with aggressively. Otherwise, it could harm the body. This would not be compassionate or moral.

Apology accepted. Yes, I am aware that Cardinal Kasper and his supporters are suggesting that, and I was trying to put forth why I think they have ended up taking that route.  I’ll paste and try to clarify some of what I wrote in my original post on the subject:
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“. . . That is not to say that because some are “working the system” that we should open Communion to everyone and anyone [this would only add to our embarrassment].  I’m saying we need a more thoughtful, judicious way to execute the teachings of Christ [not change them], and that we should attempt to remedy injustices [of recklessly granting petitions to the wealthy, famous and savvy] and [the] suffering [which that obvious partiality causes in those who witness it and are affected by the matter in their own lives] inasmuch as it is in our power to do so.  The issue, I think, for compassionate clergy, has been that they see these things and feel that those who, for whatever reason, cannot speak for themselves, are not well represented or served by the Church, and so the clarity of the issue has become very muddled . . . [and so the issue has mistakenly, or in some cases wrongheadedly, become the teaching itself instead of the judicious application of the teaching of Christ]. . .”
That is what I mean when I say we are failing in a practical sense.  We are failing to apply Christ’s teaching in true love and justice for all, and we are creating a great stumbling block, an impediment to others because of it.  I know we’re never going to be perfect.  But I think perfection in how to apply it should be the goal nonetheless.  Again, I am not suggesting applying for the poor more of the mental and moral gymnastics and rationalizing that we have already been wrongfully applying for the wealthy, famous, and savvy.  I am saying we need to stop the inconsistencies and injudicious application the teachings of Christ.  That is at least a first step toward holiness in the matter. 

Let’s pray Pope Francis uses the synod to get sheep and shepherds back into the fold.  We must listen, lest we become prey to the ravening lion.  Unfortunately, the world , the flesh, and the devil will win many.  But compromise is the path to defeat.  And the Church is called to be faithful, not success.  Success is in God’s hands.

You seemed to allude to that course, Debbie. If I misunderstood, I apologize.
Nevertheless, critical individuals in high and influential places are suggesting that, and they need to abandon that perspective and get to the self-examination and the institutional analysis that is desperately required.

“So, instead of changing a well crafted legislation for this process, follow the process. You don’t change the spead limit just to accommodate speaders.”
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No one made an argument that we should.

So, instead of changing a well crafted legislation for this process, follow the process. You don’t change the spead limit just to accommodate speaders. The clerics and are unable to catechize because either they don’t know how, or they don’t believe. That is why I said “It might actually requite some kind of catechesis and end up alienating people (since most of them have never been catechized.) God forbid we require adults to be accountable.” Kasper and his crew wish to be unaccountable.

“How individual clerics and the layman who consult on the annulment implement the rubrics is what is at issue. . . . I have yet to hear for yet more accountability for those who implement the rubrics improperly. There is a solution, but it is far too challenging to actualize.”
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That is my point.  Practically speaking, it is broken.  And it may be challenging, but it shouldn’t discourage us from striving toward perfection and closer adherence to mirror what Christ would have us do.

Numbers don’t matter, fidelity to Christ does matter. I judge no one, nor would I being a fallen sinner. The thing is, WE SELF SELECT. Our Heavenly Father does not send us to Hell, we choose to go there. Christian life is a battle, there is no respite from it, interiorly or exteriorly. We error and miscalculate all the time. Get up, start over again. Its not about feelings. Its about lifting our hearts and minds to God even when we don’t feel a thing. Hey bro! Its worth it.
In Christ!

Hey bro, you want to put the Genie back in the bottle?  You’re going to have a much smaller church when you’re done.  Sounds like you’d relish the chance to decide who’s in or who’s out.

Even more destructive than the appearance of evil, is the promotion of evil, in direct contradiction to the admonitions of Jesus Christ. Marriage is a sacred covenant between two individual adults, man and woman. Not a romantic stab in the dark with a laugh track in the background. Nor a melodrama replete with angst and tears. The rubrics in place are remarkably coherent and just. How individual clerics and the layman who consult on the annulment implement the rubrics is what is at issue. I have yet to hear anyone call for a deeper and more coherent preparation for marriage for those seeking the sacrament. I have yet to hear for yet more accountability for those who implement the rubrics improperly. There is a solution, but it is far too challenging to actualize. It might actually requite some kind of catechesis and end up alienating people (since most of them have never been catechized.) God forbid we require adults to be accountable. And actually, why should we seek accountability for individuals who in all likelihood are about to enter a church building for one of the few more times in their life (given Pew Research). And why should we hold the members of a marriage tribunal more accountable than we do heterodox sisters, priests, bishops, cardinals and a pope. Is the horse already out of the stable?

In the practical sense, I think it is broken.  It is a cause of deep seated hurt feelings and a stumbling block for those who see and experience the kind of inconsistencies and inequities that I mentioned.  It has eroded respect for the Church and its authority and is a cause for some of the clamoring that I think we are hearing.  We are to avoid even the appearance of evil; and the things I mentioned are clearly more than the appearance of evil.

Ghosts of Luther challenging the Catholic church and much the same dangers, over react and guarantee a schism/conflict or letting it go and eroding the church’s authority.  As an evangelical, my church can decide its own approach but what do we know?

The Kennedys are a conundrum all to themselves.
If your second example is who I think it is I had the same questions.
I speculate that these are “primitive” examples of the “merciful” praxis under consideration, and that as such, might be significant evidence highlighting the need for a faithful application of the rubrics currently in place. Pope Benedict was very aware that a loose employment of the rubrics could be in place at times in the United States.
If it isn’t broken, use it.
It isn’t broken.

The issue of the divorced and civilly remarried has become complicated for the Church because it has never been carried out justly in practical terms.  What I mean is that there have been so many abuses by those who have influence or those who are more “politically savvy” in terms of how to get things done.  Do we truly believe that the prominent politicians and the wealthy who have been granted annulments throughout the years are really free to marry simply because they have been granted annulments by the Church?  Remember Sheila Rauch Kennedy and Joe Kennedy Jr.?  Kennedy was granted an annulment, originally, despite the fact that he and his wife had two children together.  This allowed him to marry Elizabeth Kelly, for reasons that later apparently became, “invalid,” in the eyes of the Church.  The Vatican, twelve years later, overturned that original annulment.  What a mess!  And if we think this is a rare thing, we’d better think again.  There is, even now, a prominent politician in our Church who has been married three times!  Two of his marriages have been annulled.  It has been well established that he cheated on his first two wives; and now he and his third wife, being prominent members of our faith, receive all the Sacraments.  He wasn’t Catholic at the time of his first two marriages.  So what! (I don’t remember Herod being Catholic when John the Baptist told him he was living in adultery!)  These are just two cases of the “famous.” How many annulments have been given for reasons that are not “just” in the eyes of God?  To leave things as they are is wrong.  That is not to say that because some are “working the system” that we should open Communion to everyone and anyone.  I’m saying we need a more thoughtful, judicious way to execute the teachings of Christ, and that we should attempt to remedy injustices and suffering inasmuch as it is in our power to do so.  The issue, I think, for compassionate clergy, has been that they see these things and feel that those who, for whatever reason, cannot speak for themselves, are not well represented or served by the Church, and so the clarity of the issue has become very muddled.  This is the real challenge before us all—to demonstrate true love and compassion, and equity for all.

Englishman Fr. Timothy Radcliffe, O.P., former Master General, has been appointed by Pope Bergoglio as a consultor for the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace. Timothy Radcliffe is an opponent of same-sex marriage. Don’t get too excited. The reason for his opposition, I am led to understand, is not the teaching of the Magisterium, but that “gay” people should not be forced to adopt heterosexual role models. If anyone can disabuse me of this understanding I am ready to be corrected.
How does a man proposing such an erroneous opinion qualify to consult on justice and peace? Radical error such as this is an affront to justice and peace. His appointment is an affront to common sense, let alone to orthodoxy.
Will the German bishops be corrected? I’m beginning to think Cardinal Marx will be the next occupant of the Chair of Peter.

It’s plain and simple—if they don’t allow divorced/remarried and homosexual employees, there won’t be enough “eligible” lay-people to work for the RCC.

If any Catholic politician who supported abortion rights was refused communion in their local church, we haven’t heard about it.

The first instance of a pro-choice politician being censured via denial of communion was in 1989.[15] During a special election for the California Senate, pro-choice Catholic Lucy Killea was barred from communion by Leo Thomas Maher, the bishop of San Diego. She received communion in Sacramento with the consent of Bishop Francis Quinn. The incident brought publicity to Killea’s candidacy and gained her the voters’ sympathy, helping her to win the election.

In 1984, Cardinal John Joseph O’Connor, then archbishop of New York, considered excommunicating New York Governor Mario Cuomo. He also condemned Cuomo’s statements that support for abortion rights did not contradict Catholic teaching, but did not suggest that Cuomo should stop receiving communion.

After Joe Biden, a pro-choice Catholic, was nominated as a vice presidential candidate in the 2008 presidential election, Bishop Joseph Francis Martino of Biden’s hometown of Scranton, Pennsylvania, said Biden would be refused communion in that diocese because of his support for abortion rights. Biden was not refused communion in his then-parish of Wilmington, Delaware.

The RCC does not have the Iron Grip it had on its clergy like it had in the past. More schisms will happen when groups realize that censure from the Church doesn’t mean a damn.

I believe Pope Francis will wait for the “Synod on the Family” this Fall…. When the “results are in” from the Synod, he will address the matter of the German Bishops, as need be….Until then (and ever after), our duty is to pray for the Pope and the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church, trusting in Jesus’ Promise to be with His Church “until the end of time.”

Well, it’s not just “dissent” we are talking about.  These German Bishops are in schism, pure and simple.  There must be no mincing of words here.  A schismatic tendency has been apparent for quite some time, and not only in Germany.  It will of course continue until the Holy Father speaks forthrightly, powerfully, clearly and finally on these matters.  Papal dithering has never led to good results: Leo X’s dithering during the Reformation proved that quite nicely.

If the Pope does finally clear the air, and if the German Bishops (or some of them) continue in their schism then that’s too bad.  They will cut themselves off from the tree and wither and die in due course.  On the other hand clear and final teaching from Rome will have the effect of bringing some of them back to their senses.

Larry, believe me, if Pope Francis proves my worst fears wrong I will do public penance and then dance in the streets. I have never hoped to be wrong like this in my life. Until that moment hopefully presents itself, HE IS THE BOSS. His undone actions, his unspoken words shreek all that is fearsome. His actions, his spoken words, scream either utter confusion or heresy. The man has got to wake up, resign, or become a new age presbyterian. Maybe he has jumped the Alps already.

On Pewsitter.com there is a very good commentary written by Steve Skojec on the video by Father Clovis. Steve also, in his commentary on the video, breaks it down into salient bullet points.  The Francis Effect video is contained within his commentary.

The video by Father Linus Clovis can also be accessed by going to the blog ‘The Radical Catholic’.  On the homepage of that blog is a column on the right listing their favorite blogs.  One of their favorites is ‘From Rome’.  If you go to ‘From Rome’ the link for gloria.tv with The Francis Effect video will be there.

I believe the link is ‘http://gloria.tv/media/CG5Dyd1WWLg’ but if it doesn’t work, (it looks like it is case sensitive) just do a search on gloria.tv for ‘Fr. Linus Clovis’ and look for the video for ‘The Francis Effect’.

The Fr. Linus Clovis link isn’t connecting with anything. Are you sure you copied it correctly?

Edward: this is a small thing to be sure, but important especially because you write things for the public.  Please, please, look up what “begs the question” means and cease using it improperly.  Seriously: people think Catholics are idiots already.
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Oh yes, what an egregious error. I’ve changed it. Thanks for pointing it out. EP

In reference to the posts I mentioned in my last comment, I meant James and Theresa H.Thanks for your insights, both of you.

Father Linus Clovis, an African priest spoke on May 8, 2015 at a Pro-life Seminar in Rome Italy.  His talk is entitled ‘The Francis Effect’  I am reminded of what I read both from Deitrich von Hildebrand and from St.Thomas Aquinas.  Both said that our obedience is to the fullness of the Catholic Faith, and that when any prelate teaches other than that which has been handed down from the Apostles, he loses his authority.  In his talk Father Linus succinctly outlines the errors implicit in Pontificate of the present Bishop of Rome.The link where I found this video (about 31 minutes) is from:  http://gloria.tv/media/CG5DydiwwLg
  I also found this link on the blog ‘From Rome’.  I linked ‘From Rome’ from the favorites on the blog ‘The Radical Catholic’.  Evidently this orthodox priest has enough proof to speak so clearly and bluntly.  He gives us the path to follow to remain faithful to the fullness of the Faith.  Both James and Jennifer are on target with their posts.  Thank you for them.

“To become reactive, angry, and insulting when an ugly truth is stated, is to attach oneself to obtuse and blind denial of reality.” If anyone is becoming “reactive, angry and insulting when an ugly truth is stated,” it is you, Barbara—not anyone else on this thread. And James—there is certainly “unquestionable maleficence” going on—but not necessarily by the pope.

There can be no doubt that prayer is absolutely essential. Without question it is the penultimate weapon against this mendacity. It makes way for the Holy Spirit to act over and above our feeble perceptions, whether they prove accurate or not. However, silence in the face of unquestionable maleficence is wrong. Unless the perpetrators of this arrogant ongoing disregard for the Magisterium are called out they will pursue their objectives without shame, indeed, with baneful pride. Regard for five decades the foul displays of sister’s communities, journalistic venues such as NCReporter, Catholic universities, belligerent bishops and priests. Unless they and their spawn are held accountable they will not relent. All through the charitable pontificate of St. John Paul they couched in waiting. They cruelly undermined and trampled Pope Benedict. They are in full gear and rely on those who object to their program to be obediently silent. They regard individuals who object to their goals as naïve, ignorant groundlings at best. The stench of their hubris is unbearable.

The Church is, indeed, living in troubling times—in a “secular culture” that is very imposing….We must not let ourselves be upset about the matters of concern (even of some errant ideas of a very few Bishops….)that will be brought up at the “Synod of Bishops.”  We must, rather, PRAY that ALL the problems confronting modern Families will be addressed under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. That we will all be “confirmed” in the Faith that goes back to the beginning—WHEN GOD CREATED ADAM AND EVE, “male and female” and commanded them to “increase and multiply!”(Gen. 1:26-3:23)  Again, now, as well as throughout the Synod, OUR TASK IS TO “PRAY WITHOUT CEASING” THAT THE BISHOPS WILL SEEK THE HOLY SPIRIT—AND THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL ENLIGHTEN AND GUIDE THEM INTO “ALL TRUTH” REGARDING “THE FAMILY!” No doubt, the Bible reminds us that not all in our families is necessarily “glorious” since the FALL—This is why our Families NEED the Lord Jesus, our SAVIOR!  One thing I PRAY in regard to the Synod is that THE BISHOPS WILL ENCOURAGE ALL FAMILIES TO PRAY TOGETHER IN THE HOME, AS WELL AS AT CHURCH!  (REMEMBER FR. PEYTON….: “THE FAMILY THAT PRAYS TOGETHER STAYS TOGETHER.” )

The comment below this one by James is giving more obvious evidence of whom and what is occupying the Chair of Peter at the present time.  To conclude that ‘we still need more proof’ is denial of the reality before us.  To become reactive, angry, and insulting when an ugly truth is stated, is to attach oneself to obtuse and blind denial of reality.  The facts speak for themselves.

More interesting material about Archbishop Victor Manuel Fernandez, one of the Holy Father’s preferred theologians at http://pewsitter.com/page_1.html . The Archbishop appears to be an Argentine clone of the Teutonic heresy as well as a scholar of the art of kissing. Are we witnessing some kind of ecclesiastical hissy fit more suited for The National Catholic Reporter and its ilk, now more tactically emanating from Rome? What exactly is going on here? Am I to believe that this is the caliber of scholarship the Pope finds suitable for the exposition of Roman Catholic theological reflection? What does this say about Pope Bergoglio’s orthodoxy, let alone his practical judgement? Beyond the theological and ecclesiastical concerns, there is a real question as to whether this man has the stability required for the Chair he holds.

Larry, I feel your struggle and understand where you’re coming from. Not as well spoken as you though. So I’ll simply say, I don’t place my trust in men, for they will fail every time. I trust Christ is trustworthy and that it is His Church, and so whatever any sinful man, even if he be the pope, may do to Her, we’ll survive because Christ promised it. I also think that the media has done a really big number in putting forth a false image of Pope Francis. (I think the term is “Wagging the Dog.”) And I think when the Synod is over, the media gig will be up. I also think the impatience we saw him show towards greedy bishops vs. his patience towards the German bishops is because greed is a cut and dry issue. Whereas, false mercy on the part of the German bishops is not so cut and dry. Thus the two different responses/ approaches. Francis is pastoral. I think he wants the Germans to feel they’ve been heard and every effort has been made to reach out to the periphery people that both he and them seek. But no where in listening to him speak do I get the impression he’s willing to ditch doctrine to pastorally dish out mercy. But even if he does, I’m sure it can be undone. We had several popes at one time. How’d we survive that? Surly we can survive this. Our faith is not built on doctrine. It’s built on the Eucharist. It’s built on Christ. And if the Eucharist is truly what we believe it is today. It will truly be that tomorrow as well. Peace be with all of you.

@Barbara Jensen:  Barbara, framing things the way you see Larry sees them is simply how you see the way Larry sees them.  I have not interpreted him to be puzzled “unto deceit.”  Perhaps, rather, he takes seriously, and lives the way spoken of by St Paul in 1Co 13:  Love is patient, love is kind. . . it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.  Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.  In other words, he is hoping for the best in our leaders.  He has given the benefit of the doubt, even in dubious circumstances.  He may see things that look dark or discouraging, but he still hopes for the best and will not accuse outright of the worst until there is proof.  You might look to that example for good.  May the Lord bless you and help you.

“One way of denying the reality that is before your eyes is to keep looking for ‘proof’.” Oh, really? I thought it was an excellent way to avoid rash judgment. For society’s sake, I hope you’re never called for jury duty.

One way of denying the reality that is before your eyes is to keep looking for ‘proof’.  To stay ‘puzzled’ way beyond the obvious is to deceive oneself.  This situation could not be clearer.  The answer is prayer.  Pedantic ramblings don’t help one bit.

Thank you, Larry, for stating it all so clearly. Where are the answers? There has to be one honest man to start putting the reality that is presently engaged clearly on the table. They are loosing credibility with what is left of the remnant.

“They are pushing an agenda simply because they believe they can get away with it.  The question is why do they think they can get away with it?” Indeed, that is THE question! It is increasingly bothering me, too. The only reasonable answer is that they believe, rightly or wrongly, that the pope is on their side. But if they are wrong in that belief, why does the Holy Father not disabuse them, in no uncertain terms, of the misconception that they “can get away with it”? He cannot be unaware that they THINK he is egging them on—that is not possible, unless the pope is severely demented. From this we MUST conclude that the pope, for whatever reasons, has decided NOT to correct them—to allow them to gallop right along, full of encouragement. In addition, Mr. Pentin’s columns of recent months have hinted more ominously that the pope may be, not just tacitly, but ACTIVELY encouraging them behind the scenes as well as actively (though non-publicly) DIS-couraging the doctrinal loyalists from feeling the same confidence. Admittedly, we don’t know why—but the WHY is now taking on far greater urgency. Why is there so much ambiguity from Francis? Why do we keep getting the feeling that hidden agendas are in motion? Why all the unseemly grandstanding and hotdogging which have served to bring Francis immense popularity with unbelievers—but which have not moved them towards belief? It pains me to have to say that I think the debate now centers on whether Francis is misfeasant or malfeasant—not whether he is doing a commendable job leading the Church, because with me at least, the latter can no longer be convincingly argued. It also bothers me greatly that although we do not yet have proof of malfeasance (as opposed to misfeasance), the former is not quite as far-fetched as it once seemed. Holy Father—what is your answer?

Cardinal Marx and others like him are those who have been awaiting an opportune time to introduce what they think will now be accepted in the Church.  They are pushing an agenda simply because they believe they can get away with it.  The question is why do they think they can get away with it?  The acceptance of sin as mercy is, in actuality, a perversion of mercy and of the gospel; and it needs to be strongly repudiated by our pope.  The pontiff had no problem calling into account German bishop, Franz-Peter Tebartz-van Elst, for what he considered financial excess in restoration of a residence, and other like matters.  But what constitutes sin and how to treat those whose lives are broken by it is far more encompassing a matter and affects more lives in the Church, and those to whom she bears witness in a far more serious a way than the building of too large an estate by any lone Bishop.  I am referring specifically to the Bishop’s most stridently contrary desire to see:  “the positive aspects of homosexual relationships and same-sex unions be recognized,”  and the remarkable statement, “We cannot wait for a synod to tell us how we must shape the pastoral care of marriage and the family.  Those two statements, if taken together, are alarming.  It sounds as if these bishops ever had their way, we would all be sitting in our pews someday being lectured about how self-righteous we are for not being “merciful to the broken.”  But mercy to the broken (and I include myself as being broken by sin) is the putting away of sin, the rejection of Satan and evil, and the putting on of holiness.  It is self-denial which, paradoxically, leads to truest fulfillment, joy, satisfaction, and everlasting life with God—who is the only One who can ever satisfy all of the longings of the human heart!  That is true mercy!  That is loving sinners—not peddling the cheap, paltry, self-serving ways of the flesh that lead to a shriveled up life of self-absorption, misery and death!  Do we believe this reality?  Do we know that we know that true, lasting life is in Christ Jesus our Lord alone?  The world is listening and waiting.  And what we say and do—or do not say and do—will be our true witness to all!

I urge all to read the comments of Archbishop Victor Manuel Fernandez, a significant voice in the clique that Pope Francis has chosen to surround him. Remember hearing “…you can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep.” Weep. Here is a real eyeful. http://mirrorofjustice.blogs.com/mirrorofjustice/2015/05/he-knows-very-well-what-he-is-doing.html

Again, Jesus tells us we “do not know the day or the hour when the ‘Son of Man’ will come.” (Mk 13:42) He also put the following question to those gathered around Him one day: “When the Son of Man comes, do you think He will find faith on the earth?” (Lk 18:8) Looking back over a lifetime…., not to mention “20+ Centuries AD” and the ever-growing secularism sweeping through even the Church, one can’t help but wonder about Jesus’ “Second Coming.” Long, long ago, St. John echoed the words of the disciples during the time of the early Church: “Amen! Come Lord Jesus!”  Surely, we are much closer to it than were the apostles!

“Larry, I am so sorry that you can jump to such an unfortunate judgment of my character without even knowing me.” By their fruits, you shall know them. “It is not my job to satisfy your unreasonable research requests.” Translate that: “stop calling me out on my lies.” “We do not need to debate this.  Let it go.” When you stop with the phony quotes and manufactured “evidence,” I will.

Larry, I am so sorry that you can jump to such an unfortunate judgment of my character without even knowing me.  To assume that I have no interest in truth based on these conversations is remarkable, and to spread your rash judgment of me as fact to others is deplorable. It is to do the very thing you are accusing me of doing. In one fell swoop in your last comment you have cast doubt on me, on Malachi Martin, and whole groups of loyal Catholics.  That you consider me a ‘fear-monger’ is telling. I am evidently getting under your skin and it is getting harder for you to keep your head in the sand.  As I said earlier, it is not my job to satisfy your unreasonable research requests.  Things are unfolding. We do not need to debate this.  Let it go.

There is much of the sensational and highly controversial regarding Father Malachi Martin’s life and opinions. This is not the time or place to go into either. Suffice to say that anything connected with him should be viewed with—not necessarily disbelief, but certainly extreme caution. As for your call-in talk show—you’d be laughed out of any newsroom with ridiculous so-called evidence like that—and not just by liberal editors, either, but, I would conjecture also, by those of the Washington Times, The Wanderer or this publication. As for Cardinal Mario Ciappi’s alleged claim—the problem here is that our “Professor Baumgartner of Salzburg” is the only human being who can verify that Ciappi actually said what you claim, and as far as I can determine, this man or woman doesn’t exist outside of these blog pages. Where is this supposed letter? How did it become public? What else does it say besides this one quote? Has anyone seen a photocopy? But I guess, Barbara, you’re only interested in regurgitating sensational and tendentious propaganda from the schismatic and sedevacantist crowd, without ever once asking yourself if these people might be lying to you. Obviously, you care nothing for the truth—especially if it gets in the way of a good scare story—so I’m wasting my time talking at you about the obligation of being sure of one’s “facts” before spreading them all over the world. I would just say to everyone else posting here—folks: don’t believe a word Barbara Jensen says from now on. She’s nothing but a fear-monger who can’t be bothered to check her “facts.”

Larry, you have answered your own question regarding the origin of the Cardinal Ciappi statement about the Fatima third secret.  It is not my job to convince you more thoroughly.  If it is troubling to you, just disregard it.  My source is Christopher Ferrara, of The Remnant website.  I just watched an hour youtube presentation that he gave on the third secret of Fatima and he clearly proves that the whole secret has not been revealed.  Mr. Ferrara is a credible person and he too referenced Cardinal Ciappi among others in his presentation.
  I have an even more critical piece of information for you.  On an Art Bell radio presentation from 1998 (I think) Art had as a guest Malachi Martin, a former Jesuit and a fully-functioning Catholic priest, who stated that he had read the whole third secret when he was working at the Vatican assisting Cardinal Bea. Cardianl Bea was part of a company of prelates assisting Pope John XX111 in the early sixties.  On the show, which was a ‘call in’ show, Malachi explained that he was under obligation not to reveal what the third secret said and that he would not reveal it, but if someone called in the show and reported something which was in the secret, he would not deny the truth of what was said.  Well, in the program a young gentleman (I think from Iowa, but I am not sure) called in and said that an old priest he knew claimed to have read the third secret and the old priest said that in it, Our Blessed Mother said that at the time of the great apostasy in the Church the ‘pope would be under the influence of the devil’.  Malachi Martin responded that ‘It sounds as if that priest has read at least part of the third secret’.  Here is someone who has read the third secret and is a credible witness saying that on a radio show that has been taped.
  Larry, it is not my job to convince you of anything, nor to research extensively as if I were presenting evidence in a court trial.  Take the information or leave it.  The point is, and the reason I share it, is to alert those willing to open their eyes to the critical situation in the Church.  Something is very wrong.  The German Bishops are in error—in fact they are de facto in schism—but rest assured they will not be confronted by the Bishop of Rome.  He is not upholding the Faith, in fact, the evidence indicates he is part of the dissenters from the Church.  (Don’t ask me for proof, it is all around you.)  It is the Bergoglio supporters who caused the underhanded activity and the outrageous heretical conversations at the first part of the so-called synod.

More specifically to Brian’s point, though it has been dealt with earlier in this thread, there will be no response to the outrageous behavior of the German hierarchy because allowing these cannibalistic pests to undermine the structure is the means to achieve an end. The end is the eradication of Christ’s Church, the Roman Catholic Church. By ignoring the collapsing structures, and appealing to some chimera of a new order emerging in line with the pure constitution of an idea of the “early church,” they mask their agenda. These individuals, male and female, presently holding reigns of any significance within Roman Catholicism, allow the decay to continue for their own personal gratification, knowing they will be well taken care of until they meet their deaths, for the ultimate collapse which will happen when they no longer walk among us. Protestantism, but for evangelicals, is nonexistent. The evangelical’s moment in the sunlight is fast evaporating as well. Roman Catholicism, to the extent it follows the protestant model, will find its termination as well – but for the Grace of Jesus Christ. And Grace will triumph, but not by the means employed at this historical moment, but despite them. One need only reflect on the catastrophe of the past fifty years to see.

“....Whoever receives one such child in my name receives me: but whoever causes one of these little ones who believes in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea….Woe to the man by whom temptation comes!” ((Mt 18: 5-7) Jesus had these (and other) strong words for us—when “the shoe fits.”  St. Paul, also, wrote clearly: “Do not be deceived, neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals….will inherit the kingdom of God.” (1Cor 6:9-10)  Cardinal Kasper is openly affirming a lifestyle that is clearly denounced in the Bible.

There you go again, Barb. That quote you pass along from Cardinal Mario Ciappi is found on dozens and dozens of websites, but they all say that he wrote something like that (the exact wording varies) in a private letter to “a Professor Baumgartner in Salzburg.” Not one of them gives Baumgartner’s full name, specialty or institution—and in fact an Internet search fails to shed any light on this man’s identity. I’d say that makes the “information” highly suspect. Can you identity Baumgartner for us—name, rank, serial number, Barbara?

Pope Francis has been fairly aggressive, if not plainly rude, in implementing his program. This is plain to see for those who do not find comfort in the wake of his unrelenting verbal spill. What is required is not feigned charisma and media driven celebrity, but fearless support of the Magisterium, without aide of the Bergoglian sieve. Coochy-coo pandering gimmicks (even offered under the guise of “pastoral theology”) are no substitute for Christ-like shepherding.

Quite a few of the commenters are talking about information not even referenced in the article.  Let’s get back on topic.  This article is about the acts of the German Bishops, not the Bishop of Rome.  Yes Edward is again pique the Vatican, but is it done to be controversial or to improve the Church through teaching what the Church teaches. Clearly some education is needed.  Christ choose the Apostles to make disciples of all languages and nations.  He did not choose them, nor any successors, to be kings and rulers over the nations and people.  They were to “teach” Christ’s commandments. They, as we, are to be servants to each other. God, in his love, allows us all free will to say “yes” and follow the teaching of our Lord, Jesus Christ. Or to not follow and instead setup our own little kingdoms and rules of how to love one another, which normally leads to eternal failing. All power and dominion was given to Christ, and it will last forever until the coming of the end of the age. Do not many laity in the Church already pick and choose which teaching of Christ they want to follow, while facing the results of bad choices they still make them because we are imperfect and fallen people of God.  Do we think a Cardinal or Bishop is not human and possible of sin (the unrepentant attachment to goods)? Do we think a deacon or priest has lost graces of ordination simply because they have failed to be perfect in words spoken?  Yes, they might have that spoken word reflected on final judgement day and it’s result then known, but do we have a right to judge them?  Christ said, judgement and revenge are reserved to him alone. Whereas we are to love, to teach the truth, to bear the humiliation, the persecution, the sorrow, the cross for teaching his name and love. I know that Christ loves me where I am, and wishes for me to be his disciple.  I strive to follow Christs teachings. I’m a disciple of Christ in the Roman rite of the Catholic Church.  I don’t forget that God is my creator, while remembering that, as Pope Francis recently taught in homilies, the family and marriage are the building blocks of society and must take precedence in our support, our preferences, and our prayers.  But my knowledge is to be shared with others and then they make their free will choice.  If Pope Francis acts to correct a brother Bishop, I don’t think we will ever hear of when, how, or what was done, because that is not how Christ taught us to love, or how Saint Paul taught us to love and correct our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.  The rest is nothing, if one is to have accolades and gain the whole world, but does not love, they have nothing.  Let us not let our unjust righteousness be envious or judgmental to those in (repetitive) sin, instead let us have our action be one of prayer for them to realize their choice, and when we are directly involved to send a loving note of encouragement to return to the arms of Christ and repent of the sinful act.  We don’t win by demanding someone do something, as if we are the king or queen.  We isn’t the focus, Christ is the focus.  So we need to act as Christ taught, with love, compassion, patience, and joy.

According to the Catholic Catechism, an apostate it one who repudiates the Catholic Faith.  This is what Cardinal Ciappi, the chaplain to three popes (who had read the complete third secret of Fatima)  meant when he said ‘The third secret of Fatima is about ‘an apostasy unfolding within the Church which will begin at the top’.  We are watching the unfolding of this prophecy.  It is clear for all those who want to see.

An apostate is one who has been Baptized Catholic but denies that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage.

http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/are-the-german-catholic-bishops-forcing-a-schism/comment-page-3/#comment-7438098

We will spare ourselves a lot of “grief” if we keep in mind (and remind others, as well) that not every word a Pope speaks is infallible teaching. (This has always been the case; it is nothing new!) In fact, comparatively little a Pope says is “infallible!”—In other words, only when He officially proclaims a teaching “infallible,” OR when He iterates teaching that has already been proclaimed “infallible” is it, in fact, “infallible!” No doubt about it, we have not seen in our time a Pope who comes anywhere near what we are seeing in Pope Francis!  In so many words, Pope Francis has said that he likes to be around people and talk with people….(He went back to live in the Domus Sancte Marthae so as to be near Pope-Emeritus Benedict!) Again, as far as what Pope Francis says, we must keep focused on what He gives us in Papal Addresses and other official Teaching/Documents! The same goes for all the “talk” going around re. the “SYNOD ON THE FAMILY” that will take place this coming Fall.  No matter the “talk” going around, there is no official teaching coming out of the Synod yet, because the Synod has not taken place, yet!!!  What we are called to do these days, is to PRAY,PRAY,PRAY for all the Cardinals and Bishops who will be attending the Synod and for Pope Francis!

“Yes, Scalfari is a poor judge of orthodoxy, so why does Francis keep having interviews with him?  And when Scalfari misinterprets Francis, why doe not the Vatican correct him?” Excellent questions. If he ever phones me, I’d like to ask him. “I do think that the present pontiff fulfills very well the definition of an apostate.” As long as you say it’s what you “think.” “The pontif has no problem with the confusion and distortion he is causing.” Apparently not, and at the very least this is culpably irresponsible. “He is the Pope and he is responsible for all the destruction his imprudence, arrogance and falsed beliefs are causing.” He is responsible indeed. “False beliefs”? I’m not sure his beliefs are all that clear. Certainly his motives are not. “Imprudence”? Absolutely. “Arrogance”? Arguably true. “We do not need to argue about this.” Maybe not, but we DO need to be very careful how we wield quotation marks. They are dangerous weapons, especially in the wrong hands.

Yes, Scalfari is a poor judge of orthodoxy, so why does Francis keep having interviews with him?  And when Scalfari misinterprets Francis, why doe not the Vatican correct him? The pontif has no problem with the confusion and distortion he is causing.  I do think that the present pontiff fulfills very well the definition of an apostate.  Kasper,according to Bergoglio is doing serene theology on his knees.  Kasper is actually a heretic.  the Bishop of Rome is not uphoding the true Faith as Christ has given it to us, and that makes him a traitor to the church Christ founded.  He is the Pope and he is responsible for all the destruction his imprudence, arrogance and falsed beliefs are causing.  Read the comment by James above which says so well what I am trying to communicate to you.  We do not need to argue about this. Look at the reality that is unfolding before our eyes.  By the fruits the tree is known.

The source of the “paraphrase” we are wrestling with is almost certainly the interview with America Magazine in August 2013. The interview was published in sixteen other journals simultaneously—I believe they were all Jesuit publications. Others use phrases as they will, for their purposes. At the very least the Vatican has encouraged this kind of misinformation by mismanagement. It is reasonable to think that Pope Francis doesn’t take advice from seasoned communications professionals on how to avoid this, while previous pontificates have strictly guarded all statements, with good reason, as we now see. Given the cheap celebrity culture the Vatican has embraced with gusto, it is not going to end soon. Compounding this general state of confusion is a plethora of telephone calls, off the cuff remarks, “interviews” with Eugenio Scalfari and other dubious individuals. Pope Francis enforces the confusion by behavior, an ecclesial posture (note, I do not say “theological” posture), a contrarian comportment which substitutes for intellect, a feigned piety that veils a protestant perspective. Nevertheless, Larry is right to call us to account. Cardinal Pell was very poorly served on the internet over the weekend by a deliberate and perverse misinterpretation of something he said, which in its context was quite true, but has been manipulated to appear to mean something else. This was an injustice. But I knew, by knowing what I know of him, that his statement was being misused. To the contrary, the Pope Francis package that we have come to know all too well since March 2013, announces loudly “emergency!” The train is off the track, the plane is losing altitude, and the tremors under your feet are not in your imagination.

Barbara: Eugenio Scalfari’s reputation is in question due to the fact that he neither taped his interview nor took notes—but instead reconstructed long passages from memory. Apparently that is his custom—and unless one is an autistic savant, it is reckless and unprofessional. If you had been following—even loosely—these events in the press, you would have known about all this. You say, “In 2013 I did not anticipate that I would have to have at my beck and call everything I have read about Francis so that those who are unable to face the reality that we have an apostate leading the Church would be helped to let go of their denial of facts.” First of all, Francis being “an apostate” is not “the reality”—it is your opinion of the reality, and one not well-founded. An “apostate” is a traitor to the Catholic faith. It describes one who has abandoned the faith. There is much that is deeply concerning about his conduct of his office. There is much about his statements and actions that inspires legitimate concern about his motives and competence. But there is no proof that he is an apostate. Secondly, you certainly SHOULD have anticipated being called upon to back up such an incendiary quote. Why wouldn’t any of us have to?

Barbara Jensen, sometimes reporters (news articles) get it right, other times they make errors, and sometimes they have a personal agenda and get it wrong because they want to.
.
We all have an obligation to check things out before repeating them.
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Everyone will agree that there are some things this Pope says that are strange or confusing.  But we still must verify for accuracy before repeating.
____________________________________________

I too have waded through reams of news articles trying to find from where this quote that I quoted originated.  I cannot find it.  However,at the time that I read it (summer of 2013), (and it was from a news article, not a personal blogger), I moved from confusion about the present Bishop of Rome to understanding that the man is no friend of Christ’s Church.  I have LOVED every pope I have known, starting with Pope Pius X11.  Bergoglio is different.  In plowing through reams of news articles to locate the quote that has been challenged, I can see where a news person could summarize and make a concluding statement such as I quoted.  In 2013 I did not anticipate that I would have to have at my beck and call everything I have read about Francis so that those who are unable to face the reality that we have an apostate leading the Church would be helped to let go of their denial of facts.  Here’s a more recent quote.  It is from the last Scalfari interview.  Francis says that those who die rejecting Christ will have their souls ‘extinguished’.  Look that up.  If Scalfari is misinterpreting what Francis said, why has not the Vatican said so?
  Raul Castro,, diabolical dictator that he is, might become a Catholic due to his impressions of Francis.  That is so nice.  Add this to Bergoglio’s bedding up with the U N ‘sustainable development goals’ and you will see just how much the present pontiff is leading the charge for the global agenda and denying Christ’s Church.  He is the willing tool of the enemies of Chirst. He continually derides those who hold to the true doctrine of Catholicism.  Do you need me to quote something in particular about that, or can you open your eyes and see what he is doing?  The pope that you are defending has made it clear that he is not the one to judge others.  Well, take his role modelling and do not judge me as you have.  My Faith is everything to me and this apostate pope is destroying it.

You are correct Larry. Far too often people repeat what they see on ‘unofficial’ blog sites and by other posters without any regard for fact checking for the TRUTH.
- - - - -
CCC: ” 2477 Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury. He becomes guilty:
.
- of RASH JUDGEMENT who, even tacitly, assumes as true, without sufficient foundation, the moral fault of a neighbor;
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- of DETRACTION who, without objectively valid reason, discloses another’s faults and failings to persons who did not know them;

- of CALUMNEY who, by remarks contrary to the truth, harms the reputation of others and gives occasion for false judgments concerning them. “
- - - - -
Always ask for official documentation folks.  Don’t let people get away with errors and gossip.
___________________________________________

If nobody can find the ULTIMATE source of the “quote” (and I certainly couldn’t) then it HAS to be spurious. I found maybe half a dozen bloggers, each one of whom said something like: “In 2013, Pope Francis said: (etc).” Well, how do they KNOW he said it? Who conveyed it to THEM, and by what means? If Francis phoned each of them personally after his election and uttered the quote, then they should SAY that. Otherwise, there MUST be a news article or an official document which can (and should) be cited. The advent of the Internet has allowed anyone to be a journalist. That has its good and bad sides. The good side is that there are more sources of information now than just the mainstream media. The bad side is that an amateur journalist, like an amateur detective or doctor or plumber often doesn’t know what he’s doing. The biggest mistake the amateurs make is not knowing that there is a difference between journalism and rumor-mongering—that a good journalist (and there are bad ones in the mainstream media as well) is not just a Myna bird, mindlessly repeating what he has heard without wondering whether it could be true, without checking it out. It’s no defense to say that you heard it somewhere. It’s no defense to say the person you’re attacking is a bad guy—whether or not he actually is. If the pope really HAD said “the moral stands of the Church are compromising Her mission”—that’s a pretty devastating (not to say illogical) statement, since the “moral stands of the Church” ARE her mission in the first place! Such a statement would reveal him to be utterly unfit for his position—in fact a traitor to Christ, who said “go and TEACH…” Whatever you think of the pope—don’t try to convict on false evidence.

Well I did some research on this alleged comment of Pope Francis. All I could find was some comments he has made about how the ‘rules’ of the Church can basically compromise the mission of the Church to bring people to Christ. This was in his words of the encyclical of last year. I read this in ‘Evangelii gaudium’. Honestly, if that is all he said, he is right. Some people don’t like rules and they won’t come to Christ if they know they will have to change their lifestyle. This is just a logical statement. What the question is though is, is he stating that he wants to remove those ‘rules’ such as the words of Jesus Christ about marriage, in order to bring people to Christ. If he is, he isn’t bringing anyone to Christ because in order to be joined to Christ, we MUST obey the commandments of God. It appears the German Bishops are wanting to remove the commands of Jesus Christ for his followers.

Larry Northon, I agree that posters must take full responsibility for their own posts.
(Some people even take things out of context to change the meaning to suit themselves, or merely repeat what some other poster said.
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All posters must be prepared to give the “official”
Name of the Document,
page #, paragraph number,
and internet link.
__________________________________________

Read more: http://popeleo13.com/pope/2015/04/10/category-archive-message-board-305-outline-of-the-end-time/

These German Bishops and their friends in the Roman Curia are working in tandem. Dont be deceived. The whole Church - all of us - are headed for trying times as prophesied in the Bible.
It is the End-Time.
Folks, wake-up

James: I do not find the statement “The moral stands of the Church are compromising Her mission” anywhere in the graphs you cite. Barbara Jensen posted this alleged quote earlier on this thread and I would like her or anyone who can to cite an authoritative source complete with details of where, when, how, to whom, etc—or failing that, the “quote” needs to be labeled as spurious, calumnious and libelous—and Ms. Jensen (and anyone else who passes along this garbage) should be told to sacramentally confess the sin of having slandered the pope before receiving Communion again. I am not going to wade through reams and reams of 5,000-word articles and documents in search of this. Someone ELSE posted it—NOT me—and I am demanding that THEY put up or shut up. Propagating lies about anyone—much less the pope—is a serious matter and it’s NO defense to say you’re just repeating what everybody else told you.

How terribly sad to see the hierarchy of the Church in Germany separating from the teaching of Our Lord Jesus Christ guarded by His Church: “One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic” under “Peter” in Rome.  The whole world is watching….When the Son of Man comes, do you think He will find faith on the earth.  Pray to stand firm and be “faith-full until death.”  Jesus has very strong words for the Churches that fall away from His Divine Teaching. “What God has joined together let no man put asunder.” (Mt.19:1-9)

I make another stab at finding the qoute Larry cites ... not exact, but the sentiments are virtually identical… to be found in his interview with America Magazine in August 2013: Two paragraphs before the end of the section entitled “Church as Field Hospital” (remember that one?)
http://www.americamagazine.org/pope-interview

Will: I understand that St. Augustine spoke of the sacramentality of marriage in 401 AD.

Hey, Mariann~~
I was only passing along statistics.

But please don’t blame them-there’s good reason. I agree the facists and the commies probably alienated Germans from religion. Nazi leaders professed to be Catholic, and many Communist leaders were raised Catholic. Both sides claimed that god was on their side. After all the atrocities, it’s no wonder young Germans want to disassociate themselves from organized religion. They’re not “just following orders.”

@James -
I found your post helpful.  Today, you wrote, “From the decree of the First Vatican Council on Papal Infallibility: “The Holy Spirit was not given to the Roman Pontiffs so that they might disclose (patefacerent) new doctrine, but so that they might guard and set forth (exponerent) the Deposit of Faith handed down from the Apostles.”

*********************************************  THANK YOU FOR THAT REMINDER.

Also, as ANNE mentioned, the Bible (Holy Scripture) and the Deposit of Faith that was left to us by the apostles is what has eternal value and it is those on which we need to focus.

No “new doctrines” or new teachings regarding morals.  We were duly warned against heeding false teachers.  These Apostate German Churchmen are false teachers.

Marriage was never a sacrament until the 12th century.

Barbara Jensen posted the following on this thread on May 9 at 3:35 a.m.: “In 2013 it was the newly-elected Francis who said that ‘The moral stands of the Church are compromising Her mission.’” The quotation marks mean the statement is alleged to have come word-for-word from Francis—that this is not a paraphrasing or a summing-up of what someone believes Francis is thinking. Will Barbara Jensen please provide us with an authoritative source for this quote—NOT just a citing of numerous other bloggers, which we already know are repeating the quote without citing the source?

The german bishops angling for success (aka heresy) at the upcoming synod was the same thing the rhine group did in Vatican 2. Globalizing the modernist mess that infested the European church.

The church in Germany is deader than Julius Caesar. It has apostatized even if they lack the integrity to admit it.

Larry {10:28 am}
Cardinal Dolan actually said something along those lines. He stated that it is important to bring people to Christ first, and then worry about the difficult moral teaching later.

What shocked me about his statement was that he, a cardinal of the catholic church, finds the moral teachings of the church to be difficult to follow. And as we all know, he isn’t the only member of church leadership who thinks that way. And therein lies the crux of the problem that the church has faced, for all intensive purposes since Vatican 2. Whether it is the LCWR nuns, or the wayward religious orders, or members of the church hierarchy who are out for power and fame, etc.. they simply do not believe in the basic teachings of the church and/or do not believe that these teachings are essential to eternal salvation. That is reflected in their words and in their actions and then filters down throughout the entire church. The results are obvious.
The solution is a major clean out. We can talk about “a new springtime”, New Evagelization” etc…. but what the catholic church really needs is to place loyal catholics into the right positions and hand the apostates, heretics, outright hypocrites, posers, etc.. a one way ticket out the door.

A request for a citation by Larry is interesting and appropriate. I took a reasonable – admittedly short – amount of time attempting to find it – I remember reading of it when it happened – but I can’t find “it.” I did find at the Vatican site the full text of “Evangelii Guadium” (August 2013) – Chapter I, Section III are multiple allusions to the exact sentiment of the statement Larry cites. Given the dizzying verbiage emanating from Domus Sanctae Marthae, and a normal communications apparatus unable to cope with this man since March 2013, is it any wonder it can’t be determined where this “stuff” comes from. Remember World Youth Day in Rio…”make a mess.” The mess is here, no accident, of apocalyptic proportions, and we haven’t seen anything yet. Mess makes for effective camouflage for the Adversary. Get ready for the “really big show” coming up this July in South America, doing another transatlantic venue in September – right here in Obamaland, and returning to Rome for a “finale” of sorts with the geriatric Flying Santini Brothers doing their shtick under the big top for all of us to clean up. And even then, the task will need to be accomplished yet again.

Stephen,

A lot of stats that shouldn’t surprise one for Germans had Hitler (that Socialist democracy—what we have right now and if Hillary isn’t jailed) and Communism…both are devastating to souls.  Following all of that comes the sexual revolution…all about me and my desires vs. all about God and His desires.

God bless.

Thanks Edward Pentin…truly a thought provoking question, and one that may have already been on numerous minds.

Thanks to James for this, “From the decree of the First Vatican Council on Papal Infallibility: The Holy Spirit was not given to the Roman Pontiffs so that they might disclose (patefacerent) new doctrine, but so that they might guard and set forth (exponerent) the Deposit of Faith handed down from the Apostles.”

How many souls are being lost by those German Bishops (and elsewhere) that dissent so boldly and try to justify their dissent with survey results? 

Let’s pray and fast for a return to Truth and that no souls will be lost by this insult to faith and reason.

GERMAN BISHOPS read the following.
Your job is not to help send Souls to Hell for eternity.
Your love of money has to stop.
——————————————————
DOCTRINE of the FAITH - on the reception of Holy Communion:
CCC:  # 1355;  1415;  1451.
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SACRED SCRIPTURE:  1 Cor 11:26-30;  Jesus on Profaning the Holy Mt 7:6.
——————————————————
DOCTRINE of the FAITH - regarding Divorced and Civilly Remarried”
CCC:  # 1650;  1651.
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SACRED SCRIPTURE: 
“Thou shall not commit Adultery” – GOD’s Commandment.
“Thou shall not covet thy Neighbor’s wife” – GOD’s Commandment. 
JESUS about divorce and remarriage –  Mk 10:6-12;  Mt 5:32.
JESUS about adultery, mercy, and required repentance –  “Go and Sin NO more”  Jn 8:11.
————————————————
DOCTRINE of the FAITH regarding Homosexual Acts:
CCC: # 2357;  2358; 2359; & 2396.
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SACRED SCRIPTURE regarding Homosexual Acts:
Gen 19:1-29; Rom 1:24-27; 1 Cor 6:10; 1 Tim 1:10; Jude 1:7.
_____________________________________________________

So soon there will be a Church of Germany along with the Church of England. Papists will be a minority in Germany. The Catholic Church is loosing members by thousands while it refuses to change.

In the former East Germany, 52 percent of inhabitants said they did not believe in any God, and just 8 percent said they believed in a God “personally concerned with every human being,” according to a German newspaper report from 2012.

In Western Germany, some 54 percent of people said they believed in God, but this figure is declining rapidly, indicating that the majority of believers are elderly.
In former West Germany, 36 percent of over-68-year-olds said they believed in God, compared with 18 percent of people younger than 28.
In the former East Germany, the figure was 12 percent for those over 68, while not a single under-28-year-old surveyed said they believed in God.

More than 400 Roman Catholic churches and more than 100 Protestant churches have been closed since 2000. Another 700 Roman Catholic churches are slated to be closed over the next several years. Back in the 1950s one in two German Catholics regularly attended church services. The number has now fallen to just 12.3 percent, according to the German conference of bishops. The Catholic priest shortage is now so acute that that church has started importing new priests from India. According to an article in Der Speigel, 10 percent (about 1,300) of all Catholic priests in Germany are from outside the country—with most of them coming from India.

The above was copied from:
http://newobserveronline.com/christianity-dying-out-in-germany/

Obviously, the German churches are finding it difficult to find “qualified” employees. They’re compromising for business purposes.

Larry Northon, never hesitate to ask another poster for his “official” Church sources. (Preferably including a link).
.
I can’t answer your question, but all of Pope Francis public statements including daily bulletins from the Press Office, should be linked on the home page of the Vatican web site.
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If anything is not in English, you can use “Google Translate”.
(After getting to the google translate site, just copy and paste.)
_____________________________________

From the decree of the First Vatican Council on Papal Infallibility: “ The Holy Spirit was not given to the Roman Pontiffs so that they might disclose (patefacerent) new doctrine, but so that they might guard and set forth (exponerent) the Deposit of Faith handed down from the Apostles.”

“The moral stands of the Church are compromising Her mission.” (A statement alleged to have been made by Pope Francis in 2013.) Although several Internet bloggers are gratuitously claiming the pope said this on an unspecified date in 2013, before an unknown audience under unstated circumstances, I can find no authoritative source on the net—just blog writings, and not very many at that. I don’t remember hearing this before. Let’s see some evidence that goes beyond just repeating the words of other bloggers: a news account? A Holy See document? When did Francis say this, to whom did he say it, where, and under what circumstances?

The two most important books in the Catholic Faith are:
1) a Catholic Bible;
2) the “Catechism of the Catholic Church, second edition” (of 1997; dark green cover in the USA) - which contains the Doctrine of the Catholic Faith in entirety.
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Reading these will educate anyone to the TRUTH, and give them the ability to discern which Clergy are Faithful and which Clergy are wolves in sheep’s clothing.
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Clearly many German Bishops (and some others) - violate the ‘Doctrine of the Faith’ - and are wolves in sheep’s clothing.
And by using Church definitions in CCC # 2089, they are Heretics and Schismatics.
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Rome is not powerless.
The Pope by reason of his office as Vicar of Christ, and as pastor of the entire Church has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power which he can always exercise unhindered. (CCC 882).
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Pray that the Pope uses his authority to correct, and if necessary discipline, high ranking Clergy who publically violate the ‘Doctrine of the Faith’, cause scandal, and lead souls to Hell.
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Ah, yes.  The German bishops and the Bishop of Rome are not far apart. 
The Vatican silence speaks volumes to that.
But whisper ‘tradition’ or ‘mea culpa’ to PF and the hammer comes down, immediately.
The enemies of Christ continue to smile at this pontiff.

Pope Frances agrees with the German bishops.

As the subsidiary thundering verbal waves,
From the episcopate of the Nord-See ecclesiastically,
At the mouth of the river does churn
Undercurrents of immorality and morality marriage blend,
As high tide back-flow contaminates the fruits of the Rhine’s mind,
With foaming non-guilt suds of brine of geld does blind;
Try and try to drag down many
From Mt Sinai faithful heights.
In constant thrashing, bullying waves tirelessly trying to deteriorate,
To erode the foundation rock of Petrine obedience orthodoxy’s might.
The two headed dragon with capped red teeth and claws,
Now in media flight
Is embellished with exciting ornaments
Of wanting redefining novelties outright.
So the deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons
Darken the skies as predatory gulls.
The soul of man is desperately swimming
In the sea as deep as the abyss of skulls,
Through the progressive vortex culture bile of spin,
Struggling soul swimming toward life’s eternal bliss
With a longing heart to board the only full-sail ship,
Of many sailing in this confusing mist.
This single vessel with a bright light of hope within
Brighter than the Bethlehem star,
Appearing closer more than far,
IHS Remnant, barque of Petrine
In these dark desperate times amidst
The towering verbal waves raise high
As mounts of floating bodies in a flaming sea of blood
Of those that kissed the sea of deceit
In open glee, as their true love.
A maiden’s hand reaches out to the swimming soul with a beaded cord
With anchor cross to lift him on board.
He is raised out of the water of the spiritual warfare engaged,
The essences of holy sweet mystical incense engulfs the barque in praise,
He crawls to a dry comfortable corner
Hanging on to the very Breath of Life,
Paralyzed politically in fright more than skin deep,
To ride out the tempest storm’s plight.
The howling raging gales of arrogance whip the sails outright,
As it tries in deception to wash many overboard in this darkest of nights.
A distress crying cry,
‘Is the captain asleep, for we are going down for sure?’
‘Wake him, for we need to know what he has to say straightaway.’
O, prayers and fasting so needed
As the Blessed Mother cries a river,
For a sea of peace to engulf the Holy See of Episcopal Seas.

Doubtless the statement issued by the German episcopate will meet with silence by the Vatican. It will be tolerated thus supporting to the interminable bitching, whining and complaining that has now emerged as a full scale heresy in the pontificate of Francis I. With an opportunity for every single cleric in the United States to publicly proclaim their opposition to Kasper’s lies and the Teutonic narcissism of the German hierarchy, less than a thousand priests and only four bishops of the United States have taken the opportunity to stand by the Magisterium (www.credopriests.org.) The Germans however have no reservations about spilling their bile across the world. They have no fear of rebuke. Why? Because the last conclave managed to enlist the cooperation of a heterodox bishop who is willing to do the dirty work of clerics who one would have difficulty calling Christian, let alone Roman Catholic. Why do they stay when there is a range of protestant sects where they would find comfort and a salary? Despite their belligerence, they are duplicitous cowards. The Barque of Peter has run aground and the crew has hit the life boats before the lowly third-class passengers can even find our way to a porthole.

For a Pope who talks about anything and everything, where is the Pope? Silence in the face of evilness is evilness, is it not? So why not even a peep out of the Pope towards one of his own? Not even a mild admonishment to these German apostates.

Even if it were true, that The Consecration was done as Our Lady requested, why then, would the bishops continue to allow those who profess to be Catholic, but deny that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage, to present themselves to receive The Holy Eucharist, unless they desired that The Catholic Church become a Big Tent, where those who proclaim that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage, and those who deny that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage, can both be, in essence, Catholic.

In order to be Catholic, we must remain in communion with Christ and His Church.

There Is only One Word of God, Our Savior, Jesus The Christ, thus there can only be One Spirit of Perfect Love Between The Father, and The Son, Who Proceeds from both The Father and The Son, in the ordered, Communion of Perfect Love that Is The Blessed Trinity.

Related data point:

I was in Europe last fall, and attended Mass in several European countries, including Germany and Italy. In Germany, I actually had to walk 45 minutes to attend a Polish-language mass, because the German-languages masses were inconvenient—I lived in a neighborhood where there was a church, but it celebrated Mass only once a month. Belgium was similar.

In Italy, I attended Mass in three difference cities; in the one where I spent the most time, I would walk past four functional churches daily. Not only did they offer daily Mass (as opposed to monthly Mass), but the parish I attended routinely offered a well-attended daily Vespers. A cousin of mine in a different city mentioned that her parish likewise offered Vespers. It was the same in every parish I visited, whether daily or Sunday: reasonably full churches (certainly more than halfway), strong and vibrant singing, etc.—Oh, and contra the drumbeat coming from the Catholic left, most Catholic at these masses knelt during the consecration of the Eucharist. (Not all, though, but many of these were aged, and in any case no one made a point of scolding either group.)

I sometimes wonder if the clergy of other countries even know what Vespers is. It’s hard not to conclude that the goal of Germany’s bishops is to empty churches not merely in their dioceses, but in the world at large.

To answer your question, Rome will not hold the German bishops accountable for their heretical stands. Remember that the present Bishop of Rome considers the heretic, Walter Kasper, to have done ‘serene theology on his knees’.  This is the mindset of the dissenters in the upcoming October synod, which is not really about the family at all, but rather an attempt to change Church teaching and practice on the moral issues of adultery and homosexuality.  In 2013 it was the newly -elected Francis who said that ‘The moral stands of the Church are compromising Her mission.’  This is a direct, frontal attack on the essence of the Catholic Church, not to mention a false dichotomy.  We have an apostate pope who has recently allied the Catholic Church with the sustainable development goals of the U. N.  Those goals include contraception, abortion and sterilization.  We have a pope who is contradicting the clear teachings of Pope John Paul 11 on the heresy of liberation theology—clearly Marxist ideology in religious garb.  Bergoglio has co-opted the mercy of God to push through the very same things the German bishops are stating openly.  Just watch what the ‘missionaries of mercy’ will effect.  Why would you think that this present pope would make the German bishops accountable for their heretical stands when he himself is quite obviously the driving force for the same things? 

I am not a theologian, but these Bishops are not just voicing an opinion, then are throwing themselves off of the temple and saying God “catch us”.  It isn’t worldly power they should be concerned with.  We should all pray.

I think that the Holy Father should immediately ask the two thirds of the German Bishops who voted in favor of allowing people who have attempted a second marriage without first applying for and receiving a declaration of nullity, as will as those who favor same sex unions, to immediately submit their resignations to the Holy See.  The Holy Father should then appoint orthodox men as Bishops in their places.

German churches are sitting on a heaping pile of money compared to the Vatican, the result of an odd government arrangement.
Should we be worried?

It would not surprise in the least that those in the church hierarchy who are trying to “modify” church teaching on these matters have, for example, a close relative who is living in a sodomite relationship or a close relative who is divorced/remarried outside the church. In other words they are trying to change church teaching and or practice so that it reflects positively on the situation of a close relative, or some other person who they have known for a long time. 
These people are essentially mocking God and are on an ego trip of insane proportions.
On matters of faith and morals, the teachings of the church cannot change. Vatican 2 did not change dogma one single iota and this upcoming Synod won’t either. But when the impression is given that church teaching has changed, then uninformed souls are led astray. Therein lies the true tragedy.
All this attention given to homosexuals and the divorced/remarried, if it is to be given, should emphasize repentance and the avoidance of sin. That is the only sound catholic way to deal with these folks. We are supposed to admonish sinners, not applaud them.

@James, didn’t you get the Memo, the Catholic Church has moved beyond Christ. Seriously, from what I have read of Catholic Thinker’s comments, I doubt he is actually a Catholic. Obviously, if one does not believe in a core teachings of a religion, it would be silly to say your are part of that religion. Religion is 100% about belief, so what is the point.

What I am getting at is why would someone get on a Catholic Blog to try to tear down Catholic beliefs? You are either a protestant trying to ‘win’ converts, or you are in line with Satan and are trying to destroy the faith the followers of Christ.

CatholicThinker

The who are people who take the Church teaching on marriage and the family seriously. Since you advocate the German position on things, what is your response to the words of Christ on marriage? It’s pretty cut and dry and doesn’t support the un-Catholic position taken by the German Bishops.

Who are the people that are critical of the German bishops that Mr. Pentin writes about in his opening sentence?  Mr. Pentin and a bunch of reactionary people on the right? Has a poll been taken among US Catholics?  I would wager that the great majority of Catholics here would welcome the changes the German Bishops are proposing.

I think Jennifer is on the right track.  The synod is unlikely to do much regarding the sacraments, but it will probably emphasize roles that those in irregular marriages can still play in parish life, in the diocese, and in Catholic schools, hospitals, and charities.  In other words, strictly speaking, it will be much ado about nothing, though the usual suspects will claim that “Francis is teaching”, perhaps through charades, that marriage as the Church has always understood it does not exist; that sin does not exist; and that the sacraments do not exist.

Will,

So what of the words of Christ on Marriage, can we just jettison those then?

Rome will do nothing as she gets a big slice of GermChurch’s “Kirchensteuer” or church tax, which runs into billions every year.

Thank you, Edward Pentin. Great article.  The Pope and Rome need to step up to the plate and stop allowing all the craziness that adds to the confusion.  I continue to pray for the Church hierarchy and for all the misled sheep.  Thank you, Lord, for laypeople who are willing to speak the truth…

I agree with what the Bishops of Germany are doing and happy that Rome has not responded as of yet. Dogma should be seen as evolving within the life of the Church through its practical approach in pastoral practice of the Church. I think when the Synod is over we will see the necessary changes.

I also anticipate some serious marriage building reforms coming out of the synod.

Posted by James on Friday, May 8, 2015 2:59 PM (EDT):

Question for Thomas and Stuart:

What about Jesus Christ’s very clear words on the indissolubility of marriage and adultery?”
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It’s clear as a bell. One can find other text in scripture that may be hard to interpret, but in no way what Christ said about marriage is unclear.
I think folks rationalize whatever it takes when attempting to gain what they want.And we do this not only to convince others, but to convince ourselves as well.Deep down we know it’s dishonesty.

Disagreements are not bad; neither is conflict.  The New Testament account of the Council of Jerusalem shows us how to handle conflict in a God-honoring way.

But everyone calling himself/herself a “Christian” needs to go back to the source of our beliefs, and like it or not folks, the canon of Scripture has the most reliable and detailed set of instructions for The Church today.

God is the same yesterday, today and forever.  His word is the same.  There is no such thing as God having to modernize Himself to fit into the year 2015.  Morals are morals.

And the Synod Leaders need to find wisdom in God’s word (yes, the Bible) and not look to each other for more bright ideas.

The German bishops are wrong.  Rome needs to lead.  We all need to humble ourselves before a holy God (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) and repent.

It’s time all Christians got on the same page, and we find it in God’s word.  Anyone not reading the Bible is simply lazy.  It’s a convenient excuse to keep thinking lay people are forbidden from reading the Bible.

Now if under outside state persecution, it’s different.  But in a free nation?  No excuse.  The Holy Spirit awaits us Christians, in His word.  Let’s all get on the same page, literally.  Rome, the Synod leaders and the German bishops would have an easier go of it, and lead better, if they did that too.  Our God is sovereign and He governs everything.

It seems Luther is again alive and well in Germany.  Is working on a new reformation? What will the new church be called?
I pray for these Bishops and clergy.  They are leading the flock astray and our God does not take the loss of His souls lightly.  They are following the Prince of this world but they will be judged severely in the next

Stuart Kenny, really!?! really!?! you’re comments just make me want to face palm. Where did you learn the faith from? Seriously.

The rest of you, stop hyperventilating, our church is founded on Christ. We’re safe. The church is safe. The truth doesn’t change. This is just an opportunity for us to grow and to develop our understanding of the truth already revealed. It’s what we do when faced with heresy. It’s been the way she’s survived for 2000+ years. Relax. Take in the show. It’s amazing to watch these most brilliant minds the Lord has put in our charge.

The more likely outcome from the enviro-encyclical and the upcoming synod? The encyclical will cover human ecology, which is a really good thing. And the synod will look to implementing some older form/ process of penance for those outside the norms, while still maintaining restrictions on reception of the Eucharist.

Question for Thomas and Stuart:

What about Jesus Christ’s very clear words on the indissolubility of marriage and adultery? We should just ignore those, he didn’t really mean it?

Yes, Thomas Flood, differences have existed from the start of the Church, but in the differences between St Peter and St Paul, St Peter was admonished for NOT following the rules he himself setup, in this case we have bishops directly promoting heresy against the very words of Jesus Christ and St Paul in the Bible, teachings at the core of our faith for nearly 2000 years.

This current ‘difference’ is more akin to the great heresies against the Church such as that of the Arians, Calvin, and Luther. Truth is truth, the Church can not teach truth and practice falsehood at the same time. As a child will grow up to follow the example of a parent rather than the words the parent taught them, the leaders of the human leaders of the Church have in effect ignored the sins of adultery and sodomy for several decades and that is now costing the souls of millions.

The Holy Spirit will be in attendance at the Synod in October, as He is every day in our Church that has been administered by men that have brought us: The separation of Christian worship and the Protestant Revolution, the decision not to teach Sacred Scripture to the Catholic membership, a perpetuation of leadership by creating bishops within the church that are beholding to their friends and thereby rendered somewhat ineffective, the clergy sex scandal and all of its ramifications. We NEED the Synod and the presence of the Holy Spirit to guide the Church on a path different than the one that has been taken to lead us to our present position. God’s plan for His Church is unity and I believe that we would do well to permit a discussion of the problems produce changes in thought and practice. Don’t forget that the first problem was concerning different positions on circumcision by St. Peter and St. Paul. Differences of opinion have been operating forever in our Church.  Let us embrace our church,each other, and follow the guidance of those that we have as leaders.

How can any of this be good for our Church!  This does speak not merely of a strong opinion, but it speaks of separation of thinking that is in opposition to what we have not only held dear to us all as Catholics, but has sustained us in a consistent policy.  And as with other writers herein, where is our Holy Father on it!

If Rome’s leadership is powerless to influence what is happening in the church in Germany, then it ought to admit that its leadership is powerless everywhere, and close up shop.  No more saint-making.  If Rome does not have control over German Catholics, they do not have control over what is happening in Heaven.

If I were pope for one day, I’d:
Insist that every diocese in the world do a study on the New Testament letters of First and Second Peter, the first pope.

What Peter wrote would be taught everywhere: from the pulpits at Sunday Mass, to diocesan newspapers, in Catholic schools and universities, equipping parents to teach their own children its truths, at home. 

Any bishop, cardinal, pastor, priest, deacon that does not accept the directives written in the two letters that Peter wrote, would be removed from the ministerial priesthood, and placed in the pews with the rest of us.

If Rome is powerless to lead the Catholic faithful in Germany, then we no longer have the likes of Saints Peter (or Paul) in leadership in our church.  That is cause for great concern.  Matters of morality have eternal consequences.  That point is all over the Old Testament, as well as in the New.  Just read it.

Holding one’s breath waiting for the Vatican to “do something” is a recipe for quick disappointment. We of the laity must pray for, and avail ourselves of, the courage to stand up—literally, in the pews, if necessary as a last resort—and refute the errors of ignorant and apostate clergy. If, for whatever reason, we choose not to, then we deserve what we get.

Sorry, earlier I said ‘Because of a lack of catechisis coming from the Church in every area, people make up their own truth.’ when I should have said ‘Because of a lack of catechisis coming from the Priests and Bishops in every area…’ because the Church has always had the truth in the Catechism but we just never get it from her current leaders. We rarely if ever hear it from the pulpit.

Sadly our parishes exist based on the donations of the parishioners, and when the priest upsets the sinners out there by telling the truth, rather than accepting the help, they withhold their donations, leave the Church, whatever. I have seen strong preaching from the pulpit close down Catholic schools and even Churches. This is because some wealthy parishioners with deep pockets who like to play God, didn’t like the strong orthodox truths coming from the pulpit and decided to get the message across. I think this is really what is behind much of the lack of strong teaching today.

If you don’t believe me, look at Archbishop Cordelione in San Francisco. Where is the Pope and the USCCB backing up the Archbishop. If they said something, it would all end and the diocese of San Francisco could move forward in the much needed work of reform and repentance. But if the leaders of the Church don’t stand together and stand up for God, the Church will become irrelevant just like the Church of England has become.

The problem is that since Vatican II, in an effort to draw Protestants into the Church and to keep people in the pews, the truth stopped being preached. Instead syrupy ‘love your neighbor’ (be nice) sermons are preached week after week. Thus the secular culture through the media has much more influence over Catholic thinking than God. Now being nice trumps God. It is ‘nice’ to let adulterers receive Jesus Christ against God’s desires. It is ‘nice’ to stop condemning sinful behavior. It is ‘nice’ to be accepting of sodomy despite the fact that God hates it and wants their repentance.  Because of a lack of catechisis coming from the Church in every area, people make up their own truth. In order to follow Christ, we MUST be meek and look for truth from the Catholic Church alone, not sinful imperfect Bishops and priests. Yet we have not been taught this most important fact that Jesus himself taught.

My answer to your question is that we have a very weak and public relations driven pope. Pope Francis thinks that the prevailing winds in all western industrial countries is blowing from the progressive/liberal/libertine side. He thinks that if he appeases them, they will love the Catholic Church because they (the libertines) love him. Hence, his rude attacks on traditionalists. Hence, his emphasis of a leftist economic interpretation of catholic social teaching. Hence, his upcoming and heralded encyclical on climate change. An encyclical on “climate change”??? As Francis Cardinal Spellman supposedly said about Pope Rancali; “That man is no pope. He should be selling bananas”.

Francis handpicked Cardinal Marx into his Council of 9. Marx is the one leading the rebellion. It is therefore the case that Francis agrees, otherwise, Marx won’t be doing what he is doing.

Have the German Bishops done anything wrong? By what authority do you determine whether these bishops have done something wrong? If you assume an authority different from bishops and the Pope, then you are not a Catholic. If these bishops and the Pope think that this is what the Holy Spirit is calling them to do, then they are right, and you are wrong. If you want to be Catholic, you must give assent to their decisions. If you are trusting an authority outside the bishops, then you are a Protestant.

I wish Benedict were in charge.

“In almost all the dioceses of Germany, sacramental absolution and Holy Communion are given to the divorced and remarried;“If they are truly sorry and live as brother & sister is this not the teaching of the Catholic Church that they can be forgiven and receive Holy Communion?Rather a sweeping statement without giving ALL the facts!The reason I ask is because 43 years ago a couple whose two children I taught for 1st Holy Communion were in this position and asked what they could do.They were willing to live as brother and sister for the sake of their souls and their children.The RAF Priest agreed this was the right course.That was in the UK back then.

The question raised at the end of the article is easily answered. Team Francis agrees with the Germans.

We should pray for those bishops in Germany (and elsewhere, of course) who have the courage to uphold the teachings of our faith.

Fatima, true, or incredible coincidence?

What we are witnessing in The Catholic Church, is not polarization, but apostasy. Through a false ecumenism, those who profess to be Catholic have been permitted to debate with others who profess to be Catholic, about that which a Catholic must believe with Divine and Catholic Faith, making it appear as if the Truth of our Catholic Faith is up for debate.

Although The Church has the authority to determine whether a marriage is valid or not, not every person who professes to be Catholic, professes that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage.
If Rome appears powerless, the question is why? What is going on in The Vatican these days? No doubt, a powerful Lobby exists.
Where are our Faithful Bishops calling out the apostates?

Fatima, true,

http://www.catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=24843

With all due respect, denying that God Is The Author of Love, Life, and Marriage is apostasy, not heresy.

lop is correct. The Church will rise again, but first has to fight this war which obviously will not be just confined to the church in Germany. The fifth column {very accurate terminology} is going to be unleashed most everywhere. Confusion will reign supreme. At least there will be no more fence straddling. Catholics are going to have to choose which side of the fence they are on.
Let’s face facts, this has been building for at least 50 years and even before that to a lesser degree, so it is best to have this out in the open now, and be done with it once and for all, or at least for many centuries thereafter.

In war terms, we can say that the Church is into a siege and that there is a very strong fifth column into the Church. As in any other war you have to choose your battles and give up some territories. I do not see an easy way out.